While we seem to be very literal and definition-crazy: scum (noun) 1. A layer of unpleasant or unwanted material that has formed on the top of a liquid. 2. (noun informal) A worthless or contemptible person or group. Is Trump unpleasant? Could Trump be described as 'unwanted'? Has Trump risen to the top? Is Trump worthless? Is Trump contemptible?
If you read the preceding discussion you will see that I have already told Cologne that it is not about definitions. He told us all what Nazi, Fascist etc mean - in case we did not know. You are repeating him. My response is that the definition of a pig leads you to a very good social animal - but find me someone who wants to be called one. Equally tell me if you would like someone to call you scum. Anyway although I would equally not call Trump's voters scum however much I disagree with their views I actually raised the issue not when Fez called them scum but when BB called Tories scum.
I think go back a few years before the term scum was popularised and it was used to mean people who lived off of others efforts... literally the froth on top of society. It has been made a more vilifying word in recent times IMO Mind you didn't Trump get all his money from his family???
Ok. Leo, I take your point. I was not intending to embark on a history lesson with that post - though many people do actually use these terms innacurately. sometimes through ignorance, sometimes deliberately. It is not necessary to use abusive terms when describing political opponents, and this does come from both sides. But are you asking us to be saints ? Would it be eg. ok. to describe Hitler as a monster - or would it be discriminatory against monsters ? If so, where is the borderline ?
This is not aimed at you Yorkie. It is about more than one single word. It is about humanity. Can any of you ever approve of calling somebody a term which is meant to be an insult as opposed to confronting them and telling them their ideas are vile? Is it a person who is vile or their views? I hate crimes not criminals; murders not murderers. I thought a number of people on this board had religious or humanitarian views yet I am not seeing evidence of it. Would Christ ever have called a person scum? The Dalai Lama? Ghandi? Mandela? When you personalise attitudes you do not approve of you dehumanise people - you also lump them together to become some sort of creature that is not human. That is where racism etc start. It is the basis of all discrimination. I have said enough on this subject now. I am amazed to find myself almost on my own in loathing the use of insults at people or groups of people. I will watch but say no more. Be as vile as you like about all groups that you disapprove of. The Tories are clearly sub-human for having a different set of values to some people on here. Luckily I also now use another forum for political discussion where there is a vast range of opinions and the use of abuse is given a straight yellow card.
Historic figures I guess are not going to complain. I have friends who are Tories, Labour etc, even some who are MPs. Certainly people who vote for them. They are not scum - nobody is - I loathe what UKIP stand for but do not call a single UKIP voter or politician scum. No - I am not asking anyone to be saints but would like people to think about what they call others and have the decency to admit that name calling is not how to conduct yourself as a civilised being. We make mistakes and we do things we are not proud of. But on here I see people who clearly stand by their words and are proud of them. It takes all sorts. I bet that sort of post does not induce a single person to contribute to this board though. Any Tory supporter will stay well clear. Let's face it we have already driven away all bar one.
Cheap cheap cheap. Next time you preach your sermons invite me to the Church of Hypocrisy to watch you.
Hypocrisy? Where? Please elaborate. At least I don't just throw about passive aggressive digs at others.
Leo your stance on this subject is 100% correct, please persevere asking for decency. It is ridiculous labelling one particular group. There are some very decent Tories and pretty awful so called socialists such as Mandelson. Labour's Frank Field is one of the working class's best supporters but occasional agrees with what is seen as Tory policies. Dr. Sarah Wollaston is a Tory who is always criticising and challenging policies on the NHS. Life is much more complicated than some would like.
I think we only need to look at our own families here. Very few of us come from families where everyone votes one way. My mother was an SNP supporter, my father a Tory (influence of the military), my brother is a Tory and my 2 sisters Labour. My circle of friends has never been decided by political choice, and I guess that must be the same for many on here.
I was just highlighting how daft it is calling one group of people 'scum' It adds nothing to political debate.
You pretend to care about people and then you defend calling random Tory voters scum - even though many are from the working class you claim to sympathise with (they just have different views) , you accuse me of being on a high horse because I try to point out that abusing groups of people is the first step in victimisation and discrimination and you have constantly attacked SH for using relatively inoffensive terms like Comrade Corbyn yet you use scum to suit your views. A hypocrite is someone who does one thing and preaches another. I accuse you of that on the evidence I see. So not a passive aggressive dig at all. Unlike your high horse barb - another example of hypocrisy.
Maybe, maybe not. But scum describes trump and his troglodyte government rather aptly. Religiously bigoted, homophobic, elitist, science denying, misogynistic, narcissistic, nepotistic, both casually and openly racist, propagandist, provocative and overly protectionist. There, I think that covers it. If that leaves little room for debate then that is hardly my fault. They are what they are and what we have seen from them thus far is repugnant, shameful and none too terrifying.
I NEVER called Tory voters scum. Some of them probably are, same as Labour voters, etc... You called me a fool. You made subtle digs at me in your post to BB, and other digs at other posters left right and centre. My issue with the Comrade Corbyn was that I was told to not insult Tories, yet SH and w_y thought it was fine to do so with JC. I was pointing out the hypocrisy. The high horse remark is because you have decided that the word 'scum' is unacceptable, and went on a multi-post rant about how much better you were than people that decided to use it to categorise a select few people in a political party. If JC was in power and the Labour party acted the same I would call them the same.
I would agree with every adjective you use in describing Trump, I only have a problem with the last one. I see nothing wrong in protecting markets against cheap imports - to do otherwise is to place your own workers in direct competition with those abroad, direction basement economy. I would also punish firms which outsourced and then tried to sell on home markets.
I am on no high horse - but if you do not want a b I did not say you called Tory voters scum. Read my comment properly - I said you defended other on that. When did I call you a fool ? Reference please. Which digs do you refer to other than those direct ones where I abhored the use of calling people scum, They were not meant to be subtle but direct. Which other posters - only those who call people scum. Left right and centre - I think not. You are using the scattergun approach of shooting out insults at me now - back them up with fact. My multi post rant as you call it was only ever replying to each attack on me. You, BB, Andy and Fez form an axis where it is difficult to tell your views apart. SH has been the recipient of your collective views and it seems that now I am because I dare not to kow tow to offensive language. Unfortunately Cologne and Canary Dave both also hold views that are quite similar - but they do not use the same methods of attack - which makes their contribution far more tolerable. HOwever if you were SH then faced with perpetual attack I am learning what it is like to be on the receiving end. If you think I am unsuitble to be a mod due to my views and trying to create a board that allows "kind" debate and tries to prevent unnecesary abuse just say so. Ineed this board like a hole in the head when I get abused for my views. I debate politics on other boards where the range f views is far more balanced. I only came back here to try to help bring people in who dislike the kind of language you defend.
C'mon lets admit we are a bunch of silly buggers and all have a good day tomorrow with a Watford win.
