Southgate in or out

[oneforthebristolcity]

The Croatia manager is obviously crap and should be sacked immediately, before the end of the game preferably

Why should the Croatian manager be sacked? Reached further than England as did they 4 years ago.. Even they pass the ball about better than us..
Argentina are in a different league to us, they’ve grown as the tournament progressed..

 

[invermeremike]

On the pitch today you had the privilege to see the best player in the world and a team that has more national pride in wearing their shirt than we could find on the Isle of Wight. Getting back to the intent of the thread I think Southgate is yet another dull manager who plays the game in the most boring way possible, but having said that he has taken us the quarters and final in his last two major competitions. Is that enough to keep his job, as I know there are many versions of the plot, and the biggest question for me is whether we can find a boss that could make us use our many talented players to actually achieve something special? Personally I like Southgate as a person and his visits to Ashton Gate usually ended in victory for Middlesbrough and that clearly indicated footballing nous and expertise.

The rest of the world has caught up with England, and many other nations for that matter, and thinking that we have the right to think we will walk it is nonsense in the first degree. Our style of play is so outdated and boring and my thought before the World Cup was that we would not go beyond the quarter finals if we played our usual tippy tappy football across and backwards, which usually means we play the vast majority of the match barely threatening their penalty area. Croatia didn't know what hit them today and even the fabulous Modric couldn't change the direction of the match despite being one of the major forces at the age of 37. Average is the best description I have for English national football and unless we take the game by the balls and squeeze some true undying effort from the wealth of talent we have available we will stay where we are, or even fall lower (starting to sound familiar?). Perhaps it's all about the money, vehicles and the mansions back home.

 

[oneforthebristolcity]

Argentina are the best team imo, I couldn’t see us getting anywhere near them, even if we’d managed to beat France, and won the semis tbf.

You wouldn't have said that after their first game v Saudi.....they've grown into this tournament, adapted style of their play to get the best from the players.. Not sure we have the manager nor the players to have done the same.. I actually think it's still down to grass roots why our players don't seem so comfortable on the ball....we have this way of passing it around our half of the pitch, sideways with no clue what to do next.. That's coaching IMO..

 

[Cliftonville]

You wouldn't have said that after their first game v Saudi.....they've grown into this tournament, adapted style of their play to get the best from the players.. Not sure we have the manager nor the players to have done the same.. I actually think it's still down to grass roots why our players don't seem so comfortable on the ball....we have this way of passing it around our half of the pitch, sideways with no clue what to do next.. That's coaching IMO..

It is the coaching. Look who John Stone and Kyle Walker play for. Henderson? The players do have a clue and that passing is a reflection of Mr Southgate. Its part of bringing a relative success, but the team doesn't have enough under Mr Southgate to rise to the next level.

England has and is producing players that are comfortable on the ball. The existing England DNA and acedemy system now in place will produce more due to intent and focus. England now has a coaching culture it did not have ten and twenty years ago that is producing technical players.

 

[oneforthebristolcity]

It is the coaching. Look who John Stone and Kyle Walker play for. Henderson? The players do have a clue and that passing is a reflection of Mr Southgate. Its part of bringing a relative success, but the team doesn't have enough under Mr Southgate to rise to the next level.

England has and is producing players that are comfortable on the ball. The existing England DNA and acedemy system now in place will produce more due to intent and focus. England now has a coaching culture it did not have ten and twenty years ago that is producing technical players.

I agree, by right we should have players comfortable with the ball, they play week in week out at Premiership clubs which have either coaches or players around influencing them....which says to me that the dross we see when in an England shirt, tapping cluelessly sideways must come from the England coach, these must be his instructions......
Like I said earlier, I think Southgate has a good relationship with the players but not the Knowhow or technical ability to take us onto the next level, either he needs help or needs to be moved on..

 

[AshtonRed]

I agree, by right we should have players comfortable with the ball, they play week in week out at Premiership clubs which have either coaches or players around influencing them....which says to me that the dross we see when in an England shirt, tapping cluelessly sideways must come from the England coach, these must be his instructions......
Like I said earlier, I think Southgate has a good relationship with the players but not the Knowhow or technical ability to take us onto the next level, either he needs help or needs to be moved on..

I’ve no objection to him going as long as we don’t throw out the baby with the bath water, imo we’ve come a long way under his stewardship, we need to be careful not to bring someone else in only to lose all that and return to how we were before. Listen to many ex international’s who will tell you how bad it was in their day.

 

[realred1952]

continuity is the name of the game ..I would have said after last season NP UNDERACHIEVED DOESNT LOOK LIKE HE IS THE RIGHT SHAPE PEG! .....
At the moment the wider picture with at least 14 teams able to make top 6 or bottom 3 then stick. We do need a win this weekend, and see how the league sits at the end of the first half.
In second half of season game 24 to game 28 [ inclusive ] I still work on 2 wins / losses ... then 3 wins 3 losses +1point to assess for top 6 and bottom 3 .....
CURRENTLY BCFC is out of reach of top 6 and in the catchment of the relegation Zone.
GS is in the top catchment but miles from the bottom ... so needs to be encouraged as does NP

 

[Cliftonville]

I agree, by right we should have players comfortable with the ball, they play week in week out at Premiership clubs which have either coaches or players around influencing them....which says to me that the dross we see when in an England shirt, tapping cluelessly sideways must come from the England coach, these must be his instructions......
Like I said earlier, I think Southgate has a good relationship with the players but not the Knowhow or technical ability to take us onto the next level, either he needs help or needs to be moved on..

Its not clueless is it? All passing and Mr Southgates conservative passing intent has a purpose.

 

[Red Robin]

For me has has improved Englands standing but has taken the current squad as far as he can. Hence his time in deciding in staying or going.
England have fluttered with doing something but always fall away when it matters.
Just like Bristol City

 

[Red Robin]

Brendon Rodger’s seems to be touted by the media for England job.
What’s your take on this rumour.

 

[realred1952]

For me has has improved Englands standing but has taken the current squad as far as he can.

I can agree with this statement, and now is the next part.... Part 3 ... GS has now determined a squad of about 16 players that will likely make the next world cup, as a number will be 4 years older and maybe past their prime. so in 2 years is the next meaningful competition GS now needs to up the ante to prepare for 2 years time. Identify a few more youngsters ready for 2026 ans ease them in for 2024.
Part 4 for Gareth will be world cup 2026.

 

[oneforthebristolcity]

Its not clueless is it? All passing and Mr Southgates conservative passing intent has a purpose.

Into boring the opposition to surrender!!.. At times it certainly looks clueless..
Even Morocco's passing tonight showed more intent than what England normally dishes up..

 

[Redprintt]

1FOR
I agree about Morocco's passing intent.

So different from Southgate's approach. He's going to stay, no Prem club will touch him,

 

[Cliftonville]

Into boring the opposition to surrender!!.. At times it certainly looks clueless..
Even Morocco's passing tonight showed more intent than what England normally dishes up..

A feature of Englands football is retention of the ball at the back, techy speak its the safe possession zone, and this base of possession creates opportunity by moving the opposition around until the team can break a line. Thats a clear intent times clear principle, and principles of using width and depth times patience. It created massive possession %, very high passing accuracy = Lots of opportunity = England in this tournament scored heavily and the team made the QF. Clueless with resespect would not do that. Englands football there with respect makes a bold intent.

Our view of the football being boring, and I find England watching achingly dull, too methodical and conservative doesn't change what the team does and achieved.

 

[wizered]

Terrible thing to admit but do you know I couldn't care less about England and the world cup, I don't miss it, I couldn't care less about latest results, it's just become a complete bore, Southgate can keep his bloody job he has not achieved any honours yet, it's not going to stop the Solomon Islands from sinking or help the nurses or railway workers, Megan and Harry are still phaffing about, the FA, FIFA and EUFA treat football like a cash cow, it's all about money, French young football fan killed, Argentina mob shouting about the Falklands, Qatar bribery scandals it's not worth it.

I'll stick to Bristol City and Championship results sad boring old sod that I am.

 

[Reliant Robin TC2]

A feature of Englands football is retention of the ball at the back, techy speak its the safe possession zone, and this base of possession creates opportunity by moving the opposition around until the team can break a line. Thats a clear intent times clear principle, and principles of using width and depth times patience. It created massive possession %, very high passing accuracy = Lots of opportunity = England in this tournament scored heavily and the team made the QF. Clueless with resespect would not do that. Englands football there with respect makes a bold intent.

Our view of the football being boring, and I find England watching achingly dull, too methodical and conservative doesn't change what the team does and achieved.

I really can understand the concept, but being brought up in an era of "blood and thunder" football, it is, as you say, achingly dull at times!

 

[oneforthebristolcity]

A feature of Englands football is retention of the ball at the back, techy speak its the safe possession zone, and this base of possession creates opportunity by moving the opposition around until the team can break a line. Thats a clear intent times clear principle, and principles of using width and depth times patience. It created massive possession %, very high passing accuracy = Lots of opportunity = England in this tournament scored heavily and the team made the QF. Clueless with resespect would not do that. Englands football there with respect makes a bold intent.

Our view of the football being boring, and I find England watching achingly dull, too methodical and conservative doesn't change what the team does and achieved.

It’s the only team within the World Cup that seems to tap tap around the safe possession zone as you say, quite often going nowhere even to the point sometimes where it gets hit long going nowhere.. to me it highlights that those players aren’t comfortable with the ball unless there is yards of space around them.. it might well be a recognised tactic but it looks clueless and quite often gets us nowhere.. most other teams can tap pass in close quarters, surly that creates more space to run into.. for me we also struggle with lack of movement into spaces.. maybe that’s a tactic too.. to me it just looks clueless..
call me old fashioned but with the elk of players we have at our disposal, the likes of Venables & Hoddle would have utilised their skills and abilities so much better..

 

[Red Robin]

Terrible thing to admit but do you know I couldn't care less about England and the world cup, I don't miss it, I couldn't care less about latest results, it's just become a complete bore, Southgate can keep his bloody job he has not achieved any honours yet, it's not going to stop the Solomon Islands from sinking or help the nurses or railway workers, Megan and Harry are still phaffing about, the FA, FIFA and EUFA treat football like a cash cow, it's all about money, French young football fan killed, Argentina mob shouting about the Falklands, Qatar bribery scandals it's not worth it.

I'll stick to Bristol City and Championship results sad boring old sod that I am.

Same here buddy Bristol City before England for me

 

[Redprintt]

Thats a clear intent times clear principle, and principles of using width and depth times patience.

You are talking about tactics.
Intent is totally different.
Intent is how you apply those principles.

 

[Cliftonville]

It’s the only team within the World Cup that seems to tap tap around the safe possession zone as you say, quite often going nowhere even to the point sometimes where it gets hit long going nowhere..

You dont watch Spain! Numerous teams built from the back. England dont hit many long balls except Pickford who plays to the wide players.

I really can understand the concept, but being brought up in an era of "blood and thunder" football, it is, as you say, achingly dull at times!

The squad has the capacity to be more attacking in the second and last thirds, its had that capacity for a significant period. Another Manager can elevate Englands football futher to winners.