World Cup 2022

[Billy The Spur]

I thought Rashford had a strange game, 2 good goals but both were goalkeeping errors, other than that he was poor and gave the ball away several times. Against a decent team both his goals are saved, leaving his overall performance as dire, I wouldn`t be surprised if he goes missing against a top team. Wales were dreadful, Bale was clearly not fit and picked purely on reputation and status, England never got out of second gear and won at a canter.

 

[humanbeingincroydon]

The way pundits and commentators tried bigging up Joe Allen like he was genuinely the Welsh Pirlo was embarrassing. The guy’s spent the majority of his career in the championship playing for the likes of Stoke and Swansea ffs.

The fact he was at fault for both of Iran's goals the other day somehow eluded the pundits

But, of course, he played for their beloved Saltypool so therefore...

 

[Alfie Conn]

I thought Rashford had a strange game, 2 good goals but both were goalkeeping errors, other than that he was poor and gave the ball away several times. Against a decent team both his goals are saved, leaving his overall performance as dire, I wouldn`t be surprised if he goes missing against a top team. Wales were dreadful, Bale was clearly not fit and picked purely on reputation and status, England never got out of second gear and won at a canter.

In another sport Bale would only come on for free kicks and penalties, shame to say we have seen the best of him now

 

[Spurlock]

Football is a results based business, if Southgates results were bad he would be out of the job, but the facts are that his results stand up to scrutiny against every manager since Sir Alf was fired almost 50 years ago.

Revie, Greenwood, Robson, Venables, Eriksen, Capello and probably Hodgson and even possibly Hoddle were all better coaches than Southgate and between them they took England 2 semi finals in major tournaments, the same number in 43 years as Southgate has managed in 6. He is clearly doing something better than those who preceded him.

I don't like his football or some of his selections, but I am only a fan, so I get behind him and the team he selects and I don't profess to know more than the man who does the job, though we all think that we do.

Nope I don’t buy into this

they must know better because it’s their job

I’ve been watching football for 40 years…that counts for something too.
England won’t win the trophy with this guy in charge regardless of how he’s outdone previous managers.

When it comes to the crunch this man and his philosophies will be found wanting.

 

[KingHotspur]

Nope I don’t buy into this

they must know better because it’s their job

I’ve been watching football for 40 years…that counts for something too.
England won’t win the trophy with this guy in charge regardless of how he’s outdone previous managers.

When it comes to the crunch this man and his philosophies will be found wanting.

I agree to some extent but compared to past England managers he taken the team to new levels and he will leave the team and squad in an infinitely better position than when he took over from.

 

[The RDBD]

...

Fatwa from Abu RDBD all Qatari :

Avatar wagers on not606 are henceforth declared "haram" .

 

[The RDBD]

Nope I don’t buy into this

they must know better because it’s their job ...

To be statistically more charitable ...

Fair to assume that football managers as a profession
would conform to the Normal distribution. In which case,
in which percentile does Southgate fall ??

I contend that he is at best +/- 1 "sigma" from the mean
(ie hardly remarkable in any sense) .

 

[Spurlock]

I agree to some extent but compared to past England managers he taken the team to new levels and he will leave the team and squad in an infinitely better position than when he took over from.

best squad we’ve had since we won it imo

a better manager would have landed us one of the two trophies by now imo

but no denying…Southgate has taken us far in his time

but it’s frustrating when you know you can do better but one persons mentality is holding it back…a criticism often directed at Conte of late.

 

[PowerSpurs]

To be statistically more charitable ...

Fair to assume that football managers as a profession
would conform to the Normal distribution. In which case,
in which percentile does Southgate fall ??

I contend that he is at best +/- 1 "sigma" from the mean
(ie hardly remarkable in any sense) .

You would hope, given the importance of the position, that the FA would be able to get a manager in the top quartile almost all the time. Since Southgate is probably in the top 2 of the eleven ever appointed, I would guess he is in the top decile overall.

 

[The Changing Man]

best squad we’ve had since we won it imo

a better manager would have landed us one of the two trophies by now imo

but no denying…Southgate has taken us far in his time

but it’s frustrating when you know you can do better but one persons mentality is holding it back…a criticism often directed at Conte of late.

Many people from the time suggest that the 1970 squad was better than squad than won it in 66. The Much vaunted golden generation squad that Eriksen took to Germany was considerably better defensively, Ferdinand, Terry and Cole walk into this team and if you were picking a squad of 26 from the 2 I think that the 06 squad would probably edge it in terms of numbers, on the basis of footballing quality, but they didn't function anywhere near as well as a team.

I agree that Southgate at times seems to hold us back, but his results at tournaments and in qualifying speak for themselves.

 

[KingHotspur]

best squad we’ve had since we won it imo

a better manager would have landed us one of the two trophies by now imo

He very nearly won the Euros, losing that final on a penalty shootout can’t be his fault.

The last World Cup was a bit of a missed opportunity but even if they had got through that semi against Croatia, then the French squad was (and still is) better than the England squad if you go man for man.

A lot of people are assuming England will go up another level once Southgate leaves but that’s no guarantee.

 

[The RDBD]

You would hope, given the importance of the position, that the FA would be able to get a manager in the top quartile almost all the time. Since Southgate is probably in the top 2 of the eleven ever appointed, I would guess he is in the top decile overall.

You cannot show that his finals performances
are not due to chance (hence my claim) .

 

[PleaseNotPoll]

He very nearly won the Euros, losing that final on a penalty shootout can’t be his fault.

Subbing on inexperienced players to take penalties isn't a great idea.
That's on him, in my opinion.

Southgate's overall results are hard to argue with, though.
I don't like his style of football and I think he gets some things wrong repeatedly.
He's massively outperformed some of his big name predecessors, though.

 

[The Changing Man]

You must log in or register to see media

So who without looking it up can name all 9?

I got to 8 quite quickly, 9 took me a while!

 

[PleaseNotPoll]

You must log in or register to see media

So who without looking it up can name all 9?

I got to 8 quite quickly, 9 took me a while!

For a more complete list, which I think "inspired" this tweet:

You must log in or register to see media

Arsenal and Chelsea combined coming in behind Wet Spam.

 

[The RDBD]

For a more complete list, which I think "inspired" this tweet: ...

Arsenal and Chelsea combined coming in behind Wet Spam.

who won the World cup in 1966 (Spurcat to confirm) .

 

[Spurf]

It's just possible that Southgate has learnt something from his experience as England manager. It appears in this tournament that he is prepared to be a little more adventurous. I am talking about his introduction of attacking players during the game. Comparing his record to former managers is likely to confuse the issue more than clarify. They all had different squads. It's a matter of opinion but the final of the Euro's was very poor because England were stunted by the manager. England were clearly the better team IMO yet failed to impress themselves on the game. We treated Italy with far too much respect as if we were facing the Italy from 2006 or 1982. This Italy failed to qualify for this World Cup so they were hardly formidable. Southgate shouts caution from every pore, it's not difficult to see and that characteristic shows in his football.

The other factor are the other teams in the world. Is this the time for great teams? It seems to me it's more a time for outstanding individual players with possibly the greatest of all time (Messi) still playing. There has been an upgrade in quality all over the world but IMO there are no truly great teams at the moment except possibly the French. Older posters will remember the great Brazil teams of the past the Dutch in the 70's the Germans and the great Italian sides. I won't blame Southgate if he manages to reach the last 8 and loses to the French but I would like to see England playing to their strengths which are clearly in attack.

 

[The Huddlefro]

It's just possible that Southgate has learnt something from his experience as England manager. It appears in this tournament that he is prepared to be a little more adventurous. I am talking about his introduction of attacking players during the game. Comparing his record to former managers is likely to confuse the issue more than clarify. They all had different squads. It's a matter of opinion but the final of the Euro's was very poor because England were stunted by the manager. England were clearly the better team IMO yet failed to impress themselves on the game. We treated Italy with far too much respect as if we were facing the Italy from 2006 or 1982. This Italy failed to qualify for this World Cup so they were hardly formidable. Southgate shouts caution from every pore, it's not difficult to see and that characteristic shows in his football.

The other factor are the other teams in the world. Is this the time for great teams? It seems to me it's more a time for outstanding individual players with possibly the greatest of all time (Messi) still playing. There has been an upgrade in quality all over the world but IMO there are no truly great teams at the moment except possibly the French. Older posters will remember the great Brazil teams of the past the Dutch in the 70's the Germans and the great Italian sides. I won't blame Southgate if he manages to reach the last 8 and loses to the French but I would like to see England playing to their strengths which are clearly in attack.

A tournament of this nature is effectively two tournaments. A team like England will mainly play teams they are better than in the group and will need to be more expansive to break teams down. Everyone is naturally better once you get past the groups, so teams try and solidify a bit and will play more safely as the stakes are higher and less mistakes are affordable.

You see the same with Real Madrid in the group stage of the CL quite often. Not always impressive early on, then their solidity and experience and individual quality shine through in the knockouts.

 

[Spurf]

A tournament of this nature is effectively two tournaments. A team like England will mainly play teams they are better than in the group and will need to be more expansive to break teams down. Everyone is naturally better once you get past the groups, so teams try and solidify a bit and will play more safely as the stakes are higher and less mistakes are affordable.

You see the same with Real Madrid in the group stage of the CL quite often. Not always impressive early on, then their solidity and experience and individual quality shine through in the knockouts.

I don't quite get what you are saying Hudd. It sounds like we should expect more defensive games in the knockout and then you say Real Madrid look better in the knockout stage??

It's not unusual for teams to go right through to the final looking unimpressive. I have seen over the years Germany, Portugal, and Italy do just that. If Southgate should do it as he did in the Euros I will still complain because, simply I want to be entertained and fired up watching England not bored to death as we collect a trophy. As I have said many times football excites me not pieces of silver, I can just go to my cutlery draw for that.

 

[The RDBD]

A tournament of this nature is effectively two tournaments. A team like England will mainly play teams they are better than in the group and will need to be more expansive to break teams down. Everyone is naturally better once you get past the groups, so teams try and solidify a bit and will play more safely as the stakes are higher and less mistakes are affordable.

You see the same with Real Madrid in the group stage of the CL quite often. Not always impressive early on, then their solidity and experience and individual quality shine through in the knockouts.

Once Madrid reach the "business end" of the CL,
they pull their finger out (because they have had the
talent and mentality to do so) . They have been able
to do this partly because of the squad "muscle
memory" that has accrued so many high pressure games.