LJ out (or not)

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In or out ?

  • In

    Votes: 22 14.4%

  • Out

    Votes: 97 63.4%

  • Still undecided

    Votes: 34 22.2%
  • Total voters
    153
Confucius said:
Mate he spent over 4 years at Bristol City and done nowt
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So? Apart from obvious examples like Neil Warnock, managers rarely achieve much at more than one club. Only Tom Watson, Herbert Chapman, Brian Clough, and Kenny Dalglish have been Champions of England at more than one club. What did our best manager most recently, Peter Reid, win at any of his other clubs? What did Bill Shankly win at any of this other clubs? What he's done elsewhere is irrelevant.
 
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The Norton Cat said:
So? Apart from obvious examples like Neil Warnock, managers rarely achieve much at more than one club. Only Tom Watson, Herbert Chapman, Brian Clough, and Kenny Dalglish have been Champions of England at more than one club. What did our best manager most recently, Peter Reid, win at any of his other clubs? What did Bill Shankly win at any of this other clubs? What he's done elsewhere is irrelevant.
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yet mate managers that don't win games don't get hired,and Warnock stands out as he is a winner and motivator, which he has proved and has taken teams to the prem, only to be dumped for a manager who has a better win ratio with more pull factor, So in this league we would walk it
 
samwise_new said:
personally i feel ipswich was more luck than management because had they been able to finish they would have had at least a 2 goal lead and the way we are playing i doubt we would have even salvaged a draw, shrewsbury was just downright bad choices by the manager as we had them on the back foot and i am fairly sure we were all just sitting waiting for the next goal to go in, never expecting it to be against us and realistically from then on they were looking hungrier and more likely to grab a winner.

we have stopped the rot i guess (my positive thought for the week) but not by playing our way out of it, need to see a win and a performance lift at cheltenham...as i said elsewhere, normally a home win and away draw we would accept happily but the nature of those points has not filled us with confidence.
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This.......
 
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Makemstine Roger said:
yet mate managers that don't win games don't get hired,and Warnock stands out as he is a winner and motivator, which he has proved and has taken teams to the prem, only to be dumped for a manager who has a better win ratio with more pull factor, So in this league we would walk it
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So we screw up our long term plans to bring in a 72 year old who's only ever going to be a short term solution? Even if we did get promoted under him we'd be immediately back in the same boat we were before KLD arrived.
 
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The Norton Cat said:
So? Apart from obvious examples like Neil Warnock, managers rarely achieve much at more than one club. Only Tom Watson, Herbert Chapman, Brian Clough, and Kenny Dalglish have been Champions of England at more than one club. What did our best manager most recently, Peter Reid, win at any of his other clubs? What did Bill Shankly win at any of this other clubs? What he's done elsewhere is irrelevant.
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yes thats right, you go on about a totally different era and ask me "so?" when I've made a pertinent point that he spent 4 years at his last job and never progressed
How the hell can it be irrelevant, are you saying that it doesn't matter what he has done at other clubs? Thats utter bollocks then
 
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The Norton Cat said:
By sacking him we just end up back in the same cycle. Patience is a virtue- its notable that the three most successful managers in English football, Alex Ferguson, George Ramsay, and Arsene Wenger, were all in the posts they're best known for for upwards for 20 years. Famously Ferguson and Ramsay didn't win their first league titles for 6 and 7 years respectively.
Our new set up is designed that the head coach can be replaced easily without disrupting the direction, style, and philosophy of the club. The two most famous exponents of that system are Ajax and Barcelona. However, the two identified progenitors of those systems are Rinus Michels at Ajax and Johan Cruyff at Barcelona (although Michels was there before him obviously). Michels had 6 years in charge of Ajax and Cruyff had 8 years (in two spells; Michels had 6 years in two spells at Barca) at Barcelona to bed those systems in. It all takes time.
We're an underachieving club in an unfashionable part of the country, not dissimilar to many other clubs. We have to do something to make ourselves stand out. This could be it but it has to be done properly. At some point, we have to give a manager time.
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good post, i am sick of the 'managerial merry go round' and would really hope we can stick with one for a decent amount of time.

one problem is society in general, these days people (fans) want and expect it NOW, gone are the days where if you wanted something you saved up and built up to it, also, back in cloughs day managers could be stricter with players but these days they are far too pampered and protected along with having all the 'power' within the game now.

anyone that manages any decent success is usually swapped around between clubs that have cash to throw around, may be a few years ago now but keegan had a 'decent to watch' squad at newcastle and somehow got the england job which showed he had no clue, he could buy a squad but could not get one motivated with the players he had available, the likes of pep will never take a job in our league but would jump into another big club with cash to spend...i would like to see these big name managers actually drop to a club where they have to rely completely on their own managerial skills and not being able to just buy the best players to fit a certain role.

i am all for the 'project' and minimal disruption as long as it does not mean we get a constant stream of similar managers that simply fit the pattern rather than what they have actually done with limited funds.
 
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Defeat to Cambridge and surely he has to go? The current form and PPG based on the last 5-8 matches will see us slip right out of the race and then too much pressure to bounce back.

The past couple of months has shown that we aren't even winning convincingly (Ipswich for example), we are scraping wins. Be amazed if he turns it around before Christmas. Publicly criticizing Stewart feels like he's losing his grip on the dressing room as it's his (LJ) responsibility to play to his (RS) strengths
 
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The Norton Cat said:
So we screw up our long term plans to bring in a 72 year old who's only ever going to be a short term solution? Even if we did get promoted under him we'd be immediately back in the same boat we were before KLD arrived.
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I would rather start 6 months later with the plan, and start in the Championship.
 
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Confucius said:
yes thats right, you go on about a totally different era and ask me "so?" when I've made a pertinent point that he spent 4 years at his last job and never progressed
How the hell can it be irrelevant, are you saying that it doesn't matter what he has done at other clubs? Thats utter bollocks then
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Its irrelevant because circumstances vary from club to club. Expectations, budgets, players, the attitude of the board, the attitude of the fans, as well as a whole array of other things are different from club to club. Success is, therefore, relative. He did progress at Bristol City, he maintained their Championship status, got them to the league Cup semis, and won manager of the month a couple of times.
 
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The Norton Cat said:
The club has been crying out for something like the Speakman set up for years. We've had no direction and fallen behind the rest of the teams we should be on par with. I can't see Warnock working within the set up. I think he'd be a massive backward step in the long term, whether he achieved promotion in the short term or not.
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So you would prefer another season down here rather than a massive backward step in the championship
 
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The Norton Cat said:
Its irrelevant because circumstances vary from club to club. Expectations, budgets, players, the attitude of the board, the attitude of the fans, as well as a whole array of other things are different from club to club. Success is, therefore, relative. He did progress at Bristol City, he maintained their Championship status, got them to the league Cup semis, and won manager of the month a couple of times.
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well of course they do, but to suggest it is irrelevant is still bollocks cos it will be part of the screening process. They will look at his records and take into account any mitigating circumstances, otherwise why does he have a CV?
So we employed someone who left them in 12th place after 4 years, i would have expected a bit more after that time, maybe my standards are higher than others
Phil Parkinson has a few of those manager of the month things
 
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