Off Topic The Politics Thread

[Stroller]

But you called for the overthrow of the last conservative government and if I remember rightly they were democratically elected. Just another example of why your friends ditched you

That's just weird. I believe in democracy. At the Robinson rally, Musk was calling for something quite different....

“We must have revolutionary government change… This really requires everyone to sort of marshal the people, to take charge, reform the government, and make sure that you actually have a government that is for the people, by the people,” the billionaire said.

Musk has been wading into UK politics for some time now. Last summer, during a wave of violent anti-immigration riots in Britain, the Tesla chief executive and owner of X said that “civil war is inevitable.”

Elon Musk says UK needs ‘revolutionary’ change of government in speech to anti-migrant rally | CNN

 

[Star of David Bardsley]

As ever, more than one thing can be true. There is a growing resentment of ‘the left’. Some of it is unjustified, some isn’t but like them or not these people are part of a growing movement that makes a Reform/Tory government at least plausible if not probable in a few years. Ignoring it won’t make it go away.

It’s clear there are powerful figures in the media, not least social media, very willing to see the country fall into anarchy to make this more likely. It’s true Starmer could personally cure cancer and the people who hate him now wouldn’t give him credit for it. It’s also true, at least for me, that Labour have done some good things but have been a bit disappointing.

I don’t think it’s great that a lot of louts took to the streets but I don’t think everyone who did so is a lager-fuelled moron. I don’t think it’s that big a deal they did and nothing too terrible happened. I also don’t think it’s great when worse things happen at ‘pro-Palestine’ protests and get ignored entirely by the authorities and even cheered on by actual current MPs in the governing party. Some of the accusations of two-tier justice are silly but many aren’t and I get why people are angry even if I think some of that anger is misplaced.

 

[kiwiqpr]

If countries really do pull out Israel will win the next Eurovision contest

 

[kiwiqpr]

That's just weird. I believe in democracy. At the Robinson rally, Musk was calling for something quite different....

“We must have revolutionary government change… This really requires everyone to sort of marshal the people, to take charge, reform the government, and make sure that you actually have a government that is for the people, by the people,” the billionaire said.

Musk has been wading into UK politics for some time now. Last summer, during a wave of violent anti-immigration riots in Britain, the Tesla chief executive and owner of X said that “civil war is inevitable.”

Elon Musk says UK needs ‘revolutionary’ change of government in speech to anti-migrant rally | CNN

Having a government for the people would be such a terrible thing

 

[Star of David Bardsley]

If countries really do pull out Israel will win the next Eurovision contest

It’s a very, very important event and Ireland’s tantrum needs to be discussed thoroughly every year.

 

[Sooperhoop]

If countries really do pull out Israel will win the next Eurovision contest

If it's just us and Israel left even we might win...

 

[Star of David Bardsley]

I’d just have our entry as QPR fans singing the national anthem after six pints of Wrexham lager. The “No surrender” bit could be amplified by the National Philharmonic quite brilliantly.

 

[kiwiqpr]

If it's just us and Israel left even we might win...

Steady on

 

[Star of David Bardsley]

Steady on

Most countries have confirmed they’re participating. As hard as it’ll be the show may have to go on without the giant presence of Ireland and Holland. Australia are in so we can have all the same people crying about Israel being in despite not being in Europe doing that again.

 

[Stroller]

As ever, more than one thing can be true. There is a growing resentment of ‘the left’. Some of it is unjustified, some isn’t but like them or not these people are part of a growing movement that makes a Reform/Tory government at least plausible if not probable in a few years. Ignoring it won’t make it go away.

It’s clear there are powerful figures in the media, not least social media, very willing to see the country fall into anarchy to make this more likely. It’s true Starmer could personally cure cancer and the people who hate him now wouldn’t give him credit for it. It’s also true, at least for me, that Labour have done some good things but have been a bit disappointing.

I don’t think it’s great that a lot of louts took to the streets but I don’t think everyone who did so is a lager-fuelled moron. I don’t think it’s that big a deal they did and nothing too terrible happened. I also don’t think it’s great when worse things happen at ‘pro-Palestine’ protests and get ignored entirely by the authorities and even cheered on by actual current MPs in the governing party. Some of the accusations of two-tier justice are silly but many aren’t and I get why people are angry even if I think some of that anger is misplaced.

I asked one of my pub friends what the rally was about and at first he said it was 'free speech'. However, when I quizzed him as to how he thought his free speech was being restricted, he struggled for a bit and then cited Lucy Connolly. Connolly was of course jailed for inciting violence after pleading guilty. Notwithstanding her guilty plea, and those of many others jailed for violence during the Farage riots, one person on the march that I saw interviewed claimed that there were 'more political prisoners in the UK than there are in Russia'. Farage even saw fit to have Connolly on stage at the Reform conference, presented as if she were some kind of right wing Nelson Mandela figure. Pointing out that the fact that they could have their rally at all was an indicator of how speech is indeed free in this country, was lost on them.

So I pressed further and was told that the rally was actually about immigration. Fine, I can understand how people might get spooked by high levels of immigration, but numbers have come down since the last election and this government is reducing the numbers in the asylum seeker hotels that were introduced by the Tories - so why demonstrate now and not when the Tories were in power? No satisfactory answer to this other than, 'Starmer', and the fact that he had been a human rights lawyer. Pointing out to these Leave voters that Brexit had been a major factor in increased immigration wasn't well received either. 'Well no one's bothered by legal immigration (really?!), it's illegal immigrants that are the problem'. OK, I can see that, but the numbers of people arriving by illegal routes are relatively small (an estimated 4% of overall immigration). As the conversation disintegrated it became clear that for at least a couple of the group it was a particular group of immigrants that were the problem - Muslims and that fact that they don't integrate. Not just that, though, they want to introduce Sharia law and their holy book advocates killing non-Muslims. They want to kill us and create a Caliphate.

These people seem to have become prey to social media conditioning of a particularly nasty nature. Muslims and leftists are the enemy. Musk himself exhorted them to fight. 'Violence is coming. You either fight back or you die'.

The World is going mad.

 

[kiwiqpr]

In the year ending June 2024, 31,493 people arrived by small boats, 29% fewer than in the year ending June 2023 (44,460).

However, data for the first 6 months of 2024 shows that the number of small boat arrivals from January to June 2024 was 18% higher than the same period in 2023 (figure 3).

 

[Sooperhoop]

In the year ending June 2024, 31,493 people arrived by small boats, 29% fewer than in the year ending June 2023 (44,460).

However, data for the first 6 months of 2024 shows that the number of small boat arrivals from January to June 2024 was 18% higher than the same period in 2023 (figure 3).

I think the bottom line is this isn't going to stop anytime soon. Neither Tory nor Labour have had any solution and the Human Rights lawyers will just tie whichever government in knots as they are doing now. It's a wonderful gravy train for them at our expense which is rising by the day. Farage's claim he'd stop them in two weeks is pie in the sky, significant changes in the law would be a similar minefield as Brexit turned out to be and legal challenges and appeals would doubtless continue.

Ironically it was a young Human Rights lawyer that took Blair's government to court for the right of asylum seekers to be put up in accommodation and be given other freebies and won, his name was Keir Starmer...

 

[sb_73]

I asked one of my pub friends what the rally was about and at first he said it was 'free speech'. However, when I quizzed him as to how he thought his free speech was being restricted, he struggled for a bit and then cited Lucy Connolly. Connolly was of course jailed for inciting violence after pleading guilty. Notwithstanding her guilty plea, and those of many others jailed for violence during the Farage riots, one person on the march that I saw interviewed claimed that there were 'more political prisoners in the UK than there are in Russia'. Farage even saw fit to have Connolly on stage at the Reform conference, presented as if she were some kind of right wing Nelson Mandela figure. Pointing out that the fact that they could have their rally at all was an indicator of how speech is indeed free in this country, was lost on them.

So I pressed further and was told that the rally was actually about immigration. Fine, I can understand how people might get spooked by high levels of immigration, but numbers have come down since the last election and this government is reducing the numbers in the asylum seeker hotels that were introduced by the Tories - so why demonstrate now and not when the Tories were in power? No satisfactory answer to this other than, 'Starmer', and the fact that he had been a human rights lawyer. Pointing out to these Leave voters that Brexit had been a major factor in increased immigration wasn't well received either. 'Well no one's bothered by legal immigration (really?!), it's illegal immigrants that are the problem'. OK, I can see that, but the numbers of people arriving by illegal routes are relatively small (an estimated 4% of overall immigration). As the conversation disintegrated it became clear that for at least a couple of the group it was a particular group of immigrants that were the problem - Muslims and that fact that they don't integrate. Not just that, though, they want to introduce Sharia law and their holy book advocates killing non-Muslims. They want to kill us and create a Caliphate.

These people seem to have become prey to social media conditioning of a particularly nasty nature. Muslims and leftists are the enemy. Musk himself exhorted them to fight. 'Violence is coming. You either fight back or you die'.

The World is going mad.

On the ‘free speech’ stuff has anyone noticed the Giles Coren mash up? Coren is QPR fan who has opinions for money for the Times. since the Hamas atrocity he has aggressively reclaimed his Jewish heritage in print. A couple of weeks ago he noted that the attendance at the anti anti semitism
marches has dropped drastically since they started including himself and many other Jewish celebrities not turning up.

He put this down (I summarise) in the Times where he has his say on anything for money column to British Jews comparing the slaughter in Gaza to their own plight and not feeling that there is a comparison, so declining to protest.

Now, I can’t stand Coren, despite his football allegiance, and from long before he emphasised his Jewishness to the world. A vapid waste of space,skin and oxygen. But I thought ‘that’s interesting, not what I would have expected given the last couple of years of being an ethnic/religious/cultural victim’.


A week later he writes a grovelling column apologising to all the anti anti semites who are now accusing him of being a Semitic anti semite.

We love freedom of speech

 

[Star of David Bardsley]

On the ‘free speech’ stuff has anyone noticed the Giles Coren mash up? Coren is QPR fan who has opinions for money for the Times. since the Hamas atrocity he has aggressively reclaimed his Jewish heritage in print. A couple of weeks ago he noted that the attendance at the anti anti semitism
marches has dropped drastically since they started including himself and many other Jewish celebrities not turning up.

He put this down (I summarise) in the Times where he has his say on anything for money column to British Jews comparing the slaughter in Gaza to their own plight and not feeling that there is a comparison, so declining to protest.

Now, I can’t stand Coren, despite his football allegiance, and from long before he emphasised his Jewishness to the world. A vapid waste of space,skin and oxygen. But I thought ‘that’s interesting, not what I would have expected given the last couple of years of being an ethnic/religious/cultural victim’.


A week later he writes a grovelling column apologising to all the anti anti semites who are now accusing him of being a Semitic anti semite.

We love freedom of speech

I know nothing of Coren’s work (I am fond of his sister) but there’s nothing more tiresome than a self-hating Jew and they’ve been around about a day less than Jews have. The attention-seeking Jews who have to display they’re the ‘good’ Jews on Palestine marches are just the latest iteration. It’s nothing new, far from it, but they are despised by the majority.

 

[sb_73]

I know nothing of Coren’s work (I am fond of his sister) but there’s nothing more tiresome than a self-hating Jew and they’ve been around about a day less than Jews have. The attention-seeking Jews who have to display they’re the ‘good’ Jews on Palestine marches are just the latest iteration. It’s nothing new, far from it, but they are despised by the majority.

He wasn’t on a pro Palestine march, he no longer wanted to take part in a pro Israel one. Well this internecine Jew on Jew stuff is none of my business and of little interest to me, it was the rapidity and totality of Coren’s retreat back to your side that caught my eye.

Clearly, the majority are always right.

 

[Stroller]

On the ‘free speech’ stuff has anyone noticed the Giles Coren mash up? Coren is QPR fan who has opinions for money for the Times. since the Hamas atrocity he has aggressively reclaimed his Jewish heritage in print. A couple of weeks ago he noted that the attendance at the anti anti semitism
marches has dropped drastically since they started including himself and many other Jewish celebrities not turning up.

He put this down (I summarise) in the Times where he has his say on anything for money column to British Jews comparing the slaughter in Gaza to their own plight and not feeling that there is a comparison, so declining to protest.

Now, I can’t stand Coren, despite his football allegiance, and from long before he emphasised his Jewishness to the world. A vapid waste of space,skin and oxygen. But I thought ‘that’s interesting, not what I would have expected given the last couple of years of being an ethnic/religious/cultural victim’.


A week later he writes a grovelling column apologising to all the anti anti semites who are now accusing him of being a Semitic anti semite.

We love freedom of speech

People in the US, most famously Washington Post columnist Karen Attiah, are getting sacked from their jobs for quoting Charlie Kirk's own words in the wake of his death (something both you and I did on here, but I think we should be safe enough). There are organised campaigns to identify, and shop to their employers, people whose social media posts about Kirk they find to be insufficiently reverential towards the free speech martyr. Ironic, or what?

 

[Steelmonkey]

People in the US, most famously Washington Post columnist Karen Attiah, are getting sacked from their jobs for quoting Charlie Kirk's own words in the wake of his death (something both you and I did on here, but I think we should be safe enough). There are organised campaigns to identify, and shop to their employers, people whose social media posts about Kirk they find to be insufficiently reverential towards the free speech martyr. Ironic, or what?

Free speech seems to be dead in America...

Jimmy Kimmel taken off air over Charlie Kirk comments

You must log in or register to see images

'Ultimate in cancel culture': Fans outside Jimmy Kimmel studio react to shows axing

ABC has pulled late-night host Jimmy Kimmel off air indefinitely over comments he made about the shooting of right-wing influencer Charlie Kirk.

"Jimmy Kimmel Live will be pre-empted indefinitely," a spokesperson for the Disney-owned network said in a statement. Kimmel did not comment to the BBC as he emerged shortly afterwards from the television studio in Los Angeles.

Earlier this week, Kimmel said during his show that the "Maga gang" was trying to score political points off Kirk's killing.

A 22-year-old suspect appeared in court on Tuesday charged with aggravated murder over last week's shooting of the 31-year-old conservative activist.

Kimmel said in his Monday night monologue: "The Maga Gang desperately trying to characterise this kid who murdered Charlie Kirk as anything other than one of them and doing everything they can to score political points from it."

The late-night host also criticised flags being flown at half mast in honour of Kirk, and mocked US President Donald Trump's reaction to the shooting.

"This is not how an adult grieves the murder of someone he calls a friend. This is how a four-year-old mourns a goldfish," said Kimmel, who has often poked fun at Trump

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c203n52x1y9o

 

[Didley Squat]

Meanwhile, here in the land of Stupidity ( Oz ) our blundering idiot of a PM and his sidekick, Blackout Bowen, have decided amongst themselves, to increase the push for net zero, even while other country retract from it.

It’s been decided, Australians will stop work, plough all our fields, burn all our factories, thus having everybody unemployed, sooner rather than later.

Thank fcuk l’m nearly retired but l do worry about our children & families.

The Labor party are pulling out all stops to fcuk this country, once and for all. China will have nothing to take, there afterwards.

 

[Stroller]

Free speech seems to be dead in America...

Jimmy Kimmel taken off air over Charlie Kirk comments

You must log in or register to see images

'Ultimate in cancel culture': Fans outside Jimmy Kimmel studio react to shows axing

ABC has pulled late-night host Jimmy Kimmel off air indefinitely over comments he made about the shooting of right-wing influencer Charlie Kirk.

"Jimmy Kimmel Live will be pre-empted indefinitely," a spokesperson for the Disney-owned network said in a statement. Kimmel did not comment to the BBC as he emerged shortly afterwards from the television studio in Los Angeles.

Earlier this week, Kimmel said during his show that the "Maga gang" was trying to score political points off Kirk's killing.

A 22-year-old suspect appeared in court on Tuesday charged with aggravated murder over last week's shooting of the 31-year-old conservative activist.

Kimmel said in his Monday night monologue: "The Maga Gang desperately trying to characterise this kid who murdered Charlie Kirk as anything other than one of them and doing everything they can to score political points from it."

The late-night host also criticised flags being flown at half mast in honour of Kirk, and mocked US President Donald Trump's reaction to the shooting.

"This is not how an adult grieves the murder of someone he calls a friend. This is how a four-year-old mourns a goldfish," said Kimmel, who has often poked fun at Trump

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c203n52x1y9o

Free speech is still alive in the US, but only for the those on the right. Kirk was free to spout his racism, homophobia, misogyny and Christian fundamentalism but people of the left are getting shut down or sacked for quoting his own words back.

 

[Hoop-Leif]

Yay.

We've sent 1 illegal immigrant back to France today by plane.

All worries cancelled forthwith!!