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The problem with McLaren

Discussion in 'Formula 1' started by BelugaWhale, Mar 3, 2013.

  1. SgtBhaji

    SgtBhaji Well-Known Member

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    If they'd backed Alonso as team leader, he'd have kept his trap shut and all would have been rosy. ;)
     
    #41
  2. El_Bando

    El_Bando Can't remember, where was I? Forum Moderator

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    wait!... Are we breaking Westys law?
     
    #42
  3. Max Whiplash

    Max Whiplash Well-Known Member

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    Nah, it just moved over to the Aus GP predictions thread ;)
     
    #43
  4. SgtBhaji

    SgtBhaji Well-Known Member

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    No... we're validating it. :p
     
    #44
  5. ErnieBecclestone

    ErnieBecclestone Well-Known Member

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    All I know is if I build a machine for a single sole dedicated purpose it will perform much more efficiently than a machine designed for dual or multi purpose and its the same with F1 cars, a car designed to suit the quickest driver will win more races = points = WDCs = WCCs simples.
     
    #45
  6. ErnieBecclestone

    ErnieBecclestone Well-Known Member

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    Exactly, it's cost McLaren dearly in the winning stakes, but hold the moral highground regarding equality, so which is preferable.
     
    #46

  7. BelugaWhale

    BelugaWhale Member

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    Summarises my entire monologue in 11 words!
     
    #47
  8. Spursguru

    Spursguru Active Member

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    Wnning Titles both Constructors and Drivers is what F1 racing is about.

    No awards for "look how nice we are that we can accomodate two British champions with different styles with no preference whatsoever". Mclaren like to say how they win lots of races, but if you car fails as much as it did last year, and your wins are split 50/50 per driver then it means very litle when your competition favours Alonso and Vettel.

    I've always believed that Hamilton given the same car/treatment as Alonso or Vettel could perform at the same level.
    I think his problems have always stemmed from Frustration - car problems, pit lane problems etc that then lead to him making stupid mistakes. I guess you could say it was a Chicken and egg thing, and maybe Vettel or Alonso would have reacted better mentaly, but it must really piss you off to see your team making the same mistakes over and over, and then having your car die when you are first, or be under fuelled for quali, or not be given preferential treatmnent when leading your inferior team mate in the championship.
     
    #48
  9. Smithers

    Smithers Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    I thought he always got the better strategy etc.... and new upgrades over Kovalinen?
     
    #49
  10. Spursguru

    Spursguru Active Member

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    Indeed, and he nearly won 2 tittles in 3 years. The third year he had a dog of a car, but was still the highest scorer from halfway onwards.

    Signing Button was a big step back imo, not because he isn't an ok driver, but because accomodating him was not good for Lewis.
     
    #50
  11. SgtBhaji

    SgtBhaji Well-Known Member

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    I just always thought Kovi was a bit average.
     
    #51
  12. Smithers

    Smithers Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    LOL - wooosshhhhhh!
     
    #52
  13. Smithers

    Smithers Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    Just slightly in comparison to Lewis - I was taking the piss!
     
    #53
  14. SgtBhaji

    SgtBhaji Well-Known Member

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    Oooops... sorry. :p
     
    #54
  15. Smithers

    Smithers Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    He hardly needed any help against Kov in 2008 and 2009, and he obviously delivered what was expected (the WDC) based on the car, teammate and opposition - i.e. Ferrari seemed to be doing a Mclaren that year and falling over themselves.

    I dont think even the most avid of fan would have expected Lewis to have been given priority over Alonso in his Rookie year (2207) either and in reality because of the closeness of the competition between the 2 it was right not to afford Alonso priortiy over Lewis. So really swings and roundabouts, its difficult to argue for priority a partucluar driver when its has not and would not be afforded the other way. Lewis has either dominated his weaker teammate or been equal to his team mate, hence my response to this statement:

    "or not be given preferential treatmnent when leading your inferior team mate"
     
    #55
  16. Spursguru

    Spursguru Active Member

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    I was refering to Button with than comment relative to Mclaren not getting behind Lewis last year even though Button was out of it.
     
    #56
  17. Smithers

    Smithers Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    I know exactly who you were refering to - the "inferior team mate" who Lewis needed priority over? Bit of a contridiction really!

    Anyway rather than fuel "Westy's Law" lets just say I agree that if Mclaren had backed either of their drivers they would likely have been closer to winning a WDC - and I have siad that since they became team mates.
     
    #57
  18. JonnyBaws

    JonnyBaws Well-Known Member

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    Can't argue with that.

    However, I can see history repeating itself, Perez isn't a mug behind the wheel, now he's got a shot at winning races and maybe a title, do you think he'll defer to Button?
    Do we think that if Perez performs the way Hamilton did against Alonso, that McLaren won't let them fight it out with equal machinery?
    Whilst we F1 fans will disagree with Ferrari's blatant favouritism towards Alonso and IRBRs towards Vettel (however not quite as obvious), these approaches get results.
    If its clear from very early on in the season that Button's get a decent shot at the title, I'd hope McLaren finally see sense and back him, otherwise the likes of Ferrari and Redbull will be applying the 2013 WDC and WCC decals on their cars, trucks, websites whilst Mclaren will be left with their 2013 Carbon Neutral award, whoopee do!
     
    #58
  19. Smithers

    Smithers Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    I dont think it will happen myself and if it does it will obviously become a Whitmarsh conspiracy. I hope they act the same as they always have and then IF Button were to win it would hold more value, but I doubt it myself.

    The problem Mclaren have always had (in recent years) is that they have never had a driver that has blown away the other and made the decission either obvious or a no brainer. I'd like to think Button would get going early on and get a good few points between him and Perez, but I doubt it - especially as Mclaren/Button have already been quoted as saying that they were not looking at wins in the first fly aways!

    But all in all I think thast fair - it would be a real kick in the balls for Lewis if they all of a sudden went with a different approach!
     
    #59
  20. StoneRosesRam

    StoneRosesRam Member

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    The funny thing is that McLaren's preaching of equality can also be scrutinised as most of their most famous partnerships have featured perceived favouritism towards one driver. Senna/Prost (Mainly in their last year), Hakkinen/Coulthard (Obviously favoured Mika), and Alonso/Lewis (No official team orders but we all know the famous 'we were racing Fernando' comment). They like to preach that they treat their drivers fairly and that somehow means they have the moral high ground over others in the paddock but in reality they just pick and choose when they want it to be seen that they have an equal pairing and when they want to favour one driver over another.

    All of this actually makes me think if I should still support McLaren if I am this negative about them!
     
    #60

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