The Politics Thread

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Trump isn't as bad as Cruz. Cruz is a terrifying motherfucker.

There have been zero realistic or attractive candidates for POTUS this time. It's a bit scary how bad it is.
 
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NowsufferinginSpain said:
I'm sorry, really. But to those of us over here it's like some circus comedy show. It's unbelievable and unbelievably scary to think that a narcissistic egomaniac, like Trump, could actually be elected president of the USA.

I couldn't believe it when the idiot son of Bush was somehow elected, but Trump would far outdo even that lunacy.
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No reason to be sorry, "circus comedy show" is about right. What's even scarier is that Cruz is even worse than Trump. Listen to Cruz and see how many seconds it takes to want to break the nose of that "miserable son of a bitch" (to use another apt description provided by the former speaker of the House of Representatives, who I suddenly respect immensely).

The Romans set a high bar with Caligula and Nero, but give us time.

The problem with Kasich is he is in the race in name only. He only has a few delegates. But he appears to be a reasonable person with reasonable views, despite a certain amount of ooze clinging to him from the 2008 shenanigans.
 
I'm not yet certain how I will vote in the upcoming EU referendum. What I am certain though is today Cameron made a desperate attempt to cloud the issue by suggesting (?) that the world would be a safer place if we stayed in. You what? In an election which has had far more clouding of the issues than facts, can I state for a fact that the EU is an economic organisation and not a security one. We are members of NATO which is a military alliance and nothing to do with the EU, and organisations like Interpol are again nothing to do with the EU. Other security intelligence is shared on a country by country basis. To then reel off a list of dates, some of which I was struggling to remember, does no justice to the study of history (he even mentioned 1704 for goodness sake, which I had to rack my brains is the War of Spanish Succession). All that is irrelevant other than to remind us that we have often been at war with other countries in Europe, none of which we have fought since WW2, and that has nothing to do with the EU. They are our military allies through NATO and to cloud the issues with "history" does him no credit. Incidentally after I heard the Cameron speech I was then subjected to hearing the Chair of the Brexit campaign who did a diabolical job of responding to it. So weak, and supposedly a Labour MP. Brexit should just state the facts (for a change) and point out the erroneous security argument. This should be discussed on it's own terms - political and economic union and whether it's good for us or not.
 
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vimhawk said:
I'm not yet certain how I will vote in the upcoming EU referendum. What I am certain though is today Cameron made a desperate attempt to cloud the issue by suggesting (?) that the world would be a safer place if we stayed in. You what? In an election which has had far more clouding of the issues than facts, can I state for a fact that the EU is an economic organisation and not a security one. We are members of NATO which is a military alliance and nothing to do with the EU, and organisations like Interpol are again nothing to do with the EU. Other security intelligence is shared on a country by country basis. To then reel off a list of dates, some of which I was struggling to remember, does no justice to the study of history (he even mentioned 1704 for goodness sake, which I had to rack my brains is the War of Spanish Succession). All that is irrelevant other than to remind us that we have often been at war with other countries in Europe, none of which we have fought since WW2, and that has nothing to do with the EU. They are our military allies through NATO and to cloud the issues with "history" does him no credit. Incidentally after I heard the Cameron speech I was then subjected to hearing the Chair of the Brexit campaign who did a diabolical job of responding to it. So weak, and supposedly a Labour MP. Brexit should just state the facts (for a change) and point out the erroneous security argument. This should be discussed on it's own terms - political and economic union and whether it's good for us or not.
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Just watching that now on the news. And Boris has nailed it dead.

Cameron was saying he would leave the EU if he did not get his "reforms" agreed.
So if those "reforms" were not agreed, then Cameron by definition was prepared to
risk this "peace" regardless.
 
I've always been pro-Brexit, and frankly every time I see Cameron or Osborne has made an intervention I know it's to our benefit. Their entire campaign seems to be based around scare tactics and the politics of doubt, there's not a single positive case made for remaining in the EU, just the potential pitfalls of leaving it.

Cameron is taking the electorate for idiots and is going to regret it, we saw how this type of campaign worked out for him in the London mayoral elections.
 
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Can somebody tell me what the benefits of leaving the EU are, please?
The idea of an EU exit under the current government doesn't fill me with a lot of hope, frankly.
 
PleaseNotPoll said:
Can somebody tell me what the benefits of leaving the EU are, please?
The idea of an EU exit under the current government doesn't fill me with a lot of hope, frankly.
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Leaving the EU means this country is no longer ruled by Brussels, and instead it'll be run by these ****wits...

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Thank you for voting to stay in the EU.
 
humanbeingincroydon said:
Leaving the EU means this country is no longer ruled by Brussels, and instead it'll be run by these ****wits...

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Thank you for voting to stay in the EU.
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I've seen less dodgy-looking police lineups.
Some incredibly inappropriate people for their posts, too.
 
PleaseNotPoll said:
I've seen less dodgy-looking police lineups.
Some incredibly inappropriate people for their posts, too.
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Another good reason to stay in the EU: leave campaigners don't even know how a portmanteau works.

When the term "Grexit" was doing the rounds a year or so ago during one of Angela Merkel's regular attempts at bullying the Greeks to bend to her iron will, that's an example of a portmanteau that works because there's a shared letter, something that can't be said of the words "Britain" and "exit" as the only portmanteau you can get from those words is "Brit"

...and because I got bored, here's how the portmanteau does or does not work in other EU languages.
French: Bretagne & Sortie - N/A
Spanish: Bretana & Salida - N/A
Italian: Bretagna & Uscita - N/A
German: Britannien & Ausgang - Britausgang
Polish: Brytania & Wyjscie - Bryjscie
Greek: Vretania & Exodos - Vrexodos

So there you have it: staying in the EU means the UK has a better chance of knowing how a portmanteau works.
 
humanbeingincroydon said:
Another good reason to stay in the EU: leave campaigners don't even know how a portmanteau works.

When the term "Grexit" was doing the rounds a year or so ago during one of Angela Merkel's regular attempts at bullying the Greeks to bend to her iron will, that's an example of a portmanteau that works because there's a shared letter, something that can't be said of the words "Britain" and "exit" as the only portmanteau you can get from those words is "Brit"

...and because I got bored, here's how the portmanteau does or does not work in other EU languages.
French: Bretagne & Sortie - N/A
Spanish: Bretana & Salida - N/A
Italian: Bretagna & Uscita - N/A
German: Britannien & Ausgang - Britausgang
Polish: Brytania & Wyjscie - Bryjscie
Greek: Vretania & Exodos - Vrexodos

So there you have it: staying in the EU means the UK has a better chance of knowing how a portmanteau works.
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I quite like Vrexodos, actually. It sounds like a metal band, though.
 
humanbeingincroydon said:
Leaving the EU means this country is no longer ruled by Brussels, and instead it'll be run by these ****wits...

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Thank you for voting to stay in the EU.
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That's a little unfair. Granted they're politicians, and ergo self serving ****wits. But the only guarantee in replacing them is with another bunch of ****wits!
 
PleaseNotPoll said:
Can somebody tell me what the benefits of leaving the EU are, please?
The idea of an EU exit under the current government doesn't fill me with a lot of hope, frankly.
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The ability to determine our own immigration policy would be one. I personally would like to live in a country which doesn't discriminate against 90% of the world's population in favour of the 10%, often unskilled, who already live in its richest continent.
 
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Wandering Yid said:
The ability to determine our own immigration policy would be one. I personally would like to live in a country which doesn't discriminate against 90% of the world's population in favour of the 10%, often unskilled, who already live in its richest continent.
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None of the major parties want to do that though, regardless of EU membership.
 
PleaseNotPoll said:
None of the major parties want to do that though, regardless of EU membership.
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The major parties are incapable of thinking "regardless of EU membership". The whole point in Brexit is its an opportunity to rethink everything, completely out of the context that our politicians have grown confortable in.

Our immigration is far too restrictive for those coming from outside the EU, if we didn't have open borders with the EU, it wouldn't need to be, we could treat all the world's citizens equally regardless of where they were born.
 
Wandering Yid said:
The major parties are incapable of thinking "regardless of EU membership". The whole point in Brexit is its an opportunity to rethink everything, completely out of the context that our politicians have grown confortable in.

Our immigration is far too restrictive for those coming from outside the EU, if we didn't have open borders with the EU, it wouldn't need to be, we could treat all the world's citizens equally regardless of where they were born.
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That's simply not going to happen, though.
All of the major parties are happy with the current situation or minor variations of it.
Trade negotiations with the EU would probably have to include concessions on such matters, too.
 
PleaseNotPoll said:
That's simply not going to happen, though.
All of the major parties are happy with the current situation or minor variations of it.
Trade negotiations with the EU would probably have to include concessions on such matters, too.
Click to expand...

I'm optimistic. It certainly doesn't have a chance of happening inside the EU. For me, that's enough reason to want to leave it.
 
Wandering Yid said:
I'm optimistic. It certainly doesn't have a chance of happening inside the EU. For me, that's enough reason to want to leave it.
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If there was any desire for it to happen, then EU membership wouldn't prevent it.
Everything's open to negotiation, despite any claims to the contrary.
The current climate almost ensures a debate within the EU about it in the coming years.
 
Have to agree with PNP. Your view is of an ideal world, bordering on Utopian. Not the one we currently live in.

In today's world, open borders are becoming increasingly dangerous and are openly abused by extremists.
 
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