Match Day Thread Vs Chelsea (A)

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Hendo's average and does a decent job. I don't expect him to get many if any goals or assists, but I do expect him to turn on the ball and look for forward passes to start the attacks from deep and yet he rarely does that. What's the point in standing right in front of the CBs to collect the ball if it just goes right back to the other CB? Similarly when he picks up the ball from the flanks, he turns towards goal and plays it back or across 9 times out of 10.

I know we talk about specific roles for specific positions and as a defensive midfielder, his objective is to break up the play yada yada, but just expect more from players - from captains! - at one of the top clubs. Most would probably agree that Kante is the best DM right now? Breaks play up beautifully, but is happy to turn and move forward with the ball or pass it through the midfield if he can. If he can't, he'll then pass it back or sidewards and try again later. Hendo plays it sidewards or back and then looks up to see what he could have done with it.

Can't wait for Fabinho to get up to speed. Hendo's decent, but not good enough to boss a midfield.
 
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johnsonsbaby said:
Maybe I worded it badly - quite possible <laugh> I was looking more at Henderson in the captain's position/role? He needs to be a positive force, driving the team forward, willing them on like Gerrard did. Whatever tactical position he has in the team he should be leading the team and part of that from his midfield position is to chip in with goals.

Scoring goals isn't part of a captain's job, obviously. If VVD was captain, for example, his tactical position dictates that he won't score many goals but he is leading the defence and hence the team and making the team function better as a whole. Henderson should be doing that too. He is in a tactical position to look to play forward more and get in amongst the goals himself, he's certainly got it in him, we've seen it, albeit not for a long time. When Henderson missed the end of the season we finished 2nd in, he was a big loss because he was a threat himself. He still does a steady job for us but I feel he could do a lot more.
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Completely agree mate, you worded it appallingly ;)
 
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Klopp's Mannschaft said:
Hendo's average and does a decent job. I don't expect him to get many if any goals or assists, but I do expect him to turn on the ball and look for forward passes to start the attacks from deep and yet he rarely does that. What's the point in standing right in front of the CBs to collect the ball if it just goes right back to the other CB? Similarly when he picks up the ball from the flanks, he turns towards goal and plays it back or across 9 times out of 10.

I know we talk about specific roles for specific positions and as a defensive midfielder, his objective is to break up the play yada yada, but just expect more from players - from captains! - at one of the top clubs. Most would probably agree that Kante is the best DM right now? Breaks play up beautifully, but is happy to turn and move forward with the ball or pass it through the midfield if he can. If he can't, he'll then pass it back or sidewards and try again later. Hendo plays it sidewards or back and then looks up to see what he could have done with it.

Can't wait for Fabinho to get up to speed. Hendo's decent, but not good enough to boss a midfield.
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Agree 100%.

Unfortunately, you have pundits and the media blowing smoke up his arse constantly which creates the narrative that he’s a top class player.
 
saintKlopp said:
Comparing Hendo with one of the best midfielders of his era is harsh, imo. It's that comparison which has dogged the guy since he took over.
He's never going to be that player, he is what he is.
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You're right but I want him to be what he used to be. All competitions - 12/15 he scored 18 goals, 15/18 he's scored 4.

Teams evolve, players are asked to change how and where they play to best suit the team. Something happened along the way that changed him for the worse and not the better. I've always liked him, still do but he frustrates me no end now with his - first thought back pass - style of play.
 
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johnsonsbaby said:
You're right but I want him to be what he used to be. All competitions - 12/15 he scored 18 goals, 15/18 he's scored 4.

Teams evolve, players are asked to change how and where they play to best suit the team. Something happened along the way that changed him for the worse and not the better. I've always liked him, still do but he frustrates me no end now with his - first thought back pass - style of play.
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not sure that's a fair comparison to be honest when we talk about goals.

From 12/15 he was playins as the box to box midfielder making runs into the box late as you had first Gerrard and Lucas holding the fort down. Under Klopp he's been using him as the holding midfielder and you rarely ever seen him join the attacks as he used to. No wonder he ain't getting the goals (although he is very lack lustre and safe when he feels any little bit of pressure)
 
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johnsonsbaby said:
You're right but I want him to be what he used to be. All competitions - 12/15 he scored 18 goals, 15/18 he's scored 4.

Teams evolve, players are asked to change how and where they play to best suit the team. Something happened along the way that changed him for the worse and not the better. I've always liked him, still do but he frustrates me no end now with his - first thought back pass - style of play.
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I think Bobby's right, jb. His role is different now.
I think he's doing what he's been told to do - I really don't think Klopp would be playing him if he wasn't.
 
BobbyD said:
not sure that's a fair comparison to be honest when we talk about goals.

From 12/15 he was playins as the box to box midfielder making runs into the box late as you had first Gerrard and Lucas holding the fort down. Under Klopp he's been using him as the holding midfielder and you rarely ever seen him join the attacks as he used to. No wonder he ain't getting the goals (although he is very lack lustre and safe when he feels any little bit of pressure)
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I agree.
As to the last sentence - he does these sort of passes (square or back) when he's around the half-way line and just in front of the CB's. He doesn't want to get caught in possession in a dangerous area - something Can came a cropper on several times - so he plays safe.
Passing across the back line moves the opposition about in front and lets your forwards move to try and find space and it's a case of waiting for the right opportunity to put in a decent through-ball, rather than a speculative one to a forward under pressure.
I think I must be the only one on here who doesn't have a problem with it. :)
 
johnsonsbaby said:
Yeh, I acknowledged that in my post. I wonder if the back passing is tactical after all.:emoticon-0138-think
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oh totally acknowledge that you mentioned he does things differently now. What i was arguing against was you mentioning this difference indicated he was worse. Maybe i've misread what you wrote but scoring less goals doesn't mean he is worse. His responsibilities are different so he doesn't get those opportunities unless you mean his goalscoring is just worse than before (pardon my english)
 
BobbyD said:
oh totally acknowledge that you mentioned he does things differently now. What i was arguing against was you mentioning this difference indicated he was worse. Maybe i've misread what you wrote but scoring less goals doesn't mean he is worse. His responsibilities are different so he doesn't get those opportunities unless you mean his goalscoring is just worse than before (pardon my english)
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Why - have you gone all foreign on us?
 
BobbyD said:
oh totally acknowledge that you mentioned he does things differently now. What i was arguing against was you mentioning this difference indicated he was worse. Maybe i've misread what you wrote but scoring less goals doesn't mean he is worse. His responsibilities are different so he doesn't get those opportunities unless you mean his goalscoring is just worse than before (pardon my english)
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I think scoring less goals and him not being as good generally, happened at the same time i.e. there's a correlation.
 
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