Transfer activity under VT

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BluefromBridgend

Well-Known Member
May 31, 2011
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Bridgend
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/...f-citys-remarkable-transfer-activity-10700897

An interesting article from WoL (for a change). Not sure of the accuracy of all the figures quoted and some fees were undisclosed. However, it paints an interesting picture from the austerity under DJ, to the Malky spend to get us promoted, the Malky spend which saw us on the downhill path, the dreadful OGS era and austerity again under Slade.

In fairness to Malky, apart from the ridiculous fees paid for Velikonja and Cornelius we got a good part back of the money spent although those 2 accounted for the best part of £10m net which we (VT) will never see again and that's before wages and anything we are still paying for the latter.

It also shows how frivolous OGS was, in particular the spend on the Norwegian 3.

It is really no surprise we are now bargain basement shoppers (some teenager from a non-league side and a striker who is struggling to get game time at another Championship side - see WoL today) with VT reluctant to provide any more real financial support in team building - he is probably having to finance us day to day just to run the business in view of the pitiful crowds - 2nd lowest in Championship last weekend. Will he stump up the cash to complete Watt's transfer? That was supposed to be a done deal although something about 16th January is rattling around my head.

The future is not bright, it's fU(ked unless Slade van sign a couple of Vardy's and Alli's.
 
You don't really have to look further than letting a spoilt kid like OGS to run around free in the sweet shop to explain why the club is in the cack it is now. Mackay for all his faults got the club up and left when they were not doomed to relegation.

Turn the clock back. City in the PL. Not bottom, but not safe but certainly in a better position than Sunderland that season, Leicester last and say Villa this.

Mackay is sacked. Somebody at a PL club decides that it would be good idea to bring in a Norwegian club manager to firefight a relegation battle in the hardest league in Europe. Same person decides it would be best to give this job to an inexperienced youngster and then to boot, gives him a blankety blank cheque book and pen to bring in the players necessary to reach safety. He brings in Norwegians staring in their 4th rate league plus a error prone Spaniard and a wayward lad from Palace who doesn't really want to come to Wales and swaps a hard working forward for a lazy one.

Relegation is nailed on from an early stage into his arrival. So he is then given another cheque book to create a star studded team to storm the championship. Somebody at a Championship club decides that is the best way, rather than gel a team of hard working, experienced players at that level, a few ex PL players and young talent together. Cue inevitable failure.

The Chairman has had enough; throws his toys out when his mother tells him to revert the shirts to blue and the bluebird to the prominent position on the crest and in pique employs an ex PE teacher with a journeyman career to firesale the squad, and sign players on the cheap.

It has got worse not better.

BfB, you are right, the future is not bright.
 
ninian opinion said:
You don't really have to look further than letting a spoilt kid like OGS to run around free in the sweet shop to explain why the club is in the cack it is now. Mackay for all his faults got the club up and left when they were not doomed to relegation.

Turn the clock back. City in the PL. Not bottom, but not safe but certainly in a better position than Sunderland that season, Leicester last and say Villa this.

Mackay is sacked. Somebody at a PL club decides that it would be good idea to bring in a Norwegian club manager to firefight a relegation battle in the hardest league in Europe. Same person decides it would be best to give this job to an inexperienced youngster and then to boot, gives him a blankety blank cheque book and pen to bring in the players necessary to reach safety. He brings in Norwegians staring in their 4th rate league plus a error prone Spaniard and a wayward lad from Palace who doesn't really want to come to Wales and swaps a hard working forward for a lazy one.

Relegation is nailed on from an early stage into his arrival. So he is then given another cheque book to create a star studded team to storm the championship. Somebody at a Championship club decides that is the best way, rather than gel a team of hard working, experienced players at that level, a few ex PL players and young talent together. Cue inevitable failure.

The Chairman has had enough; throws his toys out when his mother tells him to revert the shirts to blue and the bluebird to the prominent position on the crest and in pique employs an ex PE teacher with a journeyman career to firesale the squad, and sign players on the cheap.

It has got worse not better.

BfB, you are right, the future is not bright.
Click to expand...

Quite possibly, the most accurate post I've seen on this site in yonks.
 
I agree with Nin's post as well.

However the £12m odd MM was given to get us out of the Championship does diminish the achievement imo. No other manager in our history has been backed in that fashion and probably never will again! The fact he ****ed up the £30m PL spend so badly/dishonestly is the reason he was sacked and the series of events that led to the OS disaster had began. At that point Tan was on board, spending as required and there was a real chance for us establish ourselves in the PL for the short term (2 to 5 years) at least. To spend £30m+ and not have a striker to lead the line in the PL was horrendous mismanagement.

OS was a horrendous appointment and the final nail in an already well constructed coffin of money spent compared to squad quality.
 
Stevoldinho said:
The fact he ****ed up the £30m PL spend so badly/dishonestly
Click to expand...

This I disagree strongly with....if there was any dishonesty, then Tans' Henchmen would have discovered it. Can't think how much he must have spent on legal fees/IT experts etc. to investigate MM, but they found jack **** (apart from a few (admittedely unpleasant) e-mails).

Also we re-couped almost £25M on Caulker, Medel, KTC & Cornelius. Considering our position in the league, prior to Tan & Malky's fallout then I can't really see any PL spending F*** up.

Yes I agree Corneleus was vastly overpriced, but MM's failure to give him a proper chance (see also Gestede) was a bigger bollock dropped than the price paid for him.
 
Caulker, Medel, KTC & Cornelius were sold according to the WOL figures for a £6.7m loss.

Not horrendous tbh, the issue is that level of investment should have enabled us to compete better in the division. Had one been a failure you could defend the spend, but only 60 minute Medal was any use and certainly wasn't a £10m midfielder. If he'd cost half or less he'd have been an ok buy. Only an amazing World Cup as a centre half saved us a huge loss on him. I know others will defend Caulker but he's ****ing rubbish and if he gets the move to Sunderland that's being mentioned he'll have been relegated 3 years in a row. He looks the part on the ball but he's a tentative, indecisive defender that has been consistently part of the worst defences statistically in the division. Our £10m Medal, £9m Caulker and £8m striker should have transformed us instead our best players were ones we already had. That's before we spent £3.6m on 2 right backs that both weren't really good enough although you could argue KTC was OK. I'm sure we could have got his level of performance from a cheaper alternative i.e loaning a promising full back from one of the top 6. It's not a difficult position to find players to do a job on a budget. For evidence of that see Slade's transfer success stories........

Therefore our PL spend was a total **** up IMO.
 
The problem with Cornelius is that, basically, he was useless in our league system. It shows a total lack of research and understanding by those involved in signing him and paying the £8m. I first saw him play in a friendly at Cheltenham. He looked like what he is - a carthorse. We all saw the clips of him scoring freely in Denmark but do we have a handle on the standard he was playing in and the abilities of those around him in setting up his chances. More to the point, it looks like the club didn't do the research and while Malky and Moody might have wanted him, surely the CEO at the time, Teflon Simon Lim, should have wanted to know more before authorising the payment. Of all the signings he was the worst, not necessarily the worst player (see J Lloyd Samuel and other loan disasters), but the worst taking into account the amount paid and what we lost and may be still losing in wages contribution in getting shot of him.

Gestede is another matter. He cost us nothing and there was clearly a raw talent there. He had fitness problems and the club got in an international sprinter (Darren Campbell I think) to sort out his running style which improved his pace and mobility. For whatever reason, as you rightly say Whiffle, Malky and then OGS didn't give him enough opportunity (not the first time we have heard that about City managers and youngsters) and off he went to Blackburn, first on loan, and then for a cut price £200k and the biggest mistake of all - no sell on clause!!!!

What would we give to have Rudy as our lead striker now?
 
The problem emanated with City not replacing Mackay competently. A better choice than the baby faced one with a blank cheque book would surely have seen better players more attuned to the PL rather than OGS's purchases come along and given City a fighting chance of survival.

It has been proven that managers can come in mid term and turn relegation fodder teams around. City were not exactly rooted to the foot of the table when Mackay left.

I would though say that in hindsight possibly a bigger problem was going into the PL campaign with no experienced football men in the club looking after Mackay and helping him bring in PL quality players alongside Caulker and Medel. However I reiterate that when he went, the club had a half decent haul of points which should have been a launching pad for someone else to come in and save the season.

It is all though water under the bridge.

ps.

BfB, I see no reason why Gestade could not be approached to come here on loan, given he is not pulling up trees at Villa?
 
It is water under the bridge but does anyone want to talk about 5000 fans (if we're lucky) watching Shrewsbury.......? <laugh>

I can't understand why they don't let ST holders in for free, surely they've saved the potential gate receipts on KWJ's wages already!
 
I dont know why Walesonline have put the combined loss on all those players.

The reality the loss is virtually all on Cornelius who was sh!t.

Austerity under Jones was for a brief period. He was also given good financial backing. The Jones spend to Malky spend. Both had decent budgets to get us up. Thats all part of the problem of where we are now. Theres still this myth that Jones worked on a tight budget which is rubbish. Osman , Neal , Ashurst , Burrows would have loved the financial backing Jones had.

Our financial issues are because we have overspent for years and a succession of managers have thrown money about in a attempt on promotion.

To be fair Slade doesnt have money to spend. However he still has a group of talented players and some are on large wages. I bet our wage bill is amongst the highest in the league. Slade hasnt had to sell the likes of Marshall , Manga , Fabio , Pilkington , Noone , yet we are heading for mid table. I thought Slade would have had to sell far more than he has. I dont believe he has excuses and his constant underdog type interviews are really doing my head in now. I really hope he is replaced with a young forward thinking manager.

The cut backs are necessary but Slade had an opportunity. I fear the new man will have a major re-building job in the summer on a much lower budget.

Get the right man and not some old school 442 merchant and there is still no reason why we cant be competitive.
 
I must agree that Jones was a failure at the end of the day. He had sufficient money for the most part and certainly plenty of time (6 years) to build a squad capable to gain promotion over that period. Ultimately he fell short of the mark.

The other stuff about Tan and Malky is water under the bridge indeed, but the appointment of OGS was a clear indication of the lack of nuts and bolts football nous at the club which still pervades today.

There's no question that were were funded into the Premier League by Tan, but you can't deny Mackay the credit for taking the opportunity provided. He still had to do it and took us up as clear champions. Very often that season, pretty it wasn't, and the same could be said for his half season up there in the spotlight.

It's fair to say that when he went we were outside the bottom 3 but we were heading that way. We'd been found out and there is no guarantee that another half season with him in charge would have seen us avoid the drop.

As it was, the disastrous appointment of OGS says more about the fundamental problems at the club than anything else - no footballing leadership, just money. The problem is that now the funding has apparently dried up, there's no ability at the club to take it forward on the limited budget that is being provided.

If Tan is truthfull about a successful club future and not just going through the motions, the right football management is the key.

Giving serious money to Slade is like giving strawberrys to an elephant - a complete waste of resources.
 
My opinion on the drying up of Tan's money is that if Slade or any other manager can show him promotion is within grasp i.e stick the side in the top 4. He'd spend. I have no proof whatsoever I just think with everything he's spent another £3-6m wouldn't really make a difference to him but could be huge from a playing point of view.

I was one of a very small few on here that didn't see this season as a relegation battle disaster. There's still time for that but I think our current position of a couple results short of the playoffs is where we'll finish. That's not good enough. Our squad is better than that and Slade has had his chance. I wouldn't change him before the summer and I wouldn't buy him anything other than a striker. If one can be loaned with a summer option to buy that would be even better tbh. If we can get anything over 7/8m for Marshall I'd sell him as it's unlikely he'll be worth more at any point in the future. An 8m budget in the summer could really turn the squad around. That is dependent on that money being given to the new manager though not paying off the debt to Tan
 
I've said recently on here that at this point there's very little chance that we'd get sucked down into a bottom 6 scrap so for me that's all the more reason to replace Slade with a more progressive manager capable of taking this club to another level - Slade clearly can't.

The question is have we any ambition as a club beyond survival - or more to the point, has Tan? I doubt even Tan is mad enough to throw any significant money into the ring just to achieve a "might be" scenario - he would have to be convinced it is probable more than just possible.

At the moment every indication is that we are a mid table side who is destined to stay there. If that is the position come May then Tan must see the writing on the wall about the limited capabilities of the Slade/Young/Trollope team if he hasn't recognised it by now. He would definitely need to act then so why not now. Having said that I can't see any changes before the summer.
 
I think the reason not to change is that Slade hasn't failed yet. The points dropped losing leads and away to the likes of MK and Brum will cost us, but it hasn't yet.
If (I don't think he will) Slade can get those points back in fixtures like our next 2 then he might still achieve the playoffs. As I said in the previous post I don't think that will happen, but it could and therefore I don't think he should be sacked yet.
If we lose the next 2, which is likely, and results go against us. We could be so far off the playoffs it'll make sense to start to prepare for next season though. He's brought that pressure on himself with some very poor results and a run of 2/3 losses will see him on the brink IMO.
 
Slade will be cheap enough as a manager. He's worked hard at successfully trimming the wage bill whilst keeping us comfortably safe. Not pretty and not real contenders for promotion, but safe.

If we see the season out and start pre-season with a new manager, a core of players and sustainable budget, Slade may well have delivered his brief. We don't know if Slade was brought in for a fixed period with a defined objective.

Here's hoping this is the case.

It would be more attractive for a new manager to come in with a relatively blank canvas and a budget that quickly allows him to put his own mark on the club than to start with one hand tied behind his back. Would like to see one or two decent signings and 4 or 5 mediocre exits in January. Wouldn't be too upset if Marshall goes for a decent fee either.

Something needs to be done before the start of next season to improve the quality of football (and I'm sure there are managers out there that could do it without changing any players) and start bringing the crowds back.

With hindsight, the most exciting times were the near misses under DJ. Lots of heartbreak, but exciting.
 
Part company with Slade now - he's done his job. I'll say it again, we will not go up with him in charge no matter how much cash Tan provides in Janaury.

Recruit a manager with experience at this level and see the season out sorting the present squad which is easily capable of finishing where we are now without addition. Give the right guy the right amount of resources in the summer, and back him to the hilt to have identified what needs to be done to make a real difference. That's club coaching and backroom staff as well as players brought in on a scattergun approach.

Unless you're very lucky (and Slade isn't) with lower league players, you get what you pay for. Quality comes at a price but it doesn't need to be excessive a la Cornelius, Caulker and Medel when buying in Championship terms - it just needs the right judgement.
 
I agree about the Dave Jones era. Not everyone's favourite manager but what a roller coaster ride. It was never dull.
I would like to see our playing squad down to similar size that DJ left us with. That way a new manager might have a chance of moulding his own squad.
We might as well start that process now as we don't have a cat in hells chance of promotion this year.
 
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