Off Topic The Politics Thread

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Should the UK remain a part of the EU or leave?

  • Stay in

    Votes: 56 47.9%

  • Get out

    Votes: 61 52.1%
  • Total voters
    117
  • Poll closed .
Goldhawk-Road said:
I concede austerity may have contributed to mortality rates but there may be lives saved by strengthening the economy for the future - and not saddling today's kids with mountains of debt
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There we go.

The point is (which is where I started, I think), were those deaths worth it? And will the early deaths that are caused by the Corona Virus lockdown recession be worth it in comparison to those which may be saved by the lockdown itself? That's all I was trying to get at.

To be perfectly honest Goldie, your obtuseness has got me all confused. That, and the very good wine that I've been drinking.
 
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Stroller said:
There we go.

The point is (which is where I started, I think), were those deaths worth it? And and will the early deaths that are caused by the Corona Virus recession be worth it in comparison to those which may be saved by the lockdown? That's all I was trying to get at.

To be perfectly honest Goldie, your obtuseness has got me all confused. That, and the very good wine that I've been drinking.
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The lives being saved by the lockdown, enabling the NHS to keep functioning, are pretty clear. The lives impacted by recession cuts are less so. It's - would Mr Smith have died from a heart attack if a health visitor told him go take more exercise.

Anyway, enjoy your wine, Strolls . Therapeutic at the start of a bank holiday, however restricted.
 
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If anyone was wondering where our Home Secretary had been hiding during a national crisis. Disgraceful.

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Goldhawk-Road said:
The lives being saved by the lockdown, enabling the NHS to keep functioning, are pretty clear. The lives impacted by recession cuts are less so. It's - would Mr Smith have died from a heart attack if a health visitor told him go take more exercise.

Anyway, enjoy your wine, Strolls . Therapeutic at the start of a bank holiday, however restricted.
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The lives saved by the lockdown are far from clear.
 
West WindsR said:
I’d have said the 881 (and in reality probably over 1000) dying of a virus made it not such a great day. This country is embarrassing.
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You don't get it Watford... it's all about morale. Everyone knows what the daily figures are. People like a bit of cheer occasionally. Boris is popular. Just because you don't like him doesn't mean the rest of us don't wish him well.
If you crave doom and gloom, read the Guardian. You can knock one out to all the anti-government cr2p and death toll of 60K in there.
 
ELLERS said:
You don't get it Watford... it's all about morale. Everyone knows what the daily figures are. People like a bit of cheer occasionally. Boris is popular. Just because you don't like him doesn't mean the rest of us don't wish him well.
If you crave doom and gloom, read the Guardian. You can knock one out to all the anti-government cr2p and death toll of 60K in there.
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Embarassing, mate, albeit predictable.

They could have shown a shred of class. I think we both know The Sun couldn’t give a **** about morale and that’s not what it’s about.
 
West WindsR said:
Embarassing, mate, albeit predictable.

They could have shown a shred of class. I think we both know The Sun couldn’t give a **** about morale and that’s not what it’s about.
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Class + Sun <yikes>
They do give a toss mate and play people's emotions...Have done for years. During the Falklands/World cups/royal weddings. They sell to a certain type... like all papers.
I thought you would have commented on that irrelevant 'Little Mix' story? That's the real give away to who reads the paper? :emoticon-0148-yes:
 
ELLERS said:
Class + Sun <yikes>
They do give a toss mate and play people's emotions...Have done for years. During the Falklands/World cups/royal weddings. They sell to a certain type... like all papers.
I thought you would have commented on that irrelevant 'Little Mix' story? That's the real give away to who reads the paper? :emoticon-0148-yes:
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That’s a shame. He’s a nice bloke.
 
West WindsR said:
That’s a shame. He’s a nice bloke.
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Who's a nice bloke? If you are referring to the Little Mix (people) I am glad I don't know who they are.
One other thing about the front page v the deaths... How do we know that inside the paper there is not a comprehensive article on the Coronavirus?
I don't read so can't comment... although that is a bit of a lie. When I used to go on those Spanish holidays with the football team it was the only paper you could buy and easy to read while sunbathing. It used to have a good football section on a Monday.
 
West WindsR said:
Embarassing, mate, albeit predictable.

They could have shown a shred of class. I think we both know The Sun couldn’t give a **** about morale and that’s not what it’s about.
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come on morale will save the day!!! Who needs healthcare staff, hospitals, ventilators and ppe when we have the bulldog spirit.

I don’t think you’re believing enough and you’re bringing the country down. If it wasn’t for you Corbyn and Abbott we’d have hit the virus for six, been down the pub and be reminiscing about a war we are too young to have lived through.
 
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Goldhawk-Road said:
What is clear is that the mortality trend is going downwards in the UK, the NHS is coping with numbers, and no sufferer is being left to die in their home after asking for help.
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I think we are still awaiting the numbers of people who have died outside of the hospitals, whether alone, in caring homes etc so I wouldn't exactly class that as being clear.
 
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bobmid said:
I think we are still awaiting the numbers of people who have died outside of the hospitals, whether alone, in caring homes etc so I wouldn't exactly class that as being clear.
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I agree it can be difficult to say what part the virus plays in a death when a patient has serious underlying symptoms. The point I am making is that if someone rings the emergency services, they will be treated. In my view, had we not had the lock-down, the virus could have raced through the population and vulnerable people would have been dying in hospital corridors having received no medical treatment. Lock-down has meant control. I don't think it's a coincidence that virtually every other affected country has broadly followed this model.
 
Goldhawk-Road said:
I agree it can be difficult to say what part the virus plays in a death when a patient has serious underlying symptoms. The point I am making is that if someone rings the emergency services, they will be treated. In my view, had we not had the lock-down, the virus could have raced through the population and vulnerable people would have been dying in hospital corridors having received no medical treatment. Lock-down has meant control. I don't think it's a coincidence that virtually every other affected country has broadly followed this model.
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Logic would certainly dictate that a lockdown would result in fewer transmissions to fewer infections to fewer deaths.
 
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Goldhawk-Road said:
What is clear is that the mortality trend is going downwards in the UK, the NHS is coping with numbers, and no sufferer is being left to die in their home after asking for help.
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The day on day percentages is looking promising. Sadly we will be losing people but things are changing... Just heard that the 'speed of death rates' in London was the highest and is now one of the lowest.

On another note did any catch the interview with Stephen Powis National Medical Director of NHS England this morning. It was a must-watch. A cool, calm head that debunked half the incorrect crap that is going around.
Talked testing, PPE, how it's been handled and future.
Spot on. Thank you, Doctor.
 
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