Off Topic The Politics Thread

[sb_73]

Here are the UK Government’s proposals on a backstop alternative to avoid a hard border between Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland in the event of other arrangements not being in place in time. Better to read the actual thing rather than the news coverage which appears to be mainly about David Davis and whether or not he will flounce out, a matter of little interest to me. Enjoy.

https://assets.publishing.service.g...hnical_note_temporary_customs_arrangement.pdf

 

[Stroller]

Here are the UK Government’s proposals on a backstop alternative to avoid a hard border between Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland in the event of other arrangements not being in place in time. Better to read the actual thing rather than the news coverage which appears to be mainly about David Davis and whether or not he will flounce out, a matter of little interest to me. Enjoy.

https://assets.publishing.service.g...hnical_note_temporary_customs_arrangement.pdf

That's cleared that up, then.

 

[sb_73]

That's cleared that up, then.

You may think that, I couldn’t possibly comment.

I have spent a lot of time looking at old Clarke and Dawe interviews over the last few days, I find these guys brilliant and hilarious, political satire at its best, plus I have developed a near encyclopaedic if rather warped understanding of recent Australian politics. Until Clarke’s death last year they had been doing these 2-3 minutes snippets with incredible regularity since the 80s. Style copied (very well) by Bird and Fortune, Clarke also wrote and performed in a TV programme called The Games, a mockumentary on preparations for the Sydney Olympics (including a 94 metre long 100 metres track) which was stolen by the Twenty-Twelve and W1A programmes unacknowledged, leading to Clarke describing himself on his website as ‘a charitable institution providing formats for British television’.

Here is their take on Brexit from July 2016

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And here, because I can, is a piece of pure genius.

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‘Beyond the environment’ ......priceless. There are loads of these on YouTube, to my joy, very fine perspective reinforcers.

Sorry, should be on the review thread.

 

[Stroller]

You may think that, I couldn’t possibly comment.

I have spent a lot of time looking at old Clarke and Dawe interviews over the last few days, I find these guys brilliant and hilarious, political satire at its best, plus I have developed a near encyclopaedic if rather warped understanding of recent Australian politics. Until Clarke’s death last year they had been doing these 2-3 minutes snippets with incredible regularity since the 80s. Style copied (very well) by Bird and Fortune, Clarke also wrote and performed in a TV programme called The Games, a mockumentary on preparations for the Sydney Olympics (including a 94 metre long 100 metres track) which was stolen by the Twenty-Twelve and W1A programmes unacknowledged, leading to Clarke describing himself on his website as ‘a charitable institution providing formats for British television’.

Here is their take on Brexit from July 2016

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And here, because I can, is a piece of pure genius.

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‘Beyond the environment’ ......priceless. There are loads of these on YouTube, to my joy, very fine perspective reinforcers.

Sorry, should be on the review thread.

Very funny, I was totally unaware of these people. I also have zero knowledge of Australian politics, so the Brexit thing was a bit lost on me.

 

[sb_73]

Very funny, I was totally unaware of these people. I also have zero knowledge of Australian politics, so the Brexit thing was a bit lost on me.

Clarke was actually a Kiwi, and a legend there in the 70s playing a farmer called Fred Dagg who had 7 sons all called Trev. I like Australian politics because it’s far enough away not to get depressed or angry about, and it seems to be just like ours, full of limited self serving characters busy stabbing each other in the back and lying.

Just for a bit of lighthearted fun, nearly two years on from the referendum, let’s do a Brexit sitrep.

• We have agreed, I think, the terms for our withdrawal for £\€ owed, and status of EU citizens in UK and UK ones in EU. Irish border still outstanding.
• We have the same four broad options which existed in June 2016 - to try to negotiate the final relationship while in the process of withdrawing which is what we are doing; a clean break (which would of course be really messy in reality) with the EU, followed by a negotiated trade treaty a bit like Canada; a middle way of being an associate member like Norway; staying in the EU. Our government has ruled out the latter two options, but it’s basic strategy seems to be to push the decision point ever into the future.
• Both our government and the loyal opposition do not seem to have a clear position and are riven by internal infighting.
• Economically the EU is doing well, but politically it’s a mess with developments in Eastern Europe, Italy, Spain and a much weakened chancellor in Germany.
• Time is ticking away.

All jolly good fun. Can’t wait to see what happens next.

 

[kiwiqpr]

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get in quick
might fill up now its free

 

[Stroller]

So Trump wants Russia to be brought back to a G8. Why not tell him to **** off and make it a G6?

 

[Steelmonkey]

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get in quick
might fill up now its free

This was recorded in 2009, long before Corby and co laid their plans for Labour-Fest (or whatever it's called) - the singer of this band gives a different view as to why this gig may be a wash-out....stick with it past the false intro......

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[sb_73]

Jared O’Mara (Lab), who beat Nick Clegg to win his parliamentary seat a year ago, has now drawn about £77,000 in salary and £23,000 in expenses in his new job. He is yet to make his maiden speech in parliament and has attended about 35% of the votes held during his tenure. There have been a record low number of votes since the election as the government’s programme was eviscerated by it’s failure to win a majority. The average for MPs is to vote in about 80% of divisions.

He is a one person advertisement for reducing the number of MPs to, say, 8. We might get some good ones then.

 

[Deleted.......]

So Trump wants Russia to be brought back to a G8. Why not tell him to **** off and make it a G6?

It says a lot about his attitude that he won't even be staying for the full event...

The Telegraph has the knives out for the PM. It reported that she hadn't been granted formal talks with Trump because she's too school mistressy. Further down the report it noted that none of the other leaders got a formal meeting either...

 

[Goldhawk-Road]

It says a lot about his attitude that he won't even be staying for the full event...

The Telegraph has the knives out for the PM. It reported that she hadn't been granted formal talks with Trump because she's too school mistressy. Further down the report it noted that none of the other leaders got a formal meeting either...

I'm no great Boris supporter, but I think he's right that May is being too compliant and amenable in the negotiations with Brussels. I'd sack Hammond and replace him with someone like Gove because Hammond's approach of "the nicer you are to Brussels, the better deal you get" just isn't going to work against complete f*ckers like Barnier, Junckers, and Selmeyer. They are aggressive and negative in their approach, we are ingratiating. They are shamelessly using the border in Ireland as a bargaining chip to batter the UK into pressing Northern Ireland into staying in the Customs Union. All this, despite the fact that EU member state industries are incredibly anxious for a tariff free deal, and the Euro is heavily dependent on the money markets in the City of London.

 

[Deleted.......]

I'm no great Boris supporter, but I think he's right that May is being too compliant and amenable in the negotiations with Brussels. I'd sack Hammond and replace him with someone like Gove because Hammond's approach of "the nicer you are to Brussels, the better deal you get" just isn't going to work against complete f*ckers like Barnier, Junckers, and Selmeyer. They are aggressive and negative in their approach, we are ingratiating. They are shamelessly using the border in Ireland as a bargaining chip to batter the UK into pressing Northern Ireland into staying in the Customs Union. All this, despite the fact that EU member state industries are incredibly anxious for a tariff free deal, and the Euro is heavily dependent on the money markets in the City of London.

I think it's easy for people like Boris to criticise as they have no real experience of negotiating within the EU and I get the impression that he and a few others don't really understand how it functions.

I agree that we're being compliant but for now I think that's the right decision. I have said before that we need to be patient and cooperative for now because once the real negotiations begin Member States are going to tear lumps off each other. I still believe that's the case and understand it's already starting.

 

[Goldhawk-Road]

I think it's easy for people like Boris to criticise as they have no real experience of negotiating within the EU and I get the impression that he and a few others don't really understand how it functions.

I agree that we're being compliant but for now I think that's the right decision. I have said before that we need to be patient and cooperative for now because once the real negotiations begin Member States are going to tear lumps off each other. I still believe that's the case and understand it's already starting.

Cameron thought he knew how to negotiate with Brussels and look where it got him. I don't wholly buy this "we're the EU and totally inflexible because of our rules and regulations". At the end of the day, the eleventh hour, they're huge fudge merchants. They're using a lot of stick and little carrot at present - we just have a wilting carrot in our hands.

I agree we must stay reasonable, so that member states behind Brussels can see this. And I also agree, that once we finally decide what we want and put it to Brussels firmly, there will be big disagreements between member states, as you say, before a final deal is arrived at. In the meantime, it's critical that the UK plans for a no deal. I'd like to see these preparations more apparent, for our benefit and to warn the EU.

 

[Deleted.......]

Cameron thought he knew how to negotiate with Brussels and look where it got him. I don't wholly buy this "we're the EU and totally inflexible because of our rules and regulations". At the end of the day, the eleventh hour, they're huge fudge merchants. They're using a lot of stick and little carrot at present - we just have a wilting carrot in our hands.

I agree we must stay reasonable, so that member states behind Brussels can see this. And I also agree, that once we finally decide what we want and put it to Brussels firmly, there will be big disagreements between member states, as you say, before a final deal is arrived at. In the meantime, it's critical that the UK plans for a no deal. I'd like to see these preparations more apparent, for our benefit and to warn the EU.

Plans are in place but there is no way they're going to be shared! I don't think we will leave in March 2019 with no deal. It would be utter chaos for us but it wouldn't be helpful for the EU either. I can't see countries with 25% trade with UK signing up to something that would seriously jeopardise it.

 

[sb_73]

Privatisation - a warning for the curious.

Northern Rail, the company responsible for not bothering to run trains in the North, is happily accepting a £50k a week fine rather than put things right more quickly than is currently planned, because it works out cheaper for them.

This is an entirely rational decision for a private company to make, as it works to protect shareholder value (which must be very weak in this case). Of course it is causing misery for thousands and a degree of economic damage in lost productivity.

In general I suspect that private sector companies are more efficient than public sector enterprises, but they are driven by different deliverables. When shareholder interests diverge from customer interests, or the public interest, which isn’t inevitable, shareholder interests always win. Our leaders don’t seem to take this into account much when privatising stuff, or giving contracts to firms like Carillion.

 

[BobbyD]

Privatisation - a warning for the curious.

Northern Rail, the company responsible for not bothering to run trains in the North, is happily accepting a £50k a week fine rather than put things right more quickly than is currently planned, because it works out cheaper for them.

This is an entirely rational decision for a private company to make, as it works to protect shareholder value (which must be very weak in this case). Of course it is causing misery for thousands and a degree of economic damage in lost productivity.

In general I suspect that private sector companies are more efficient than public sector enterprises, but they are driven by different deliverables. When shareholder interests diverge from customer interests, or the public interest, which isn’t inevitable, shareholder interests always win. Our leaders don’t seem to take this into account much when privatising stuff, or giving contracts to firms like Carillion.

Which is why monopolies on things like travel And water shouldn't be privatised. Cheers for the info. The worse case being the trains where not only are they ripping off the customers but they get these giant subsidies from the government as well

 

[Stroller]

Totally partial, but totally true...………

http://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top...ial_Icon&utm_campaign=in_article_social_icons

Democracy is a process, not an event. Stop the madness.

 

[sb_73]

So Trump wants Russia to be brought back to a G8. Why not tell him to **** off and make it a G6?

Trump bashing at full throttle now given his performance in the last 24 hours.

He is of course totally malign and I would never have voted for him. But he is transparently malign and always has been, the Americans knew what they were voting for. And to be reluctantly fair to him, he is actually trying to do the things he said he would try to do in the election campaign, no matter how idiotic they are. Apparently amongst US Republican voters his approval rating stands at 87%.

I know people, people who I like and respect, who voted for him. None of them like him, and they are all a bit shame faced about it, and they all gambled that the Republican Party machine would knock him into shape or neuter him, but to a person they detest Hilary Clinton and all the cronyism and corruption she stands for. I’m beginning to think that the (alleged but probably actual) Russian ‘influence’ in that election was most likely around highlighting Clinton’s many and various shortcomings, and her undoubted elite insider status, rather than promoting Trump in any way.

The liberal elite (yay, go me!) really has taken its eye off the ball in recent years, no one to blame but ourselves. We have Brexit, Trump, Corbyn, the Italian populists, the AfD etc to show for it.

 

[kiwiqpr]

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[Star of David Bardsley]

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It’s not a great advert for referendums.