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Off Topic The Politics Thread

Discussion in 'Queens Park Rangers' started by Stroller, Jun 25, 2015.

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Should the UK remain a part of the EU or leave?

Poll closed Jun 24, 2016.
  1. Stay in

    56 vote(s)
    47.9%
  2. Get out

    61 vote(s)
    52.1%
  1. Uber_Hoop

    Uber_Hoop Well-Known Member

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  2. Stroller

    Stroller Well-Known Member

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  3. kiwiqpr

    kiwiqpr Barnsie Mod

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  4. Didley Squat

    Didley Squat Well-Known Member

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  5. Uber_Hoop

    Uber_Hoop Well-Known Member

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    Classic denial.
     
    #92165
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  6. sb_73

    sb_73 Well-Known Member

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    Bloke on the radio talking to a group of largely undecided voters in Hemel Hempstead. None of them had any faith in any party or politician really, but when asked about what was important to them not a single one, even those who supported Brexit, said immigration, tax, defence, Ukraine or Gaza/Israel. Nearly all highlighted housing, social care, primary health care.

    In France’s very complex (to our simplistic eyes) National Assembly elections a candidate can’t win in the first round unless they have over 50% of the votes cast AND over 25% of all eligible voters ie including those who didn’t vote. First round wins are vanishingly rare as a result. You can’t be advanced to the second round unless you get 12.5% of all eligible voters. I like this idea, it gives a role to those who for whatever reason (and there are lots of them), don’t vote. I wish they would take it a step further and declare that no one can be elected without a set % of eligible voters supporting them. Invalid election unless the threshold is reached.

    I’m pretty sure ‘did not vote’ will easily be the biggest single block in the current election, probably over 30% of eligible voters won’t. Labour, no matter how many seats they win, will only get 35-40% of those who actually vote, well under 30% of the total. Representative democracy, what a pile of crap. And I’m fully aware that many will blame the crapness of this system on those who do not engage with it.
     
    #92166
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  7. Trammers

    Trammers Well-Known Member

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    Hope your postal vote arrived Stan as it seems the Post Office can't cope with the additional volume of post...... who'd thunk it?
     
    #92167
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  8. Bwood_Ranger

    Bwood_Ranger 2023 Funniest Poster

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    Heard a lot haven’t so plenty who applied for one knowing they won’t be about on Thursday aren’t included. It’s another disgrace brought about by Tory negligence.
     
    #92168
  9. Stroller

    Stroller Well-Known Member

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    This was a point I made a couple of weeks ago. I think the Tories have it completely wrong with their Labour tax scares. Nothing works after 14 years of the Tories and people want the NHS fixed, better social care, more social housing, potholes filled and better infrastructure generally. They know that the Tories, with their focus on cutting taxes, won't do any of this. Instead of pretending that they won't increase any taxes, Labour should have been saying that taxes will have to go up, but those who can most afford it will bear the brunt.

    There's been massive fuss about advance of the far right in France, but they only got just over 30% of the first round votes. Seems there are deals being done between Macron's party and the left-wing coalition (which made gains almost as big as Le Pen's mob) for each to stand down where they are third, so as to give the best chance to stop the far-right. Andrew Neil's map may well look a lot different after the second round of voting.
     
    #92169
  10. Bwood_Ranger

    Bwood_Ranger 2023 Funniest Poster

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    I think we’d have better turnout with a more representative system. I quite like the one where you can rank the candidates so if no one gets 50% of the first preferences you then include second choices. It wouldn’t mean full turnout but I’m sure the number of wasted votes is a factor.

    FPTP is **** and has massively benefitted the Tories in the past sneaking in while last choice for the majority of voters of the main parties. It’ll **** them hard this time thanks to voters switching to the Nige’s National Front.
     
    #92170

  11. Stroller

    Stroller Well-Known Member

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    People seem to forget that we had a referendum on proportional representation in 2011 and it was rejected by a large majority of those who could bother to vote.
     
    #92171
  12. Bwood_Ranger

    Bwood_Ranger 2023 Funniest Poster

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    A lot has changed since then though and I don’t honestly remember it being a huge topic of discussion at the time. It would be more so now.

    Also referendums are just a very dumb idea in general (not specific to Brexit). You can’t expect tens of millions of people to be knowledgeable on something like the intricacies of AV vs. FPTP.
     
    #92172
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  13. sb_73

    sb_73 Well-Known Member

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    You might end up with a more ‘representative’ national parliament, but more than likely you would be represented by someone you didn’t vote for at local level.
    I think it’s more local councils not getting the paperwork to the Post Office than a mail system issue.

    Received my ballot paper weeks ago and posted it before I drifted off to Cornwall last week. Apparently about 20% of all votes are postal, which surprised me. If you aren’t familiar with the system it is massively open to fraud. Laughably so.
     
    #92173
  14. sb_73

    sb_73 Well-Known Member

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    While not a fan of representative democracy if we have it PR is obviously preferable as it would probably lead to more coalition governments which are slightly more ‘representative’. But that referendum was so cack handed and AV such a **** alternative that I voted against it. I’m pretty sure the Tories shafted the Lib Dem’s somehow, and serves the stupid bastards right for getting into bed with them in the first place.
     
    #92174
  15. Bwood_Ranger

    Bwood_Ranger 2023 Funniest Poster

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    I don’t see why. You could still have the same seats and candidates. You just rank your choices on the ballot so even those whose first choice isn’t the most popular first choice have more chance of influencing something. These things should be automated nowadays rather than relying on hours of counting and our broken postal service.
     
    #92175
  16. kiwiqpr

    kiwiqpr Barnsie Mod

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    Is the postal system ours anymore
    Wasn't it recently sold off to some pesky foreigner
     
    #92176
  17. Bwood_Ranger

    Bwood_Ranger 2023 Funniest Poster

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    We’re still waiting for his cheque to leave the sorting office.
     
    #92177
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  18. Stroller

    Stroller Well-Known Member

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    Lord Mann, who was appointed as antisemitism adviser by Theresa May, has criticised the Tory attacks on Starmer for expressing a desire to protect, as far as is possible, his Friday night dinners with his Jewish wife and their children...

    The attack on Keir Starmer for asserting his right to family time on a Friday night, as he has done for many, many years, is so dangerous. So insidious from those aware of why he chooses to be with his family specifically on Friday evenings.

    They really are sinking to new lows.
     
    #92178
  19. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    It's a nonsense for any prime minister to be so inflexible. Find quality periods to spend with the family certainly, but his duties to the nation come before downtime with the kids. If they don't, he won't make five years
     
    #92179
  20. Bwood_Ranger

    Bwood_Ranger 2023 Funniest Poster

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    Obviously he’s not going to be sat there eating chopped liver and roast chicken on a Friday night if there’s a terrorist attack at 6:03pm. It’s a grim attack line in an election full of grim attack lines.
     
    #92180
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