Transfer Rumours Transfer Rumours thread

[johnsonsbaby]

Funny how you make excuses for Moreno such as "he had to play next to Lovren half the season" and yet you don't seem to apply the same courtesy to Skrtel who had to play alongside Lovren, Manquillo, Johnson and/or Sakho (none of whom were much ****ing cop either were they now ).

I value players who care AND have enough talent and ability to get nearly 300 games under 4 different managers and over 70 caps for their country I don't value players who cry about being a bit too warm, players who refuse to warm up with the rest of the team or storm off in a sulk when they don't get picked for a derby game. I value players who will sweat blood and run through brick walls for their team You value "perceived" talent and I value the guys who actually cement a place in the team and fight like hell to keep it

As I've always said, there are plenty of players better than Skrtel but there sure as hell isn't a centre back at Anfield who I'd rather see picked ahead of him at this moment. Maybe Ilori will be that man one day but seeing as he can't even shift Skrtel from the spot then I'd say he's hardly a kid to pin too much on yet is he.

Not being funny and please don't anyone take this the wrong way ..... those who go to the game, like you do Billy [and me but far far less regularly] will have a different [verging on very different] perspective on players and general fan feeling towards them. You get a far greater insight into how much effort they're putting in, attitude, fluidity in the team etc. etc. when you're actually there witnessing it.

 

[moreinjuredthanowen]

i would agree with that for sure.

lucas for me is one who looks much better live

 

[saintanton]

Not being funny and please don't anyone take this the wrong way ..... those who go to the game, like you do Billy [and me but far far less regularly] will have a different [verging on very different] perspective on players and general fan feeling towards them. You get a far greater insight into how much effort they're putting in, attitude, fluidity in the team etc. etc. when you're actually there witnessing it.

I agree.
I hardly get to see live games these days and it's frustrating. I watch them all live on telly, of course, but it's not the same. You don't get anything like the same appreciation of work rate or positioning or general shape of the team, although you do see some details more clearly.
I have to say, though, that when I did go regularly, I never encountered anything like the same amount of aggressive hostility towards our own players that I've seen since I started using an online forum.
The only thing that pisses me off about players is if they don't try. No-one can help the level of ability they're blessed with, but they can make the effort to get the most from their skills, and I think we should all appreciate that.
That doesn't mean we don't seek to improve, we should always try to get an even better player than we have, if possible, but I don't like to see players slagged off constantly.

 

[organic red]

He saved two penalties in a semi final shoot out against Holland to get them to the final

Second save was a nice height but well struck to his right,he got a solid right hand to it. Good save.

The first save was very poorly directed and he saved easily (any of us would have tbf)

So not too much to base his talent on there

 

[johnsonsbaby]

I agree.
I hardly get to see live games these days and it's frustrating. I watch them all live on telly, of course, but it's not the same. You don't get anything like the same appreciation of work rate or positioning or general shape of the team, although you do see some details more clearly.
I have to say, though, that when I did go regularly, I never encountered anything like the same amount of aggressive hostility towards our own players that I've seen since I started using an online forum.
The only thing that pisses me off about players is if they don't try. No-one can help the level of ability they're blessed with, but they can make the effort to get the most from their skills, and I think we should all appreciate that.
That doesn't mean we don't seek to improve, we should always try to get an even better player than we have, if possible, but I don't like to see players slagged off constantly.

I agree with all of that. I think watching on tv makes you far more critical, I know it does with me anyway. Live concerts vs televised ones, same thing.

 

[astro]

There's no pressure at all on a keeper in a shootout. Eventually a kicker will miss, anything saved is a bonus.

Mignolet's last minute penalty save in the PL is 100 times harder.

 

[DirtyFrank]

I agree.
I hardly get to see live games these days and it's frustrating. I watch them all live on telly, of course, but it's not the same. You don't get anything like the same appreciation of work rate or positioning or general shape of the team, although you do see some details more clearly.
I have to say, though, that when I did go regularly, I never encountered anything like the same amount of aggressive hostility towards our own players that I've seen since I started using an online forum.
The only thing that pisses me off about players is if they don't try. No-one can help the level of ability they're blessed with, but they can make the effort to get the most from their skills, and I think we should all appreciate that.
That doesn't mean we don't seek to improve, we should always try to get an even better player than we have, if possible, but I don't like to see players slagged off constantly.

It's because you have a job at the match and that's a positive one...even if the team or player is under performing your job is to lift the atmosphere and team and each other. It's largely staying in a positive frame of mind as opposed to watching at home with no one to lift you where you are also powerless to effect the atmosphere.

Frustration and negative is easier to fall into that way.

Then gather all the negative dudes together in a match forum or worse Twitter and it builds into hysterical doom mongery lol...

 

[Tobes]

There's no pressure at all on a keeper in a shootout. Eventually a kicker will miss, anything saved is a bonus.

Mignolet's last minute penalty save in the PL is 100 times harder.

So there's no pressure on the keeper in a World Cup SF but there is in a meaningless PL?

Ok mate x

 

[Tobes]

It's because you have a job at the match and that's a positive one...even if the team or player is under performing your job is to lift the atmosphere and team and each other. It's largely staying in a positive frame of mind as opposed to watching at home with no one to lift you where you are also powerless to effect the atmosphere.

Frustration and negative is easier to fall into that way.

Then gather all the negative dudes together in a match forum or worse Twitter and it builds into hysterical doom mongery lol...

Not so sure mate.

I've sat close to some right miserable moaning batards over the years at the game, and now I'm one of the ****ers

 

[astro]

So there's no pressure on the keeper in a World Cup SF but there is in a meaningless PL?

Ok mate x

5+ chances to save, with pens of your own to take in response, has more pressure than 1 with pen with no chance to reply?

Also against 5+ randomers who might have played 120 mins rather than their dedicated pen taker

Ok mate x

 

[DirtyFrank]

Not so sure mate.

I've sat close to some right miserable moaning batards over the years at the game, and now I'm one of the ****ers

Lol...tbf you are going to watch Everton

As one that goes to the games do you think that's what's happening to atmospheres. People used to the tv (negative when losing) viewing experience attending games and not knowing they are supposed to be more than a spectator or that they can't be passive anymore? I mean I'm assuming even the grumpy feckers next to you got up and sang etc...

 

[InBiscanWeTrust]

Not so sure mate.

I've sat close to some right miserable moaning batards over the years at the game, and now I'm one of the ****ers

I suppose that's what watching Everton on a regular basis will do to you

 

[DirtyFrank]

See Moses having a good end to his season tonight.

 

[Diego]

So there's no pressure on the keeper in a World Cup SF but there is in a meaningless PL?

Ok mate x

Astro logic

 

[Tobes]

Lol...tbf you are going to watch Everton

As one that goes to the games do you think that's what's happening to atmospheres. People used to the tv (negative when losing) viewing experience attending games and not knowing they are supposed to be more than a spectator or that they can't be passive anymore? I mean I'm assuming even the grumpy feckers next to you got up and sang etc...

The atmosphere at virtually every PL ground is ****e these days mate. It's been gradually getting worse since all seater came in over 20 years ago, and as times gone on the pricing has forced a lot of the working class out of the grounds and they've been replaced by the middle classes, day trippers and occasional punters. As a result the atmosphere in all barring the massive games is tepid and lifeless in most parts of the ground.

There's plenty who spend the entire game moaning though, and always has been, but most just sit there saying next to nothing. Cheering at a goal but most don't sing at all.

It's misleading on the box as the effects mics are in front of the sections that do create the noise, but they make it sound loader than it actually is when you're there.

 

[Tobes]

5+ chances to save, with pens of your own to take in response, has more pressure than 1 with pen with no chance to reply?

Also against 5+ randomers who might have played 120 mins rather than their dedicated pen taker

Ok mate x

World Cup semi final, his country's potential final appearance in his hands - literally.

Compared to some virtually meaningless PL game and a last minute save.

You're a compete ****tard if you actually believe the latter carries more pressure. Just stop yourself from typing such absolute bitter drivel ffs

 

[Flappy Flanagan (JK)]

So there's no pressure on the keeper in a World Cup SF but there is in a meaningless PL?

Ok mate x

If a keeper fails to make a save in a shoot out they can be forgiven, whilst if a kicker shoots high, wide, or makes it to easy for the keeper they will not, so all the pressure is on the kicker.

In the PL the keeper can still be forgiven, but if your only winning 1-0 and its the 90th minute you do become the only person able to save your teams victory. The same would however apply in a world cup semi final if it was the same scenario in the 90th minute.

In a shootout all pressure is on the kicker.

 

[Treble]

A lot of hair splitting going on in here tonight I see

 

[The artist JerryChristmas]

Lol...tbf you are going to watch Everton

As one that goes to the games do you think that's what's happening to atmospheres. People used to the tv (negative when losing) viewing experience attending games and not knowing they are supposed to be more than a spectator or that they can't be passive anymore? I mean I'm assuming even the grumpy feckers next to you got up and sang etc...

Many reasons DF. As Tobes said it's partly the people who go but it's also the gulf between us and the players now. Even the local players go and hide up in Formby behind electronic gates never to be seen other than at club functions or charity golf days. Add to that the transient nature of players, the team is totally different every year whereas when I started going you could name next seasons starting XI nevermind next weeks You felt like you knew the players, their strengths, weaknesses and characters too. The biggest difference for me though is the effect sitting at the game has on you....it simply isn't conducive to making lots of noise. If you had the same 45000 and half of them were standing there would be a hell of a lot more noise than with the same people all sitting down.

The original point (made by JB and Saint) is still valid though. You can see players who make the effort more when you are at the ground and yes it does give a certain affinity to those you know give their all game after game after game, Skrtel is without doubt in that mould of player. He's battled on surrounded by ****e for the past few years, Johnson/Lovren/Toure/Sakho flapping around next to him (and Ming flapping behind him) plus no protection from the midfield whatsoever. Remember back to us having an in form Johnson and Dagger though and Skrtel rarely put a foot wrong. He ain't a world beater but he IS the best we have right now (by quite a margin).

I have to add that in fairness to all our defenders they have a lot to deal with in a Rodgers team. Our defence is attacked far too often because of the terribly porous midfield and the full backs bombing forward. All of our centre backs (and the keeper) are given far too much to do game after game. It amplifies their weaknesses ten fold when compared to how they would play in a Rafa or Kenny style set up (or dare I say a Jose style set up).

 

[ademuzzy]

Many reasons DF. As Tobes said it's partly the people who go but it's also the gulf between us and the players now. Even the local players go and hide up in Formby behind electronic gates never to be seen other than at club functions or charity golf days. Add to that the transient nature of players, the team is totally different every year whereas when I started going you could name next seasons starting XI nevermind next weeks You felt like you knew the players, their strengths, weaknesses and characters too. The biggest difference for me though is the effect sitting at the game has on you....it simply isn't conducive to making lots of noise. If you had the same 45000 and half of them were standing there would be a hell of a lot more noise than with the same people all sitting down.

The original point (made by JB and Saint) is still valid though. You can see players who make the effort more when you are at the ground and yes it does give a certain affinity to those you know give their all game after game after game, Skrtel is without doubt in that mould of player. He's battled on surrounded by ****e for the past few years, Johnson/Lovren/Toure/Sakho flapping around next to him (and Ming flapping behind him) plus no protection from the midfield whatsoever. Remember back to us having an in form Johnson and Dagger though and Skrtel rarely put a foot wrong. He ain't a world beater but he IS the best we have right now (by quite a margin).

I have to add that in fairness to all our defenders they have a lot to deal with in a Rodgers team. Our defence is attacked far too often because of the terribly porous midfield and the full backs bombing forward. All of our centre backs (and the keeper) are given far too much to do game after game. It amplifies their weaknesses ten fold when compared to how they would play in a Rafa or Kenny style set up (or dare I say a Jose style set up).

I don't get to go to the Stadium due to it being impossible to get a ticket and it's a long way away. So I only get to see us on TV, when watching on TV I actually think Sakho is our best centre back. I also think Skrtel is a good defender, the problem for us is that Skrtel is a drop deep defender (Mouriniho style) Whereas Sakho is a front foot defender and likes to come out and attack the ball (AVB style, PEP style). Both are great but different. Lovren is ****e at both.