Off Topic The Politics Thread

[YorkshireHoopster]

Because after years on the EU gravy train, he's so inculcated with its doctrinal messages, his loyalties to his own country come second and he's lost all sense of objectivity

Really? Give me strength

 

[sb_73]

Really? Give me strength

Oh come on. Goldie's famous for his objectivity.

 

[YorkshireHoopster]

I'm rapidly coming round to the idea that Brexit negotiations should be left to Farage and Boris. Unfortunately, there is no chance of Farage being given that responsibility and Boris clearly doesn't want it. If however they could be persuaded to do their duty by the Country, they could then get on with it and appease their supporters. They also wouldn't have anyone else to blame if (Nb 'If' not 'When') it all goes tits up.

 

[GoldhawkRoad]

Really? Give me strength

Can't help with the strength - have you tried spinach? - but it's a fact that there was real concern from government that Rogers had gone native. This reported on the BBC and Sky

 

[GoldhawkRoad]

Oh come on. Goldie's famous for his objectivity.

Thank the Lord for your impartiality, Stan, to redress it

 

[GoldhawkRoad]

Bloody hell, a traitor indeed! Such paranoia.

Not paranoia, but extreme caution - these being the most important negotiations at this level in our lifetimes.

 

[GoldhawkRoad]

Same reason the elitist right, and for that matter elitists of any shade, are equally disdainful probably. They believe they know better. I should know, I wear my elitist badge with pride. I have Theresa and Nigel to thank for opening my eyes to my true place in this country, and I'm really enjoying the feeling.

Rogers was retiring in November anyway. What the negotiators have lost is someone who knows the people on the other side of the table very well, and has some insight into what they want. In my experience Dipper's take on civil servants is correct (I went through the Civil Service Selection Board process in 1982 (not sure if they do it now) and ended up in the Hong Kong Government for 3 years). Civil servants are given an objective, look at all the options available, recommend one (including downsides) and then implement whatever is decided. It's surprisingly easy to separate doing a professional job from your own beliefs, because the approach forces you down that route. My understanding of Rogers' resignation is that he felt he couldn't do his job because he hasn't been given any objectives, while the clock is ticking.

The extreme right don't hold the disdain for working voters that the militant end of Labour do. Emily Thornberry's nose-in-the-air tweet about the football supporting white van man who had an England flag at his window was a classic. Miliband sacked her, but Corbyn made her shadow foreign secretary. They're all out of touch, I wonder whether any of them ever leave North London.

 

[East Herts Rangers]

Garage had already said they have replaced a knighted career diplomat with a
...knighted career diplomat.

And as usual he is 100% correct

 

[sb_73]

The extreme right don't hold the disdain for working voters that the militant end of Labour do. Emily Thornberry's nose-in-the-air tweet about the football supporting white van man who had an England flag at his window was a classic. Miliband sacked her, but Corbyn made her shadow foreign secretary. They're all out of touch, I wonder whether any of them ever leave North London.

You won't find me sticking up for any of the Labour mob Goldie. The extreme right is almost indistinguishable from the extreme left in that the ends always justifies the means, they are both about ideology rather than people.

 

[QPR Oslo]

The extreme right don't hold the disdain for working voters that the militant end of Labour do. Emily Thornberry's nose-in-the-air tweet about the football supporting white van man who had an England flag at his window was a classic. Miliband sacked her, but Corbyn made her shadow foreign secretary. They're all out of touch, I wonder whether any of them ever leave North London.

Based on your rationale (bias?), if Miliband sacked her, they cannot "all" be out of touch.

 

[GoldhawkRoad]

Based on your rationale (bias?), if Miliband sacked her, they cannot "all" be out of touch.

They're all out of touch, but some are more out of touch than others

The moderates in the Labour Party are beginning to see what the electorate want, but that won't help for 2020 unless Corbyn falls on his sword. Can't see it happening

 

[GoldhawkRoad]

You won't find me sticking up for any of the Labour mob Goldie. The extreme right is almost indistinguishable from the extreme left in that the ends always justifies the means, they are both about ideology rather than people.

Depends what you mean by the extreme right. I suspect Nutall will be more in tune with many Labour voters than Corbyn or McDonnell

 

[sb_73]

Depends what you mean by the extreme right. I suspect Nutall will be more in tune with many Labour voters than Corbyn or McDonnell

If I've learned anything from the last election, referendum, US election etc it's that no party can rely on a core vote any more. Seems to me that this old left/right politics of the C20th is redundant, but we are still trapped in its vocabulary and structures, still got the same old parties.

 

[TheBigDipper]

I've read a suggestion that we might be seeing our politics change from the right/left paradigm and morphing into libertarian vs authoritarian strands. I can understand it, and you can guess where I sit on that spectrum.

 

[GoldhawkRoad]

If I've learned anything from the last election, referendum, US election etc it's that no party can rely on a core vote any more. Seems to me that this old left/right politics of the C20th is redundant, but we are still trapped in its vocabulary and structures, still got the same old parties.

Yes, some truth. It's bizarre seeing a Russian president being accused of influencing a US Election to bring in a Republican president who is more extreme than most Republican senior party members are comfortable with. It's gone full circle

 

[GoldhawkRoad]

I've read a suggestion that we might be seeing our politics change from the right/left paradigm and morphing into libertarian vs authoritarian strands. I can understand it, and you can guess where I sit on that spectrum.

Never sit on a spectrum. You can get a wide range of disorders

 

[Stroller]

I've read a suggestion that we might be seeing our politics change from the right/left paradigm and morphing into libertarian vs authoritarian strands. I can understand it, and you can guess where I sit on that spectrum.

Let's hope so, we are badly in need of some kind of political re-alignment in this country. I have little idea how I would vote if there was a general election tomorrow.

 

[Uber_Hoop]

If I've learned anything from the last election, referendum, US election etc it's that no party can rely on a core vote any more. Seems to me that this old left/right politics of the C20th is redundant, but we are still trapped in its vocabulary and structures, still got the same old parties.

That-a-boy! Now you're starting to sound like Hitchens P.

 

[Uber_Hoop]

I've read a suggestion that we might be seeing our politics change from the right/left paradigm and morphing into libertarian vs authoritarian strands. I can understand it, and you can guess where I sit on that spectrum.

Authoriberal?

 

[Uber_Hoop]

Let's hope so, we are badly in need of some kind of political re-alignment in this country. I have little idea how I would vote if there was a general election tomorrow.

I have you down as a Tory.