....but by your own logic any deal between the Labour party, SNP and Plaid Cymru which doesn't involve granting independence to Wales and Scotland will mean that all concerned have sold out their voters! When people are voting for Plaid or SNP they are voting for independence...just like anyone who voted for the Lib Dems were voting for abolishing tuition fees, yes? So if they don't secure this "flagship policy" they are ditching their principles yes? The people who vote for Labour are pro Union yes? So any deal that is seen by voters to weaken the Union means that they have sold their voters down the river yes? ....and the constitution of this country is a bit more important than a Tuition fee policy. In reality, the parties will have to negotiate and concede in certain areas in order to do a deal so that this country can move forward so let's have less of the sanctimonious claptrap concerning the Lib Dems and tuition fees shall we?
Have you heard Leanne Wood promise independence this election? Have you heard Nicola Sturgen promise independence this election? Clegg promised to abolish tuition fees. It was THE flagship policy. As a result, hundreds of thousands of students/potential students voted for Lib Dems. He thanked their support by betraying them by trebling tuition fees. The difference with Plaid and SNP is that they have stated that they won't prop up a Tory government and negotiate the best deals possible for Wales and Scotland or there will be no deal. Nick Clegg bent over for the Tories because they offered him the DPM role. If I remember correctly, Labour refused to give him that position (or an important position) so he done a deal that on personal ambition. As for Labour, I trust them as much as the Tories. They have confirmed that spending cuts are needed but refuse to identify where they will come. That is why we need Plaid and SNP to hold Labour to account.
Plaid and SNP couldn't possibly win the UK election is the difference (but independence is what they stand for). They've also learnt lessons from this coalition and their own coalitions in Scotland and Wales. The policy has reduced what students pay (apart from the richest) and increased funding for universities (which was necessary). They didn't win People didn't vote for spending less on nuclear weapons and more on education I'm afraid. This is all that was possible in the circumstances Those who call that a betrayal have an agenda So you (and others) state that the Tories and Labour are the same yet you hold up Plaid and SNP as superior because they'll only do a deal with the Labour party I'm sorry Valley but this is the politics of spite. Like it or not the Tories will get the most votes and the most seats in a first past the post system. Yet you are advocating they are excluded from government. How on earth is that fair and right. Principles eh Re: your idea that Clegg did the deal with the Tories in order to become DPM...this is incorrect and later (when/if I can find the time) I will dig up some stuff from the time.
This is what happens when you have a weak loss making economy that heads straight into a massive recession. Was it worth it? well the IMF seem to think so.
I've voted yesterday when the voting papers arrived, not voted for the lib dem morons or the nasty party turds. Also haven't voted for anyone who couldn't possibly lead our country, so that's ukip, plaid or the monster raving luny party out
There you go again, jumping to false conclusions. As for the Lib Dems taking minimal damage, your percentage vote has dropped from 23% to 8%. That's a catastrophe for yourselves and there's no sign that you are going to make a recovery. That's what you get for making a gigantic U turn on the mandate you got elected on and then acting as a crutch for probably the most despised government in recent political history. The British electorate haven't forgotten and it's payback time for Nick and his fellow crutches. You may want to forget the tuitions fees issue - but the electorate won't.
You will be in meltdown come polling day Terror son, just accept you punishment like a man for snuggling up to the Tory scum, as for you Mickey mouse view on all those crap zero hour jobs and part time work, get real. There are now 11 Million in work and claiming benefits, because of the pittance wages. You really did make work pay didn't you? Not, and you want people to vote for your shower................... You and your Tory scum using the Benefits system to subsidise your corporate mates wage bill in the city and throughout the country, of course we are 'all in this together' garbage you can stick up your rear end...........
That's not the only issue either, they forced many into 0 hour contract jobs, part time jobs, and jobs they would never do themselves, and now we have 11 Million in work that are being subsidised by the benefits system. Using tax payers money to subsidise big business. I cannot wait to see the back of this scum Tory coalition.............. Not only did the Lib-Dem not get everything their own way (fair enough), they failed so serve as even a handbrake, and got next to none of their policies through, at what cost? They betrayed those who voted for them and became little more than puppets, not partners; there is a big difference. If they were not comfortable with Tory policy, they could have left the coalition at any time; they chose not to and deserve their hammerings accordingly, and if the polls are to be believed, then a hammering it will be.
Here's a view I agree with: "Let us flip it and say that the Lib Dems did not enter into a coalition. If they had no part in Government, then they could have wielded little power beyond blocking the minority Government's proposals, if their position aligned with Labour's. This state would have provided a more legitimate excuse for not judging them as liars for failing to deliver on promises as they would have had no position from which they could have implemented policy. Ironically however, they might have been closer to achieving their manifesto pledges, for example by blocking the tuition fee hikes. If the Tories formed a minority Government, the opposition could have swatted aside any legislation they did not like; so Tory voters would not have been in a position to expect the Tory policies to be implemented in their entirety either. Instead, we got the Lib Dems acquiescing to almost all the Tory pledges, in return for practically sweet F.A. Not only did they fail to get a reasonable proportion of their manifesto pledges met, they actually did the polar opposite of what they promised in their manifesto in numerous circumstances. All this whilst having members in key cabinet positions, and having a say in Government matters. So I put it to you that, whilst they were never going to have the opportunity to implement all of their policies or even half, they nevertheless sold out for a whiff of power, and achieved nothing with it. Going back on some of their pledges does indeed make them liars." - iccleste And that's a view agreed by most, and why the Lib-Dem will be punished on polling day.............
Here's a list Terror , of what Clegg didn't block these last 5 years : REALITY CHECK FOR PEOPLE WHO ARE STILL THINKING OF VOTING LIBDEM; None of the following could have happened without the LibDems. They have been the Tory enablers & they have to bear responsibility for that & no amount of weasel words will excuse them from that . It truly is a damning indictment of their party. Clegg & the rest of the Tory enabling LibDems performance & record in government : 2010-2014 NHS - Health and Social Care Act 2012 Thanks to Liberal Democrat votes they must share responsibility for wasting £3billion on a top-down NHS reorganisation while more people wait longer in A&Es and over 5,000 nurses are cut. Tuition Fees: Trebling Tuition Fees to £9000 (despite promising to abolish them. Educational Maintenance Allowance (EMA) Lib Dems helped Tories abolish it Bedroom Tax (Spare Room Subsidy) Voted with the Tories to charge poor people between £14 and £24.00 PER WEEK inflicting distress and suffering on millions, now over 50,000 people are in rent arrears and face eviction and the figures will continue to increase. Privatisation of Probation Service VAT BOMBSHELL In opposition Clegg & LibDems spoke of "TORY VAT BOMBSHELL" then voted with Tories to increase VAT to 20% Part Privatisation of prison service Bombing Syria Voted /supported With Tories to bomb Syria Sure Start Centres Supported Tories to close over 558 Sure Start Centres (so far) despite promising not to, Cut Income Tax for Millionaires Backed a Tory cut in the top rate of tax, giving 13,000 millionaires a tax cut worth an average £100,000 while millions are paying more. Falling Living Standards Clegg says he's making life "fairer and easier" with tax cuts, however, wages are down £1,500 since the election and a million young people out of work. Mansion Tax Nick Clegg said "The Mansion Tax is right, it makes sense and the Liberal Democrats will continue to make the case for it. they said they would "stick to their guns" however when given the chance to stand up for their own principles and vote for a mansion tax, Liberal Democrat MPs voted against it. Constitutional Reform Nick Clegg said his constitutional reform programme would be "the biggest shake-up of our democracy since the Great Reform Act of 1832". It wasn't. He abandoned Lords reform after Conservative MPs refused to back it, and he failed to deliver reform of the voting system. Police In the Liberal Democrat manifesto, Nick Clegg promised to put 3,000 more police on the beat. But in Government they backed Tory plans to cut more than 15,000 police officers. Special Advisers In opposition, the Liberal Democrats said that special advisers "are political jobs, and should, therefore, be funded by political parties". They changed their tune when they got into Government. Nick Clegg alone has sixteen Special Advisers - paid for at the taxpayers' expense. Food banks Soaring use of food banks Utilities Soaring cost of gas, electricity and water. Child Poverty There are now 2.6million kids in the UK being brought up in hardship, with more than half of them in working households. The number of children living in poverty has leapt by 300,000 under the Coalition Government. Environment Meant to be "greenest" government ever, but helping Tories introduce Fracking Lobbying Bill Not one single Liberal Democrat MP opposed the party of the government’s draconian Lobbying Bill that muzzles charities and campaigners. Secret Courts In an Act of Parliament Liberal Democrat MPs voted in favour of Secret Courts and helped put on the statute books just five months ago! Now they have the cheek to say they will repeal it? Then why vote it through? Is this what Clegg calls blocking the excesses of the Tories? Voting something through then saying they will repeal it? Legal Aid Liberal Democrats voted with the Tories to stop ordinary people gaining access to legal aid; Judicial Review The curtailing of judicial review. Workers Rights Removing workers rights to a tribunal and charging them at least £1000 to bring a case Bankers Bonuses: While most of us never see a bonus in our lifetime Royal Mail given away to Dave’s fat cat hedge fund mates stealing millions from the British taxpayer Grateful thanks to Graysoon for the above information, and Terror the weasel has the brass balls to ask to vote LIBDEM? I ask, is he for real or what?...................
It's looking like labour will hold the controlling power with a most certain hung parliament as only ukip would jump into bed with the Tories and that would be Cameron's worst nightmare and he cant rely on the libdems as they wont have enough seats to form a 5 aside football match. All the other parties want the Tories gone and would never work with them so that leaves labour in the driving seat to make deals with other parties to form a government......
I've voted already, if you are a postal voter watch out for the envelope through the letterbox in next couple of days
Yup, I've already voted for the only party in Wales who has publicly ruled out doing a deal with the Tories
Nick Clegg to lay down key demands in coalition negotiations Nick Clegg is to outline on Thursday the red lines that the Liberal Democrats will demand to see in any coalition deal they negotiate with the Tories or the Labour party if a hung parliament is elected on 7 May. In a speech in Oxford West and Abingdon – a Conservative-held seat being targeted by the Lib Dems – the deputy prime minister will reach out to moderate Tories by pledging to guarantee schools spending and to balance the budget in a fair way. The pledges will be among five commitments that will appear on the front page of the Lib Dem manifesto for the general election that will be launched in full after parliament is dissolved at the end of next month. The party has pledged to protect the schools budget in real terms, including early years and 16-to-19 education. The Conservative party has said it will freeze education funding for school-aged children, which the Institute of Fiscal Studies said would amount to a 7% cut. The other pledges are to: Raise the tax free personal allowance to £12,500 to benefit low-paid workers. Meet the challenge posed by Simon Stevens, the head of NHS England, by investing an extra £8bn on the NHS in the next parliament. Protecting the environment by introducing five green laws. The party stopped short of calling the five pledges red lines. But Lib Dem sources confirmed that they would form the core of the party’s demands in any coalition negotiations with Labour or the Tories. Clegg has spoken of how the Lib Dems would give a “spine” to a Labour-led government, by giving it greater fiscal credibility, and a “heart” to a Tory-led government by reining in George Osborne’s spending cuts. A Lib Dem source said: “We are not going to speculate on coalition negotiations. But these are our top priorities. We will fight tooth and nail to secure these goals in the next parliament. Look what we did last time. We had four policies on the front page of our manifesto and we delivered them. We expect to deliver on these this time round.” The four pledges on the front of the Lib Dem manifesto in 2010 were to deliver fair taxes, give a fair chance to every child, build a fair future by creating green jobs and creating a fair deal by cleaning up politics. The most famous Lib Dem pledge in 2010 – to “scrap unfair university tuition fees for all students taking their first degree” – appeared on page 39. The Lib Dems suffered an immense political blow when they agreed to abandon that commitment in late 2010 when tuition fees were trebled. Clegg, who will launch the front page of the manifesto in a speech at a primary school in the Oxford West and Abingdon seat that was held by the Lib Dems between 1997-2010, will make clear that the party will take a cautious approach on spending. He is expected to say that “balancing the books, in full and on time” is essential to creating a fairer society. “Get that right and everything else can follow.” “Politicians have had to make difficult choices with less money at our disposal. And there are more difficult choices to come”, Clegg will say. “That’s why priorities matter.” The party says that of the five – which have all been announced before – education is the the top priority. In his speech, Clegg will describe the Lib Dems as “the party of education”, saying the party has prioritised education over the past five years in government. “Nothing is more central to what we believe”, he will say. “Nothing is more important to creating a fairer society where everyone has the opportunity to reach their potential.” Asked whether the party is nervous about naming education as its top priority after its famous failure to deliver on a pledge to abolish university tuition fees, a party spokesperson said the Liberal Democrats had “got the best deal [they] could” and that the coalition government’s current university funding policy was working. “The [Institute for Fiscal Studies] called it one of the most progressive changes this government has made”, he said. “There are record rates of people going to university now – record rates of kids from disadvantaged backgrounds, record rates kids from black and minority ethnic backgrounds.”
General Election 2010: talks between Labour and Liberal Democrats break down Coalition talks between Labour and the Liberal Democrats have broken down and Gordon Brown is quitting as Prime Minister. The development paves the way for the Conservatives to agree a power-sharing deal with Nick Clegg's party. It comes after senior Labour figures urged Gordon Brown to "call it quits" on efforts to form a coalition government with the Liberal Democrats. There were reports that Mr Brown was set to resign as prime minister on Tuesday night. The Lib Dems opened up talks with Labour yesterday morning but at a meeting late last night, some Lib Dem MPs shifted back towards a Tory deal. One senior Lib Dem said: "There is a sense that the party has realised that the Conservative deal is the best deal on offer. The Tories are desperate and they've improved their offer a lot. "As long as the party can get over the emotional hurdle of backing the Tories, that's where we'll end up." A Tory close to the talks said: "They've realised a deal with Labour would be a disaster for them. We're optimistic." Labour sources also cast doubt on a Labour-Lib Dem deal, pointing out that many Labour MPs oppose such a pact. David Blunkett, the former home secretary, has spoken against a deal, arguing it would ultimately harm Labour. "A lot of people agree with that," said one Labour MP. Lord Falconer told the BBC: "I think we are not going to form this progressive alliance. It was right to start talks yesterday because it may be that what the Liberal Democrats were saying was that they couldn't do a deal with the Tories. "But if it's plain that they can and the only way that one can do a deal with the Liberal Democrats was offering things that wouldn't be acceptable to a majority in the Labour Party, then I think we've got to stop." There will be a joint meeting of the Liberal Democrat parliamentary party and ruling federal executive at 7.30pm tonight. The meeting is due to take place at Local Government House in central London. Under the Liberal Democrat rule book, Mr Clegg must secure 75% support from both bodies to sign up to a deal with either Labour or the Tories. Indications have already emerged that any deal with the Tories would be an awkward one. After Gordon Brown disclosed last night that Nick Clegg had made overtures towards him while simultaneously courting David Cameron, senior Conservatives hit out. Lord Heseltine, a former Tory Cabinet minister, claimed Mr Brown’s attempted deal with the Lib Dems was “party politics at its most sordid”. He added: “This is mind blowing. I don’t know how anyone would have such a barefaced nerve as to put such a proposition in the circumstances. The only viable solution is for David Cameron to become the prime minister.” A senior shadow cabinet minister said: “This is clear treachery on Nick Clegg’s part. He was saying one thing to us and planning another with Brown.” Meanwhile, Lord Ashdown, a close friend of Mr Clegg described the Conservatives as "rabidly anti-European", and suggested that in return for the stability of an alliance with Mr Cameron, the Lib Dems could be compromising on "the programme that is best for the country." The Tories tried to counter Mr Brown's offer to the Liberal Democrats by offering new concessions last night. William Hague, the chief Tory negotiator, last night committed the party to a referendum on a new, alternative vote (AV), system of electing MPs. Under such a system the Lib Dems would have gained 22 more seats in last week's election, though party activists believe an even more radical move towards full proportional representation is necessary. So, the Tories made a better offer. It's that simple. The Labour party did not want any part of clearing up their mess as they knew unpopular decisions would need to be made....so they offered the Lib Dems **** all. One of Phillip's "points" was that the Lib Dems failed to change the voting system. They got the best deal they could (again) and as a result voters were offered the chance to vote for an AV system...which would have been a good start on the road to PR. Do you remember it? Labour campaigned with the Tory "scum" to keep the first past the post system. Got that Phillip? They worked with the "Tory Scum" to ensure that their own interests prevailed over the voters interests. Principles eh?
THE COALITION NEGOTIATIONS (For grown ups) Further talks Liberal Democrat leader Nick Clegg held face-to-face talks with his Conservative counterpart. One of the chief issues that the Liberal Democrats wished to address in any coalition agreement was that of electoral reform, and as Party members debated the negotiations, a 1,000 strong crowd of protesters from the pressure group 38 Degrees gathered outside. Amid chants of "Fair votes now" and "We want to speak to Nick", Clegg briefly left the meeting to accept a petition and told the protesters, "Reforming politics is one of the reasons I went into politics." After the meeting, a Liberal Democrats negotiator, David Laws, said members had "endorsed in full" the strategy outlined by Clegg that the Conservatives should have first choice in negotiations on forming a government. Clegg also met with the Party's federal executive, which also endorsed Clegg's decision. Negotiations continue On Sunday 9 May, senior negotiators from the Liberal Democrats and Conservatives embarked on six hours of talks at the Cabinet Office, which were described as "very positive and productive". William Hague emerged from the discussions to say, "The issues that we have covered have included political reform, economic issues and reduction of the deficit, banking reform, civil liberties, environmental issues. So, we've had good discussions about all of those areas. We are agreed that a central part of any agreement that we make will be economic stability and the reduction of the budget deficit, but each negotiating team is now going to report to our party leaders." As the negotiations were taking place, Gordon Brown returned to Downing Street and held a meeting with Nick Clegg at the Foreign Office for talks. A Downing Street spokesman later confirmed the talks, together with the previous evening's telephone conversation between Brown and Clegg, which was described as "an amicable discussion." However, Paddy Ashdown – a previous Liberal Democrat leader – offered a different view of the Brown-Clegg conference call, telling the BBC it "was a diatribe, a rant, and that Gordon Brown was threatening in his approach to Nick Clegg." Following the success of the talks between their two parties, Clegg and Cameron held a second round of face-to-face discussions at Westminster that evening, lasting 45 minutes. Labour enters the picture Labour leader Gordon Brown was seen as a major stumbling block to forming a coalition with the Liberal Democrats. Monday 10 May saw another day of talks between the Conservatives and Liberal Democrats, but at a meeting with his MPs, Nick Clegg was urged to give assurances over offers which were being made by David Cameron's team. They also wished him to continue negotiations with Labour. During the day it emerged that senior Labour and Liberal Democrat representatives had held discussions about forming a coalition, but that one of the barriers to this was the continued presence of Gordon Brown as Prime Minister.[ At 5.00pm that afternoon Brown announced that he would step down as Labour leader by September. In a statement he said that he intended to "Ask the Labour Party to set in train the processes needed for its own leadership election." The statement went on to say, "I would hope that it would be completed in time for the new leader to be in post by the time of the Labour Party conference. I will play no part in that contest, I will back no individual candidate." He also urged any prospective candidates for the position to wait until coalition negotiations were complete before announcing their candidacy. Following this announcement, formal talks began between Labour and the Liberal Democrats, but many in the Party felt that a Labour-Liberal Democrat coalition was an unrealistic prospect since it would still fall short of the 326 seats needed to form a majority government, with 315 seats to the Conservatives' 306. Labour MP Graham Stringer said, "I don't think it makes sense in the arithmetic – the numbers don't add up."[ However, in his account of Labour's negotiations with the Liberal Democrats, Andrew Adonis – who participated in the talks – writes that the general consensus among members of Gordon Brown's cabinet was that talks between the Conservatives and Liberal Democrats would reach an impasse. "[The] process would turn to our favour once the Tories and Lib Dems had rehearsed the extent of their differences". With Labour now attempting to form its own coalition government, the Conservatives promised the Liberal Democrats a referendum on changing the voting mechanism to the Alternative Vote (AV) system. In response Labour said that it would introduce AV then hold a public referendum to approve it. In a statement outlining his decision to negotiate with Labour, Clegg said that although his party had made progress with the Conservatives, they had not "reached a comprehensive partnership agreement for a full Parliament" and negotiating with Labour was the "responsible thing to do". The possibility of some SNP involvement in a Labour-led government materialised when Angus Robertson, the SNP's leader in the House of Commons suggested its MPs would be willing to join Labour, the Liberal Democrats, Plaid Cymru and MPs from other smaller parties to form a rainbow coalition. It was reported on 10 May that a meeting to discuss this scenario was held between Robertson, the SNP Chief Whip Stewart Hosie and Cabinet Office officials the previous evening. However, Labour's Douglas Alexander said he could not foresee a situation in which Labour could enter into government with the SNP because the two parties had "fundamental differences", and he made it clear that no senior Labour officials had been approached by anyone from the SNP.
Nick Clegg: I could work with Miliband if voters wanted 17 September 2013 From the section UK Politics please log in to view this image Mr Clegg has faced questions about what he will do if no party got a majority in 2015 Lib Dem leader Nick Clegg has suggested he could serve alongside Labour's Ed Miliband in a coalition government if that is what the voters wanted. Mr Clegg said he would be prepared to work with Labour after the election if the circumstances dictated it and if the "details were got right". Personalities would not come into it, he told the BBC's Nick Robinson. Asked about Mr Miliband's suitability to be PM, Mr Clegg said he had "no idea" but queried his lack of policies. With the next election only 20 months away, Mr Clegg is facing questions about what he would do if no party got a majority in 2015. The Lib Dem leader has always said he would guided by the wishes of the British people, in terms of the electoral arithmetic, in any negotiations should the next election not produce an outright winner. 'No kingmaker' He said his negotiations with Gordon Brown about a potential Lib-Lab coalition in 2010 had come to nothing, partly because it would not - unlike the arrangement with the Conservatives - have been able to command a majority in Parliament. Mr Clegg said he would, hypothetically, be willing to serve in a coalition government led by Mr Miliband - an outcome that would depend on Labour being the largest party after the election but not being able to govern on its own. "It isn't about my personal preference, it isn't about whether this person likes that person more or whether they get on better with this person, it is not about that. It is about following the instruction manual handed to us," he said. "Of course I would serve in a Labour/Liberal Democrat coalition if that is clearly what the British people want and, of course, if it is possible to assemble a coalition of the Labour and Liberal Democrat parties". In an interview with the BBC's political editor, the Lib Dem leader said he was not seeking to become the perpetual kingmaker of British politics but believed a coalition was the best guarantor of the economic recovery and that a single-party Conservative or Labour government would "mess things up again". 'On a plate' Asked about Mr Miliband's prospects, Mr Clegg said people should not be judged "until they have been able to prove themselves". But he suggested Labour had a lot of work to do on policy before they could be considered credible. "I think there is a bit of a blank at the moment in what the Labour Party thinks. "I personally think that the Labour Party and Ed Miliband himself... have assumed that somehow the general election is going to be delivered to them on a plate simply by criticising the coalition and the difficult decisions we have had to make - often unpopular decisions to clean up the mess they left behind." Amid speculation about the coalition's longevity - which has been questioned by Vince Cable among others - Mr Clegg said that there would be no disengagement before the general election. "We will see this through to 2015. It is a decision for the leader. "I am the leader of the party and I have made it very clear to demonstrate that coalition government works but also to demonstrate that we are doing the job of clearing up this monumental economic mess left by Labour that we need the full five years to get the job going." Mr Clegg will make his leader's address to conference on Wednesday.
