Transfer Rumours transfer thread fact and fiction

[The Huddlefro]

Just thinking about this. We all wanted a serious clearout. In terms of rating windows:

Good: revamp the CBs and move on one or two forwards/midfielders who are approaching the end of their time here. Think Sissoko and Lamela in particular. Get some sort of senior backup to Kane, probably a loan or older player, because we don’t want to rely on teenagers if the worst happens. Aurier also leaves. This would probably entail 4/5 players leaving. (Toby, Aurier, Dave, Sissoko, Lamela)

Excellent: all the above, also sign a player who can replicate Regulion’s impact but on the right of defence. Move Winks on, sign another pacy forward to start on the right. Sign a top young striker in case Kane leaves, and also make moves to secure a long-term replacement for Lloris. Make a decision on Gio and Tanguy and move player(s) on if necessary, and replace. I think that’s everything. Maybe a CM too, depending on outgoings. And I haven’t even mentioned Dele here.

The ‘Excellent’ scenario is a hell of a lot of movement and would be a huge ask for a club to execute successfully, even without a pandemic, a brand new manager, and a new DoF and back office structure for the football at the club. Sure, in terms of on-pitch impact it would be ideal but it’s nearly double digits of players in and out. That’s massive. We all wanted it but I’m not sure it was ever realistic and might even have done more harm than good to have that much flux in the squad at once.

I think the ‘Good’ scenario is more realistic and is the bare minimum of what I would expect.

 

[remembercolinlee]

Good morning what a lovely day.

The usual complaints during the transfer windows. Business is slow right across the PL, what would you expect in the current world situation? A number of clubs have not made any signings so Spurs are little different. Much easier to make signings if you are Norwich or Brighton than it is for Spurs or Everton for example. We are looking at a much smaller pool of players who will probably require high transfer fees. Surely by now you should get this! Instead of looking forward to a new season with a new manager many seem to live in a world of misery with unrealistic expectations.
I watch football to be entertained if I was as unhappy as some of you appear to be I really would find another sport to follow.

Enjoy your day.

That's harsh imho.

My pet hate is people in charge repeatedly failing to learn from past mistakes.

I watch managers make stupid changes and when you point out why they won't improve things you get called negative. When it fails they refuse to take responsibility and repeatedly chant "we are we we are and can't change the past"
when you try to hold them to account.

I don't think that thinking we could be in a better position now had we made better decisions back in February is unrealistic or miserable.

I watch football to be entertained like you. I read your posts about Southgate managing England and agree with them yet others accuse people with our view as being unnecessarily negative.

 

[PowerSpurs]

We had seven new players last summer and it didn't improve the performances at all. What we need to do is the Good scenario. Bring in three or four players who are clearly better than what we have. Make room for them by selling the ageing players for whatever we can get.
I've never understood why people are worried about using the whole window. It would be crazy to sign players early on and miss out on someone better becoming available later.
As usual I just see Levy understanding this better than most fans and doing the right thing despite its unpopularity. Exactly what I want from our Chairman

 

[remembercolinlee]

On the plus side, Kane leaving rumours appear to have gone quiet

The telegraph were claiming his England team mates were expecting him to refuse to attend pre season training to force a move...obviously no players were named and no actual quotes...but it was real journalism

 

[maggie blanchflower]

Unfortunately for Spurf and about 5 million others, he's not escaped and is still part of the United Kingdom and being governed by a bunch of wrongly, self-satisfied half-wits.

It was meant to be humorous. I love the UK, all of it.

 

[remembercolinlee]

We had seven new players last summer and it didn't improve the performances at all. What we need to do is the Good scenario. Bring in three or four players who are clearly better than what we have. Make room for them by selling the ageing players for whatever we can get.
I've never understood why people are worried about using the whole window. It would be crazy to sign players early on and miss out on someone better becoming available later.
As usual I just see Levy understanding this better than most fans and doing the right thing despite its unpopularity. Exactly what I want from our Chairman

Bringing in 3 or 4 good players wouldn't be sneered at.

Bringing in 3 or 4 players who are not ready to start the season is not a good thing.

We have left things later than necessary.

As for Levy doing the right thing as usual...

1. You yourself have suggested that last summer was a mistake (signing 7 players that did not improve us).

2. Employing JM.

3. Furlough.

4. Not sacking JM in February when it was obvious he had to go.

5. Sacking JM with no replacement lined up.

6. Leaving Mason to manage a cup final against the best team in England with just 6 days notice.

7. Signing us up to the ESL.

8. Waiting 10 weeks to appoint a new manager.

These are all valid criticisms...and are all in a 20 month period.

I get that not everyone agrees with them.

The thing I like about this forum is the different views but I am finding it becoming too polarised. Dialogue is being replaced with diatribe which ain't much fun to be honest.

 

["Thanks for that Brian"]

It was meant to be humorous. I love the UK, all of it.

I got you Maggie, I love all parts of the UK too....well, apart from Wales!

Also only kidding.

I'm off for a week to Ayrshire in September. Mrs B's maternal granny was from there and we're taking her mum to see family. It's very beautiful and I like the Scots...just don't tell Spurf.

 

[remembercolinlee]

It was meant to be humorous. I love the UK, all of it.

You obviously ain't been to Woolwich

 

[The Huddlefro]

We had seven new players last summer and it didn't improve the performances at all. What we need to do is the Good scenario. Bring in three or four players who are clearly better than what we have. Make room for them by selling the ageing players for whatever we can get.
I've never understood why people are worried about using the whole window. It would be crazy to sign players early on and miss out on someone better becoming available later.
As usual I just see Levy understanding this better than most fans and doing the right thing despite its unpopularity. Exactly what I want from our Chairman

I see your point about not jumping too early and of course moving on to, and securing, a second choice player and then circumstances changing and our first choice suddenly being available later in the window would be annoying. But I think there’s a judgement call to be made about the relevant merits of getting a good player in early so they can adapt to living in a new place and doing what the coach wants from them, vs getting in a player who is a little better but arrives after the start of the season and is unsettled and maybe doesn’t get the coach’s demands straight away.

Depends on the gap in quality between the two players and how quickly we think the late arriving player would adapt, ultimately.

 

["Thanks for that Brian"]

You obviously ain't been to Woolwich

I worked there for 8 years.

I love the Thames Tunnel and where the Firepower Museum was (trying desperately not to say the Arsenal). General Gordon Square is very impressive and I love the Thai Tip Mein noodle house by the station.

I didn't like being there after dark.

 

[remembercolinlee]

I worked there for 8 years.

I love the Thames Tunnel and where the Firepower Museum was (trying desperately not to say the Arsenal). General Gordon Square is very impressive and I love the Thai Tip Mein noodle house by the station.

I didn't like being there after dark.

Where did you work mate?

General Gordon Square used to be a druggie hangout but about 10 years ago they put in a huge TV and water feature and it is really a lovely place now.
Watched the world cup games there...was excellent atmosphere no matter who played!

 

[PowerSpurs]

I see your point about not jumping too early and of course moving on to, and securing, a second choice player and then circumstances changing and our first choice suddenly being available later in the window would be annoying. But I think there’s a judgement call to be made about the relevant merits of getting a good player in early so they can adapt to living in a new place and doing what the coach wants from them, vs getting in a player who is a little better but arrives after the start of the season and is unsettled and maybe doesn’t get the coach’s demands straight away.

Depends on the gap in quality between the two players and how quickly we think the late arriving player would adapt, ultimately.

If we sign a properly good player they are going to play upwards of 200 matches. I don't see how them missing three or four matches at the beginning is a big deal at all.

 

[PowerSpurs]

Bringing in 3 or 4 good players wouldn't be sneered at.

Bringing in 3 or 4 players who are not ready to start the season is not a good thing.

We have left things later than necessary.

As for Levy doing the right thing as usual...

1. You yourself have suggested that last summer was a mistake (signing 7 players that did not improve us).

2. Employing JM.

3. Furlough.

4. Not sacking JM in February when it was obvious he had to go.

5. Sacking JM with no replacement lined up.

6. Leaving Mason to manage a cup final against the best team in England with just 6 days notice.

7. Signing us up to the ESL.

8. Waiting 10 weeks to appoint a new manager.

These are all valid criticisms...and are all in a 20 month period.

I get that not everyone agrees with them.

The thing I like about this forum is the different views but I am finding it becoming too polarised. Dialogue is being replaced with diatribe which ain't much fun to be honest.

Most of those mistakes were the inevitable outcome of employing Mourinho. That was a huge mistake. Furlough was corrected in a few days. Everyone made the ESL mistake.
I agree about the polarisation. If you and I have different opinions then the most likely explanation is that both of us are missing something. I look forward to another poster telling us what that is.

 

[Citizen Kane.]

If we sign a properly good player they are going to play upwards of 200 matches. I don't see how them missing three or four matches at the beginning is a big deal at all.

1. Plenty of elite level managers have criticised their clubs bringing in players at the 11th hour. So either Levy knows how to coach a team better than them, or his approach is simply wrong.

2. Perhaps you are right. Perhaps in the grander scheme of things a player joining on deadline day will cost a team no more than 6-8 points over a whole season. If you're a side with mid table aspirations, that margin of error isn't a big deal. You probably throw that many points away anyway in your final few (meaningless) games of the season. But at the other end of the table, 6 pts can be and often is the difference between CL or none, or even winning the league or not. That's a big deal that will directly impact your ability to bring in similar quality in the next window.

3. I cannot for the life of me think of a last minute signing we've made that wasn't already on the cards for weeks beforehand. Tomiyasu is a perfect case in point. Hardly big money, certainly not a marquee signing whatsoever. We've been going round in circles trying to sign him for over 2 weeks now.
Rafa remains the lone piece of empirical evidence supporting your claim that good things come to those who wait. Since then, Levy has been chasing a mythical horizon where lightening apparently strikes as many times as he wants it to.

 

[vimhawk]

I'm off for a week to Ayrshire in September. Mrs B's maternal granny was from there and we're taking her mum to see family. It's very beautiful and I like the Scots...just don't tell Spurf.

Aberdeenshire for me once a year. I have no connection but love it there. Although there is a smaller clan with my surname. I even received a letter from them once offering clan merchandise. Should have told them that my grandfather just some of the first letters of his Polish surname to get something that sounded British.

 

[vimhawk]

3. I cannot for the life of me think of a last minute signing we've made that wasn't already on the cards for weeks beforehand.

VdV, though I agree is the exception.

 

[remembercolinlee]

If we sign a properly good player they are gouing to play upwards of 200 matches. I don't see how them missing three or four matches at the beginning is a big deal at all.

Would disagree tbh.

we dropped 11 points in the first 4 games of the 2008 season (when we only signed strikers in the last days of the window).
We missed out on EL qualification by 2 points that season.

In 2010/11 we dropped 7 points in the first 4 games (signing Gallas, Sandro and VDV late on in the window). We missed out on CL qualification by 2 points iirc.

In 2011/12 we dropped 6 points in our first 4 games (Scott Parker and Adebayor signing late in the window). We missed out on CL football by 2 points.

In 2012/13 we dropped 7 points in the first 4 games (Clinnt Dempsey and Dembele sign late on).
We missed out on the CL by 1 point.

4 seasons.
1 cost us a EL place (worth a couple of million).
3 cost us CL places (worth a minimum of £30m per season).

That's approx £90m plus lost.

But it also cost us the chance to keep Modric and Bale. And it also cost us the chance of signing better quality players who wanted CL football.

 

[PowerSpurs]

1. Plenty of elite level managers have criticised their clubs bringing in players at the 11th hour. So either Levy knows how to coach a team better than them, or his approach is simply wrong.

2. Perhaps you are right. Perhaps in the grander scheme of things a player joining on deadline day will cost a team no more than 6-8 points over a whole season. If you're a side with mid table aspirations, that margin of error isn't a big deal. You probably throw that many points away anyway in your final few (meaningless) games of the season. But at the other end of the table, 6 pts can be and often is the difference between CL or none, or even winning the league or not. That's a big deal that will directly impact your ability to bring in similar quality in the next window.

3. I cannot for the life of me think of a last minute signing we've made that wasn't already on the cards for weeks beforehand. Tomiyasu is a perfect case in point. Hardly big money, certainly not a marquee signing whatsoever. We've been going round in circles trying to sign him for over 2 weeks now.
Rafa remains the lone piece of empirical evidence supporting your claim that good things come to those who wait. Since then, Levy has been chasing a mythical horizon where lightening apparently strikes as many times as he wants it to.

On 2) I suspect the real answer is -1 to +1 points but no-one can test it.
On 3) Tomiyasu is in the Japan Olympic squad so won't be joining until mid August at earliest. So perhaps on your logic he shouldn't be joining at all.
We would also have to rule out anyone who played in the knockout stages of the Euros or Copa America. That's a recipe for buying dross.

 

[The Changing Man]

VdV, though I agree is the exception.

Sissoko (or maybe not)!!!

Though a little underwhelming at the time Clint Dempsey came out of the blue and was a decent squad signing

 

[remembercolinlee]

Most of those mistakes were the inevitable outcome of employing Mourinho. That was a huge mistake. Furlough was corrected in a few days. Everyone made the ESL mistake.
I agree about the polarisation. If you and I have different opinions then the most likely explanation is that both of us are missing something. I look forward to another poster telling us what that is.

Furlough took well over a week to correct and was not an understandable mistake.
It was a cruel and disrespectful way to treat the lowest paid staff to save 6 months of Danny Rose's wages.

Not everyone made a mistake re the ESL.
Fans saw it for what it was immediately. I personally find it shocking that the leadership of the club are so detached that they thought it was a good idea.

As for another poster...the bastards are bound to side with you...you are well reasoned and thought out while I am (in the words of one of my ASD pupils earlier today) a complete **** ****

Only 4 more days or 24 hours of work to go til the summer hols