The poppy debate is a side issue. The lack of public support we give to our military in comparison to the USA is embarrassing. It's about time they are routinely recognised.
How people deem blowing up civilians isn't ever going to change. Mandela even supported the IRA, just because he did some amazing things doesn't mean he was deeply flawed
The enemy is/always has been/always will be the government. They sell weapons to our 'enemies', and then send our children (not theirs of course) in to be killed by those very weapons - for causes that will benefit only the elite classes. As a soldier you have far more in common with the man you are shooting at, than the men you are shooting for. What happened during WW1 if you refused to do your 'duty'? You were shot. What the actual ****? Remembrance Day is all well and good, but let's face it, it is just another chance for the enemy to practise its propaganda. And then the government-run BBC comes out with 'neutral' stories about people deciding not to wear a poppy, knowing full well that this will act as more hate-fuel for the working-class masses. If Matic, MacClean choose not to wear a poppy, why make a ****ing story out of it? It' is nobody's business at all. I suggest, that there should also be a '**** the government' day on Nov 12th.
How many civilians lost their lives when the RAF and USAF bombed Dresden in 1945? How about Hiroshima and Nagasaki? Were these acts of terrorism or acts of war? And what is the difference, when civilian populations are actively targeted?
And as for James McClean - he`s happy enough to put his principles aside and take the queen`s shilling, and make a fortune playing in the English league.
He grew up in my home county Donegal so wouldn't have as strong a view as those from Derry I would imagine. He's also that bit younger so wouldn't have experienced life in the troubles in the way McClean did. It's everyone's own personal decision and should be left as such. I wouldn't wear one myself but have no problem in people doing so, even Irishmen if they do wish... The abuse McClean gets is wholely unnecessary and shows these people have little or no knowledge of what happened during the troubles. Thankfully the vast majority of English people I have chatted to or even encountered online seem to be reasonable over the subject
Thanks for the feedback. From a footballing aspect, I hope PFC resist all bids for him in the January window,get promotion aided by Ronan Curtis. From the footage I have seen he is every inch a PL player operating in League 1. PFC need to slap a 25 million pound fee on him.
Does that only apply then to the british and the US forces? Not to the Russians the Germans or the Japanese not to forget the Italians just to name a few.? In all wars civilians are killed it shouldn’t happen but it does......but to just blame the Americans and the British is ludicrous.
Horishima and Nagasaki arguably did, as before being confronted by the Americans willingness to use nuclear weapons, Japan looked intent on fighting to the last drop of blood. Not Dresden though - it wasn’t even an industrial town, but a Medeavel city whose main commercial activity was producing china. Bombing that place was intended solely to weaken German resolve by terrorising the civilian population. And historians are generally agreed that reducing it to rubble didn’t shorten the war by a single day.
Lest we forget, here are the words of Edwin Starr Ooh war, I despise 'Cause it means destruction of innocent lives War means tears, to thousands of mother's eyes When their sons go off to fight and lose their lives
Just for information as 5 year old (my step father being part of the occupational forces)our whole class were taken to Dresden to see what the horrors of war was about. Till my dying day I will remember the scenes. So I understand a lot more than perhaps you think. What you have to remember though is if the allies had not dropped the atomic bomb before the others had it. We wouldn’t be here today the Germans were not that far behind us in developing weapons of mass distruction. Sadly it was a them or us situation and sadly was necessary. We can argue now that Dresden needn’t have happened or even shouldn’t have but when desperate people do do things they normally wouldn’t even think about. That’s not condoning that’s just trying to understand why.
Here’s one from Wilfred Owen. If you’re not familiar with his work, he was a soldier poet in the First World War who would undoubtedly have become one of the greatest poets of the 20th Century. He was killed exactly a week before Armistice Day. This is The Parable of the Old Man and the Young: So Abram rose, and clave the wood, and went, And took the fire with him, and a knife. And as they sojourned both of them together, Isaac the first-born spake and said, My Father, Behold the preparations, fire and iron, But where the lamb for this burnt-offering? Then Abram bound the youth with belts and straps, and builded parapets and trenches there, And stretchèd forth the knife to slay his son. When lo! an angel called him out of heaven, Saying, Lay not thy hand upon the lad, Neither do anything to him. Behold, A ram, caught in a thicket by its horns; Offer the Ram of Pride instead of him. But the old man would not so, but slew his son, And half the seed of Europe, one by one.
Germany surrendered 3 months before the first bomb dropped on Hiroshima Beddy. The Japanese had no nuclear programme at all.
I agree but if the Germans had developed the nuclear weapon they would have used it on us......This would have been a darn sight worse than Dresden. Was it necessary to drop two of the darn things on Japan not sure it was...... All wars can be and should be avoided sadly the human race seems destined to use force rather than negotiate
As it happens, I agree with a lot of what you say here. That doesn’t change the fact though, that the bombing of Dresden was a deliberate act of terror; the wider point being that terrorism is not the exclusive preserve of armed insurgent groups like the IRA, ANC etc, but has been used by governments and nations, often in pursuit of causes that would be considered honourable. And I say that as someone who’s uncle flew several missions as a tail gunner on a Halifax bomber, and remained justifiably proud of his service. Nothing is ever black and white, especially in war; and we should all maybe think twice before rushing to judge others. This started off as a debate about wearing poppies; I will wear mine with pride this weekend, but I will respect anybody who chooses not to wear one, whatever their reason.
