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I'm sorry, but the notion that Jol is 'dithering' on transfers and hasn't bothered telling the board who/what he wants is ridiculous. I've got a brilliant image of Martin waking up on January 1st and thinking "what was it we were supposed to do this month...".

It borders on arrogance to think that a fan can be so much more insightful than a manager, like the manager doesn't watch the same games or see the players in training. If anyone here thinks they're so enlightened and that they can see there's problems within the team and Jol doesn't, then I despair, I really do. We don't know what goes on behind closed doors, for all I know Jol watches the team play every saturday, then goes home, sparks up a huge joint and plays Call of Duty until the next game comes around (which is what most seem to think). But I doubt it. Just because we don't see an RVP signing for us in the headlines every day, doesn't mean nothing is being done. It's not as though there are many transfers being done at all across the PL!

But this is pointless, I don't know why I bother! Every year we have a bad patch and the same faces surface and start a circle-jerk of doom and gloom. I'm going to be giving this forum a miss for a while, I see no benefit in reading 90% of what is said any more.
 
Bidley your acceptance of mediocrity,and the status quo, during what is a difficult time at the Cottage,
somewhat amazes me. Of the bottom 8 clubs we have the 2nd worst record in terms of points over the past
2 months. The items raised by 606rs are not flipant remarks,but real concerns by fans at the prediciment we now find
ourselves in. We probably will newer reach any dizzy heights,not even to the level Roy took us to,but maintaining our
Premier status must be our priority,and if that should mean at some stage, changing the man at the helm so be it.
Thats why, as I have previously said, Norwich must be decision day,and lets hope by then all this anguish will
have been forgotten.
 
Come back Bidley, without you we've got nobody capable of creating a genius image like Martin Jol sparking up a joint and playing Call of Duty for a week!

I know what you mean about the knee-jerk pessimism, and I think roscafre's characterisation of you (and, I guess he'd also include me and others) of having an 'acceptance of mediocrity' is more than a touch unfair. More positive minded fans like us care about the team just as much as the doom and gloom brigade, and both sides of the argument bring something valuable to the board.

Personally, I still think we'll be all right, but the 'bad run' has gone on for longer than I expected it to. It's a real problem that needs sorting out. That said, I don't expect Jol to depart in the coming weeks and I do expect things to improve. We've seen what a good side we're capable of being under Jol, even since Dembele's departure, and that gives me confidence that Jol is the man to sort things out.

I also don't think it's a good idea for fans to start imposing deadlines for when improvement 'has to' happen though. Some on this board were doing that with Mark Hughes throughout the first few months of his season (same with Jol last year) and I just don't see the point. When we say, 'such and such is a must win', 'if we don't win two out of the next four, he's got to go' or whatever it has no impact on Jol or the team or the board of directors. All it does is make us feel that another deadline has been set and perhaps missed when actually no such thing happened. If the club gives Jol an ultimatum, that would be a different matter, but any such decision would be behind closed doors and out of the public knowledge. When we do it, all we do is set ourselves up for more frustration. I believe as much as anyone that the club 'belongs' to the fans more than it does to the legal owners, the management or the players, but we can't kid ourselves that that translates to us being in charge.
 
I feel sorry for Jol at the minute, he's like a construction site manager who has just found out the fundings gone and he is left with the skeleton of a building. Either walks away or tries to carry on with the scraps around him.
 
Bidley said:
... for all I know Jol watches the team play every saturday, then goes home, sparks up a huge joint and plays Call of Duty until the next game comes around (which is what most seem to think). But I doubt it.
Click to expand...

You can't rule out eating those "special" cakes though!

On a serious note nobody believes that he is clueless. I think probably he is stubborn and wants to play the game as he sees it but the players he has available can't for various reasons.

As Captain says the bad spell is going for longer and we seem very predictable on our game. I would not mind that if we could win some of the so called "easy" games that we should win. And Captain I think when the team started the season behind closed doors the plan was to get 3 points against Soton, Wigan, Swansea, etc. at home. Something went wrong after the Sunderland game which we could have won even with 10 men...

Although not the manager my logic says we should try and sort one thing at a time. Jol can choose. The counter attack game we played worked well but that meant we defend solid and then play quickly up front. This has disappeared over the last games with Ruiz and Berba holding the ball but nobody up front. Only case was at West Brom with Kaca making a run... There are options just may be the discipline is not there or they are getting stressed if they don't score first.
 
Bidders stay on the forum ol son.
Personally I think the pessimism is just a perceived reaction when in reality its pure passion for our club to do well. Discussing options and why we're on a poor run is a way of getting things off my mind.

Jol is stuck between a rock and a hard place. He lost 2 attacking midfielders of real quality and then gets accused, allegedly, of bringing in too many attacking midfielders! I know I keep banging this drum but a lot of players are off form. Contracts talks are stalling, players and managers job security is in question and this has had a negative effect.
I think the club directors need to sort this out immediately.

Jol doesn't suddenly become a bad manager. I think he is a very good coach and good for Fulham. But like players, he needs to feel loved. All footballers have egos after all. Also, hell be coveted by other clubs in a flash so do Fulham want a top quality coach to take them forward? I hope so.
 
Bidley said:
I'm sorry, but the notion that Jol is 'dithering' on transfers and hasn't bothered telling the board who/what he wants is ridiculous. I've got a brilliant image of Martin waking up on January 1st and thinking "what was it we were supposed to do this month...".

It borders on arrogance to think that a fan can be so much more insightful than a manager, like the manager doesn't watch the same games or see the players in training. If anyone here thinks they're so enlightened and that they can see there's problems within the team and Jol doesn't, then I despair, I really do. We don't know what goes on behind closed doors, for all I know Jol watches the team play every saturday, then goes home, sparks up a huge joint and plays Call of Duty until the next game comes around (which is what most seem to think). But I doubt it. Just because we don't see an RVP signing for us in the headlines every day, doesn't mean nothing is being done. It's not as though there are many transfers being done at all across the PL!

But this is pointless, I don't know why I bother! Every year we have a bad patch and the same faces surface and start a circle-jerk of doom and gloom. I'm going to be giving this forum a miss for a while, I see no benefit in reading 90% of what is said any more.
Click to expand...

Drama queen! <diva>


<laugh>
 
Captain Morgan said:
I know what you mean about the knee-jerk pessimism, and I think roscafre's characterisation of you (and, I guess he'd also include me and others) of having an 'acceptance of mediocrity' is more than a touch unfair. More positive minded fans like us care about the team just as much as the doom and gloom brigade, and both sides of the argument bring something valuable to the board.
Click to expand...

I know what you mean as well. Also if Ros is going to start about this "lack of ambition" he thinks the club has again, I'll refer him to the "ambition" post from about a month ago. It's not an "Acceptance of Mediocrity" we have, its that we believe in expanding the club slowly and with a more long term vision (also without chucking stupid money around and getting it wrong, no names mentioned of course;))

Captain Morgan said:
I also don't think it's a good idea for fans to start imposing deadlines for when improvement 'has to' happen though. Some on this board were doing that with Mark Hughes throughout the first few months of his season (same with Jol last year) and I just don't see the point. When we say, 'such and such is a must win', 'if we don't win two out of the next four, he's got to go' or whatever it has no impact on Jol or the team or the board of directors. All it does is make us feel that another deadline has been set and perhaps missed when actually no such thing happened. If the club gives Jol an ultimatum, that would be a different matter, but any such decision would be behind closed doors and out of the public knowledge. When we do it, all we do is set ourselves up for more frustration. I believe as much as anyone that the club 'belongs' to the fans more than it does to the legal owners, the management or the players, but we can't kid ourselves that that translates to us being in charge.
Click to expand...

Too bloody right.

I've said this before somewhere, but the people who work in football for a job know what they're doing better than the fans. The board will know exactly where to draw the line. I have had my trust in Jol shaken a bit recently (still don't want him to go) but my faith in the board is total.

I do have one point to disagree with Captain, if the board did choose to sack Jol I think Adkins would be a great replacement. I accept he's not very "Fulahm-ish" at the moment but we can always make him learn haha
 
Cottager58 said:
Bidley, that's not what I said.
Click to expand...

I apologise if I misinterpreted what you said, that's what I took from it.

roscafre said:
Bidley your acceptance of mediocrity
Click to expand...

Nope. I want what we have now to do the business, not an endless cycle of managers and players.

I agree with every Captain says, it mirrors my thoughts. We can give deadlines and berate others for "accepting mediocrity" or otherwise, but at the end of the day it really doesn't matter, we're just winding eachother up.

On reflection my flounce/hissy fit was a little OTT (I'm having a bit of a 'trough' at the moment), but are you not entertained? <laugh>
 
I see Fat Sam rested 3 of his best players last night, targeting the next match obviously! <whistle>
 
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