I agreed with the formation too Bob, although I'd prefer 4-2-3-1 or 4-3-3. However neither of those can really accommodate Cisse, so I wouldn't mind trying 4-1-3-2 with Diakite holding and Granero in the centre of the 3 with Taarabt and Hoilett either side. Then we could have Cisse and Zamora up front together.
Yesterday's game
- Thread starter rangercol
- Start date
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I agreed with the formation too Bob, although I'd prefer 4-2-3-1 or 4-3-3. However neither of those can really accommodate Cisse, so I wouldn't mind trying 4-1-3-2 with Diakite holding and Granero in the centre of the 3 with Taarabt and Hoilett either side. Then we could have Cisse and Zamora up front together.
I'm afraid BZ was definitely with Distin mate. Nelsen ran across following his man who was Jelavic. Zamora simply made no effort to stay with Distin and let him have a completely free header!
Couple of points.
a. I would love to see both of our full backs overlapping more. With Diakite playing as DCM, it should allow our fullbacks a little more freedom, especially at home.
b. Granero was excellent yesterday. He covered a lot of ground but i am not so sure if he is capable of giving a killer pass through the middle like Faurlin. This could become a problem as the season goes on INO.
c. Adel consistently cuts in from the wing effectively slowing down our attack. He is far more effective running at people from the centre. Playing more centrally would allow him to be far more creative and supportive to our front man.
d. BZ will not get the ball under control unless it is hit straight to him. One yard either side and he won't get to it first. I really think that we should look at Mackie as an option when MH wants to play one up front. He is reasonably tall, powerfully strong and would run his socks off along the line making it difficult for defenders. Don't think Cisse could play this role and is better suited to playing in a front two.
e. Somebody needs to teach Cisse the off-side rule and quickly.
f. Park is effective in stopping the opposition full back or winger from doing damage but he is no capable of doing any himself.
g. MH should have gone 3 at the back yesterday and put Mackie and Cisse upfront for the final 20. Think we sent the message to Everton that we were not going to go for it. IMHO, this was a mistake and showed MH was paralysed by fear.
Thought Traore was excellent yesterday. Very solid. Granero was busy but showed no killer touch for a CM or ACM.
a. I would love to see both of our full backs overlapping more. With Diakite playing as DCM, it should allow our fullbacks a little more freedom, especially at home.
b. Granero was excellent yesterday. He covered a lot of ground but i am not so sure if he is capable of giving a killer pass through the middle like Faurlin. This could become a problem as the season goes on INO.
c. Adel consistently cuts in from the wing effectively slowing down our attack. He is far more effective running at people from the centre. Playing more centrally would allow him to be far more creative and supportive to our front man.
d. BZ will not get the ball under control unless it is hit straight to him. One yard either side and he won't get to it first. I really think that we should look at Mackie as an option when MH wants to play one up front. He is reasonably tall, powerfully strong and would run his socks off along the line making it difficult for defenders. Don't think Cisse could play this role and is better suited to playing in a front two.
e. Somebody needs to teach Cisse the off-side rule and quickly.
f. Park is effective in stopping the opposition full back or winger from doing damage but he is no capable of doing any himself.
g. MH should have gone 3 at the back yesterday and put Mackie and Cisse upfront for the final 20. Think we sent the message to Everton that we were not going to go for it. IMHO, this was a mistake and showed MH was paralysed by fear.
Thought Traore was excellent yesterday. Very solid. Granero was busy but showed no killer touch for a CM or ACM.
Nuts.....I thought Bosingwa and Traore got forward well.
Agree about Granero. Didn't see one killer pass all game.
Adel was quieter than usual. He could play central if we played 4-2-3-1.
Zamora was very poor.
Cisse needs games. We need a goal threat!! Could play him up front with Zamora in a 4-1-3-2.
I wouldn't have Park in my first choice 11, but it worked having him up against Baines.
I agree we could have gone 3 at the back and gone for it. Even teams like Wolves last year went for it when we were down to 10!
I like Granero but I feel we'll need Adel to supply the killer passes. Granero's dead ball delivery is a welcome improvement though!
Fair points.IMO a 4-2-3-1 away and a 4-1-3-2 at home is the way forward for us. Still think Mackie should be looked at. He would be a defenders nightmare and help stop the opposition building easily from the back.
When Cisse has had a chance he's done nothing to justify getting more. The system that complements the players we have the best is undoubtedly 4-2-3-1 with Faurlin and Diakite deep and Hoilett, Granero and Taarabt behind Zamora.
Granero is playing CM/CDM in QPR, you can't really expect him to make all of our attacks if he's not playing the playmaker role. And yes he's not that good with the killer passes, he really doesn't try to make any.
Granero's dead balls are excellent but it's a pity that nobody gets at the end of them.
And I'm just against Zamora and Cisse together, we would get slaughtered in the midfield.
The games was easier on the eye than many others so far this term, Selection was the most positive we've seen, though I feel that we needed someone who can break up play better than park did as his contribution seemed to be zonal defending. The Everton goal goal didn't really come against the run of play but was still helped by the goal scorer peeling off our tallest player to score a free header AAAARRRGGGGHHH. If he starts Bobby against the Arse I'll be annoyed but not surprised as we've got bugger all realistic options.
I'm giving Leslie a 1 game stay of execution as it looked better and we took an important point, but why take so long to work out a strong line up? god knows..
I'm giving Leslie a 1 game stay of execution as it looked better and we took an important point, but why take so long to work out a strong line up? god knows..
Sorry guys , Swans fan here , just back after being banned for a bit over the " Swansea Mod Fiasco " . Just wanted to say count your lucky stars you have a mod of substance in BrixtonR . I'm sure your other mod( s ) are equally good . Also , Dragonphiljack who put an article on your board during the melee is also a ex mod who was relieved of responsibility in disgrace for abuse of power . P.S. Hi Rangercol , seabreeze here from the old 606 , not to worry sir .. your team is to good not to come good as long as you don't do a " Derby " and make wholesale changes in January . Derby never won a game after that January ... goodluck to you guys , you could use a little .
Watford, I totally agree. That is the team and formation I want to see. If we go behind and need to chase the game take off Diakite with 20mins left (he will prob be booked anyway) and bring on Cisse for a 4-1-3-2.
Sorry for banging on about Mackie but really think he can play up front by himself. A total nuisance and will run his socks off.
He will. I don't think he's good enough with his back to goal and would rather Zamora played up there but I'd prefer giving Mackie a run than Cisse if we are looking to perservere with one up front (hopefully) and Zamora gets injured or has a couple more games like Sunday.
Improvement in selection but we just never really looked threatening up front. Adel was constantly looking for the ball whereas others made little effort at times to call for it, particularly at throw-ins. Noisy in x block but thought support could have been more vocal. Maybe the bloody miserable weather!
Good stuff again, Col, thanks.
I agree with Brix about the organisation and industry of a good Everton side. Their defence is bloody good at the moment, so it was little surprise to me that the Rs failed to penetrate it after the sending off, as they redoubled their defensive efforts when reduced to ten. Jagielka was immense - if only we had a bit more of that ne'er say die attitude.
But none of this detracts from the fact that once again our defensive frailties and offensive shortcomings have cost points. I made the comment on another post-match thread that the Rs are starting to look like a good box-to-box side (some of the passing and interchange was fabulous), but its inside either box where they're still found wanting.
Another thing I'd made a note to watch out for was which team had the bigger share of the so-called 'second ball'. QPR did see more of this once Pienaar was dismissed, but the Toffees never looked that uncomfortable. But for much of the game, we failed to get the second ball on too many occasions, which meant either sustained defensive pressure or another attacking opportunity breaking down. Is there still a desire problem, lack of fitness or ability? I'm not sure.
One final comment, akin to the Rs lack of firepower, is an apparent breakout of goal-shyness. Of course, there were a few notable examples where scoring opportunities were blocked by that solid Evertonian defence, but I've seen on too many occasions this season to date a reluctance to have a go when in a clear striking position. We're not Arsenal, so should forget about walking the ball into the net. Take a shot, guys!
I agree with Brix about the organisation and industry of a good Everton side. Their defence is bloody good at the moment, so it was little surprise to me that the Rs failed to penetrate it after the sending off, as they redoubled their defensive efforts when reduced to ten. Jagielka was immense - if only we had a bit more of that ne'er say die attitude.
But none of this detracts from the fact that once again our defensive frailties and offensive shortcomings have cost points. I made the comment on another post-match thread that the Rs are starting to look like a good box-to-box side (some of the passing and interchange was fabulous), but its inside either box where they're still found wanting.
Another thing I'd made a note to watch out for was which team had the bigger share of the so-called 'second ball'. QPR did see more of this once Pienaar was dismissed, but the Toffees never looked that uncomfortable. But for much of the game, we failed to get the second ball on too many occasions, which meant either sustained defensive pressure or another attacking opportunity breaking down. Is there still a desire problem, lack of fitness or ability? I'm not sure.
One final comment, akin to the Rs lack of firepower, is an apparent breakout of goal-shyness. Of course, there were a few notable examples where scoring opportunities were blocked by that solid Evertonian defence, but I've seen on too many occasions this season to date a reluctance to have a go when in a clear striking position. We're not Arsenal, so should forget about walking the ball into the net. Take a shot, guys!
Take a look at Zamoras celebratiion with Hoilett, seems well up for it! I enjoyed the game more than previous this season although i agree we look rather toothless up front. How different it may be if we had Dawson and Defoe on board?
Personally i have no time for Cisse, he sulks, blames others, complains, keeps getting caught offside...seems to me he is here for the money.
I tend to prefer a fast Striker to a holding one. They both have their pros and cons but a fast striker will keep the CBs honest and stop them keeping a high line. If good enough(yes they will get caught off side), they will start to create a gap between the CB and CM, the kind of area I would love to see Adel playing in.
Ask most defenders, what they hate most and it will be pace.
Ask most defenders, what they hate most and it will be pace.
That's a very good point and spot on about the space that can open up when a fast forward pushes a defence deeper.
I agree with all those that say Cisse has been poor and also agree that he's a bit of a knob. However, I do believe he's our best goal scorer and I also believe that we need to give him games to try to play him into some kind of form. Goal scorers are usually at their best when they play regularly. That's why I would be in favour of trying to play a system that allows him to play up front with Zamora, although, taking into consideration what Vale says above, he could play centrally in a 4-3-3.
I thought Zamora did "ok"
Distin and Jagielka are not mugs and were sandwiching him and holding all game
Does he ever look like urning and scoring - no
Does he link well - yes I thought he even did so this week.
Players are too slow to get to him
Agree Granero is very good to watch but doesn't have Faurlin's killer pass
I thooght Traore and Adel linked well
The surfcae was far far fra fra too wet to let Mackie on the pitch
He would never have got it under control
Distin and Jagielka are not mugs and were sandwiching him and holding all game
Does he ever look like urning and scoring - no
Does he link well - yes I thought he even did so this week.
Players are too slow to get to him
Agree Granero is very good to watch but doesn't have Faurlin's killer pass
I thooght Traore and Adel linked well
The surfcae was far far fra fra too wet to let Mackie on the pitch
He would never have got it under control
That's why we need both Faurlin and Granero on the pitch. Those 2 and Diakite would form a fearsome midfield.
