https://www.express.co.uk/news/poli...ews-boris-johnson-tories-jeremy-corbyn-labour Some leader that Farage
We had a referendum - the majority was brexit - I can't understand why people want another one. It's like replaying a football match that didn't end the way we wanted just because we lost. Also - who knows the outcomes of leaving or remaining? Been more than 40 years since we joined the EU and the only way anyone will know what will happen IF we leave is WHEN we leave. The rest is all conjecture As for the OP - Corbyn is unbelievably bad and I couldn't ever trust him running a tap let alone the country! Boris is as bad! So, as per @Simple Saffy I'll probably go for an independent brexit vote
The biggest con going is that you believe in parties that explicitly work against you, and believe them when they tell you that it's simply impossible to help ordinary people because there's not enough money. Yet the entire time, they line their own pockets, those of their friends, and ensure that businesses don't pay tax on the false notion that it will impact you more than them. Believe me, it won't. Neither will Amazon or any other company 'investing in the UK' **** off the day they have to pay more tax, because in truth, they need this market and have established it here. Jobs don't suffer when tax avoidance is stopped, and any time we bribe companies like that, it is a shaky foundation for an economy. At some point, people have been conditioned to be sceptical of those who offer them fairness and to take the side of the super rich who (shock horror) own newspapers, media companies and buy political influence. Weird that isn't it? Look at how many people think that taxing billionaires more stops aspiration. No, it doesn't. I'm never going to be a billionaire but I have a better chance than most of it happening. I'm not stupid enough to live my entire life supporting that fantasy of riches beyond all comprehension over the lives of others.
As Marcus said, we had a referendum, and we voted to get out of the corrupt EU system, and nobody said that this was a 'best of 3' or 5, or 7 system, but those that don't agree with democracy want to have as many referendums as are necessary to 'get their own way' I don't follow politics, but I heard a couple of things about the tramp's ideas where he will make every home in the UK energy efficient at a cost of so many £zillions, and an introduction of a 32 hour week with no reduction in pay (but an obvious reduction in production, which will massively affect business and revenue for the UK) at a cost of so many £zillions, but no details about where the funding will come from Perhaps he's going to ask ISIS to help, being as if they wanted to invade us he's intimated in the past that he'd just 'give them, or anybody else, the key' 'cos we don't need to protect ourselves ! I seem to remember him saying that he'd get rid of, or massively reduce, the armed forces, so nobody would actually need a key - maybe that's where he'd get the funding from Maybe he's planning to privatise the NHS, which would provide the funding . . . . I don't know He was quoted this morning as saying that he'd have Brexit sorted in 6 months, but he didn't say 'done' which suggests to me that he's got no intention of it completing and he'd cancel it (but in a sneaky way to fool us mere mortals) Anyway, I don't pretend to understand the intricacies of politics, and that above is just what I've picked up so far (and I may have got it completely wrong) p.s. Boris is the only one that seems to want to sort out Brexit for the benefit of the electorate who voted (democratically) to leave, but the majority of politicians seem to be liars that are only in it for themselves, mind
Corbyn is not Blair. If you think he is, you don't know anything about the two people. And yet here's the reality - that Blair government did amazing things for me and my aspirations, got me to university and allowed me to set up a company that I now run, and I'm far from alone, my generation had more opportunities than the current younger generations, and god knows about the bairns of today. The only thing it didn't do was tax the richest elements of society more to cover some of the cost of their deregulation. In a way, the UK being hit by a once in a century economic implosion compounded that. Debt is necessary for this country to maintain a level of infrastructure at time sadly. This was primarily because our governments for many years under-funded public spending and led to a poor logistical platform. Labour spent more in the early 00s because it had to, we were becoming a third world country under the Tories who had opened up the market, but allowed cynical exploitation of those at the bottom with no safety net or attempt to use public spending to invest in our country's infrastructure. So yeah, I think it's fine the Tories have ran up some debt, but they have done it at the expense of normal people and refused to tax their rich allies. They have cut spending on things that have a real impact on people and communities in favour of tax breaks and loopholes. I don't want that society on any level, and there is frankly only one person, however idealistic he is, offering any real change for the country. I can't sign up to 5 years of Boris, a morally bankrupt charlatan who has abused power at every turn in his career, being given free reign to enact his corruption at the highest level. **** that.
Thanks for clarifying, it's almost as if I didn't understand what the outcome of the vote was I don't think it's like playing a football match at all. I gave my opinion on my vote. It's not because I've spat my dummy out, it's because I want to be able to see both sides as best as I can to then be able to make an informed decision about whether I want in/out. I did also say I might change my vote but I simply can't understand how people can vote for something they have no idea on the outcome, it's all (majority) guesswork - again, my opinion.
Blairs supporting Bush over the 2nd Irak War was a disaster, now we have a Boris / Trump alliance and god knows were that will end, Corbyn is endlessly attacked for voicing concerns about the Israel / Palestinian situation. Trumps actions against the Kurd's should be a lesson to all his "friends". Gorbachev has just warned the world about the current dangers of a nuclear war. Corbyn unlike the Thatcher / Reagan axis would have helped Gorbachev's Russia in its time of need and Putin would not have gained power. Isis and mass migration would not have happened without these events. The Tory party would not have then re-gained power and plunged us into the farcical referendum about Europe that has split the country apart, the only beneficiaries being the Putin government,and our banking and legal professions making hay out of the turmoil, it makes me think that you get what you wish for. Vote Green.
Sorry - didn;t mean to sound so arsey towards you but had a few arguments with people about having another referendum - I just don't understand why. I was talking hypothetically about a footy match - there was someone on question time who wanted to remain who about a week after the referendum and she said to have another one. That was why I referenced it to a footy match! FWIW I don;t think anyone has any idea what will happen either way to be honest - whether it will be better to stay or go. Every political party tells you something different and none of them seem to have any idea what may or may not happen! I just trhink Europe needs us more than we need them. I'd rather have Boris the Blade running the country than Boris Johnson (or Corbyn for that matter!!)
AND EVERY COUNTRY IN THE EU HAS PRIVATE HEALTH CARE, Netherlands charge 290 for you and the misses with a 400 excess on each person,
Every vote is a vote of hope rather than of expectation. We never know what the outcome of a vote will be. Things were more than a bit hazy regarding the repercussions of leaving I agree. But you could also argue that we would never know how much of a handful of our short and curlies the EU would have had a grab of if we stayed.
Thats the point though Markus, your second paragraph. No one knows how Brexit will affect the country in the long and short term, people are guessing and hoping it gives us a better future. The futures that will be affected most are our children and grandchildren. Older people have voted for something they don't have to live with in the long term. I didn't vote cos I won't have to live with the consequences of Brexit but the younger members of my family will have to. I hope all the Brexiteers in years to come will say we told you so because it's been a success and Britain is doing well in the world because the alternative doesn't bear thinking about. Ronnie
Ive never fully understood the repercussions of the NHS suddenly ending. Havnt a clue of the figures but lets say I pay £100 a month towards the NHS. If the NHS folded would it not basically mean that I would now just have to pay £100 a month towards Private Health care? Is it only the people who dont contribute towards the NHS, but use it, that will suffer if it collapsed?
Each Country in the EU has it's own health provision. My sister took ill in France and of course the EHIC gave us the same level as locals. Emergency care was free and ongoing was 80% state funded. As a retired NHS Project Manager pre the PFI con the hospital was impressive with six different fuly staffed ICUs segregated by specialty and 2 MRI Departments. No mention of insurance and EHIC prior to treatment that was handled about a week later. OK not quite free at point of delivery but an exceptional level of care which our NHS is not funded to provide. It is also not relevant to the EU debate because as said earlier each Country is free to provide it's healthcare as it sees fit. And as for Farage his voting record demonstrates an anti welfare, anti workers rights stance.
Add in the profits of both the insurance companies and health care providers and the reluctance to cover pre existing conditions.
Camaron went to the EU for a better deal for Britain as we were getting shafted, they didn't give us f all hence Brexit, Poland is one of the net recipients of EU funds as we as Lithuania Estonia latvia...Britain's contribution is more than 9 combined countries, yet we get the least amount back, when we leave Germany's contribution will go up from 12 to 33 billions, as well as Netherlands France Italy Spain these countries are squealing now about the cost and refusing to pay, if we leave on a no deal they will only be to pleased to give us a good deal or risk a break up.as it is now if we don't pay 39 billion the EU budget is ****ed.
