The bigger plan

[tigerscanada]

what did Duffen do that was illegal?? I remember something about a court case but can’t recall the details

You should ask Duffens_Briefs ?

 

[originallambrettaman]

what did Duffen do that was illegal?? I remember something about a court case but can’t recall the details

Backhanders to an off-shore account, on our Premier League transfers, allegedly (along with sticking loads of personal expenses on the club accounts).

 

[Asterix]

So you just rattled off player fees for the sake of it and not as evidence of anything? Fair enough then. There's no 'blinkers' there's just astonishment that there's still a section of supporters on here who think the Allams haven't systematically and substantially worsened the playing squad and pocketed a large percentage of the profits.

I was going to give that a, yea, fair comment, we can agree to disagree on what is, what isn't asset stripping. But, come on, trousering?

Interest payments on loans have to be paid, whether to them or to a bank.
Wages, not insubstantial in the case of players, have to be paid.
etc etc bills other outgoings

I will retract everything if, and only if, you trawl through the accounts of both City and Allamhouse, and show exactly where this trousered money came from and into which pocket it went.

 

[SydneyTiger14]

I was going to give that a, yea, fair comment, we can agree to disagree on what is, what isn't asset stripping. But, come on, trousering?

Interest payments on loans have to be paid, whether to them or to a bank.
Wages, not insubstantial in the case of players, have to be paid.
etc etc bills other outgoings

I will retract everything if, and only if, you trawl through the accounts of both City and Allamhouse, and show exactly where this trousered money came from and into which pocket it went.

Peter already posted the figures above.

Cheers.

 

[originallambrettaman]

Interest payments on loans have to be paid, whether to them or to a bank.

They certainly have to be paid to a bank, but when it's an individual, it's entirely up to them if they charge interest or not and many wealthy football club owners do give their loans interest free (even the likes of Mike Ashley).

 

[Asterix]

They certainly have to be paid to a bank, but when it's an individual, it's entirely up to them if they charge interest or not and many wealthy football club owners do give their loans interest free (even the likes of Mike Ashley).

Yes, correct. But that is not trousering. All above board and shown in both set of accounts. Yes, it is a bit ****ty charging interest on a gift, but not underhand.

 

[SydneyTiger14]

Yes, correct. But that is not trousering. All above board and shown in both set of accounts. Yes, it is a bit ****ty charging interest on a gift, but not underhand.

Seems you're again getting intent on arguing semantics about what 'trousering' means (your term by the way, I just said they 'pocketed' a lot of the profits which is factual).

 

[Ric Glasgow]

24,399 was the highest home attendance around Christmas.
Last home match of the season was 11,301 which was three days after losing at home with an attendance of 14,363. The home match before that was 19,320.

Biggest crowd I was ever in at Boothferry Park was a cup game v West Ham(I think 73?)....I seem to recall the crowd was over 36k and we beat them 1-0,Houghton scored from memory?

 

[petersaxton]

Yes, correct. But that is not trousering. All above board and shown in both set of accounts. Yes, it is a bit ****ty charging interest on a gift, but not underhand.

I think the Allams were being altruistic when they bought the club but they didnt realise what it would entail.
They did well bringing Steve Bruce in as manager but they didnt like the amount of money needed to be spent to be successful. They then got greedy when they had the opportunity to sell and from then on they have just tried to cut wages and sell players because they can't sell the club for the amount they want.

 

[SydneyTiger14]

I think the Allams were being altruistic when they bought the club but they didnt realise what it would entail.
They did well bringing Steve Bruce in as manager but they didnt like the amount of money needed to be spent to be successful. They then got greedy when they had the opportunity to sell and from then on they have just tried to cut wages and sell players because they can't sell the club for the amount they want.

Definitely. Think there's a quote from Assem about not realising just how bad the accounts were. (Which, as an accountant is pretty embarrassing to admit after having done DD)

 

[Asterix]

Seems you're again getting intent on arguing semantics about what 'trousering' means (your term by the way, I just said they 'pocketed' a lot of the profits which is factual).

Pocketed, trousering, implies underhand dealings. A forensic search of both sets of published accounts will show this. Within the accounts, therein lies the facts. Anything else is supposition, guesswork, oh they have done this that and the other and all of a sudden you have made 2+2=5

 

[petersaxton]

Biggest crowd I was ever in at Boothferry Park was a cup game v West Ham(I think 73?)....I seem to recall the crowd was over 36k and we beat them 1-0,Houghton scored from memory?

Correct except for the attendance: 32,290.

 

[originallambrettaman]

Yes, correct. But that is not trousering. All above board and shown in both set of accounts. Yes, it is a bit ****ty charging interest on a gift, but not underhand.

You're playing semantics again, the club have paid Allamhouse £22m in interest alone up to the end of last season, they then took £3.8m personally in dividends from Allamhouse last year. They obviously couldn't fit that much money in their trousers, but as a slang term for taking out money personally, it's perfectly reasonable.

 

[SydneyTiger14]

Pocketed, trousering, implies underhand dealings. A forensic search of both sets of published accounts will show this. Within the accounts, therein lies the facts. Anything else is supposition, guesswork, oh they have done this that and the other and all of a sudden you have made 2+2=5

Pocketed implies nothing more than they took the money from the club and now have the money in their own pockets.

 

[tigerscanada]

I think the Allams were being altruistic when they bought the club but they didnt realise what it would entail.
They did well bringing Steve Bruce in as manager but they didnt like the amount of money needed to be spent to be successful. They then got greedy when they had the opportunity to sell and from then on they have just tried to cut wages and sell players because they can't sell the club for the amount they want.

Personally I believe their motive was purely profit based, disguised through statements insinuating altruism.
The council scuppered their desire to get their hands on bargain basement property (real estate) they hoped they could develop ?

 

[petersaxton]

Definitely. Think there's a quote from Assem about not realising just how bad the accounts were. (Which, as an accountant is pretty embarrassing to admit after having done DD)

You'd be shocked at how bad the state of many business's accounts are. They wont do bank reconciliations and external accountants are scared to confront the owners and fudge the figures instead.
The auditors only charge Hull City £7,500 per year.
For the Allamhouse group it is only £29,000 per year.
I dont know the state of the bookkeeping though.

 

[SydneyTiger14]

You'd be shocked at how bad the state of many businesses accounts are. They wont do bank reconciliations and external accountants are scared to confront the owners and fudge the figures instead.
The auditors only charge Hull City £7,500 per year.
For the Allamhouse group it is only £29,000 per year.
I dont know the state of the bookkeeping though.

Frankly ridiculous. My company pays close to $100k (60k pounds?) in audit/accounting fees each year.

 

[Asterix]

Definitely. Think there's a quote from Assem about not realising just how bad the accounts were. (Which, as an accountant is pretty embarrassing to admit after having done DD)

Which raises the questions, what DD was done, why the haste to buy the club, when on another thread in response to some of my points, someone suggested if he had waited until the plug was pulled he would have got it without the need to pay off the revenue?

Enough now, best wishes

 

[petersaxton]

Frankly ridiculous. My company pays close to $100k (60k pounds?) in audit/accounting fees each year.

I saw a series of accounts filed at Companies House and I prepared the following notes:

For the accounts for 2013-2014 Note 2 says that Tangible assets nbv at 31/01/14 is £1,000 but for the accounts for 2014-2015 Note 2 says that the Tangible assets nbv at 31/01/14 is £10,000.

Also the accounts for 2014-2015 have comparative figures for 2013-2014 that bear no relation to the figures in the accounts for 2013-2014.

In the accounts for 2017-2018 the balance sheet doesn’t balance.

In the accounts for 2018-2019 the balance sheet doesn’t balance.

In the accounts for 2018-2019 there are several pages of documents with transactions relating to a different company.

 

[SydneyTiger14]

I saw a series of accounts filed at Companies House and I prepared the following notes:

For the accounts for 2013-2014 Note 2 says that Tangible assets nbv at 31/01/14 is £1,000 but for the accounts for 2014-2015 Note 2 says that the Tangible assets nbv at 31/01/14 is £10,000.

Also the accounts for 2014-2015 have comparative figures for 2013-2014 that bear no relation to the figures in the accounts for 2013-2014.

In the accounts for 2017-2018 the balance sheet doesn’t balance.

In the accounts for 2018-2019 the balance sheet doesn’t balance.

In the accounts for 2018-2019 there are several pages of documents with transactions relating to a different company.

My understanding is the Allams use a local Accounting firm who are so grateful for the business they basically sign off on whatever the Allams tell them to?