Off Topic The Politics Thread

[Goldhawk-Road]

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Obviously there will be a slant but i find it hard to believe that the voice would be made up on a main media channel. See 5:10 for the full scene of the women getting shot. Makes me even less sympathetic to what happened[/QUOTE]



Did you hear any warning given by the shooter?

 

[Goldhawk-Road]

Brexit, Trump, Johnson. All of the same stamp. One down, two to go.

You do realise you're turning into a first class WUM, Strolls?

 

[Stroller]

You do realise you're turning into a first class WUM, Strolls?

Why, thank you. I'm from the metropolitan elite, don't you know?

 

[Goldhawk-Road]

Why, thank you. I'm from the metropolitan elite, don't you know?

Ah, yes, that explains a better class of WUM...

 

[Steelmonkey]

Did you hear any warning given by the shooter?

At least 15 seconds before she was shot a few people started shouting "He's got a gun" - and this would have been visible to her too, yet she still decided to continue to break through the door. It's difficult to comprehend any other outcome other than her being shot, especially given the personalities that were being guarded at the time.

It's difficult to tell if the officer issued a warning as there were no cameras on his side of the door, and there was a lot of shouting from the mob. Castigate him all you want (and for some reason you seem intent on blaming him) but I really think words and warnings would not have been enough to halt this mob breaking through and creating havoc. The blame lies at the feet of Trump, the baying mob, and the woman herself for being so stupid.

 

[Star of David Bardsley]

Someone needs to tell these businesses to move on.

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[Goldhawk-Road]

At least 15 seconds before she was shot a few people started shouting "He's got a gun" - and this would have been visible to her too, yet she still decided to continue to break through the door. It's difficult to comprehend any other outcome other than her being shot, especially given the personalities that were being guarded at the time.

It's difficult to tell if the officer issued a warning as there were no cameras on his side of the door, and there was a lot of shouting from the mob. Castigate him all you want (and for some reason you seem intent on blaming him) but I really think words and warnings would not have been enough to halt this mob breaking through and creating havoc. The blame lies at the feet of Trump, the baying mob, and the woman herself for being so stupid.

Let's take it as a given that Trump has a lot to answer for and the woman was more than bloody stupid to do what she did.

I still find it chilling that an officer of the state can shoot someone who is unarmed dead without any warning in at least the ten or so seconds leading up to him pulling the trigger. It's not enough that others in the crowd were giving that warning. The security guard should have a duty to give a clear and final warning before he takes a lethal shot. I'm sure that would happen in the UK. Shooting is a sickness in the US.

 

[Steelmonkey]

Let's take it as a given that Trump has a lot to answer for and the woman was more than bloody stupid to do what she did.

I still find it chilling that an officer of the state can shoot someone who is unarmed dead without any warning in at least the ten or so seconds leading up to him pulling the trigger. It's not enough that others in the crowd were giving that warning. The security guard should have a duty to give a clear and final warning before he takes a lethal shot. I'm sure that would happen in the UK. Shooting is a sickness in the US.

In the UK it is a legal requirement of armed officers to give a warning - used to be a "yellow card" and a "white card" which we had to carry, and had the exact wording of what you had to state, dependant upon your perception of the danger you faced. Who knows what the legal state of affairs are in US, but I'd imagine it similar.

There are several factors in play in this incident though which need to be considered prior to coming to the conclusion that he shot her in cold blood...

Location - Capitol Hill

Personnel being protected - High Level

Threat level - High

Potential of escalation - Extremely High


We also have no way of knowing if he issued a warning. From what I've seen on that video (is there other footage?) the security officer has taken up a position tight against a wall, therefore showing as little of his body as a target - this would be standard procedure. However, from this position any warning given would probably be muffled from the videographer, by the wall and by the sound of the baying mob. I find it difficult to believe that Secret Service personnel "flap" at times like this, you don't get into that sort of position without being cool headed, so I also find it hard to believe he didn't give a warning - there will be a major enquiry and hopefully we'll find out a true version of events. Whatever the outcome, the officer will have to live with this on his conscience, and only he knows the truth.

As I've said before, I hope this leads to a root and branch rethink on the US gun laws, but I very much doubt it.

 

[ELLERS]

This thread is spot-on...

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He is right in one part. If the country, as a whole respected the result and moved on instead of years of trying to overturn it, we would have been in a much strong position when dealing with the EU. The Blairs/Adonis and Co only hindered our hand. Sadly this country has many hypocrites that are only too willing to support democracy in other countries while trying to ruin ours. The tories will deal with these people in time.

 

[ELLERS]

You do realise you're turning into a first class WUM, Strolls?

Delusional is a better way to describe that post... or desperate?

 

[ELLERS]

Someone needs to tell these businesses to move on.

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oh crap another Adonis, Independent supporter ringing the voice of doom. We only left 10 days ago they and all the others that want our country to fail need to get a life.

 

[Star of David Bardsley]

oh crap another Adonis, Independent supporter ringing the voice of doom. We only left 10 days ago they and all the others that want our country to fail need to get a life.

I’m fairly sure they’ll be wanting their businesses to thrive rather than fail. If it makes old gits poisoned by decades of propaganda feel better to pretend it’s not happening then they’re free to do so.

 

[ELLERS]

I’m fairly sure they’ll be wanting their businesses to thrive rather than fail. If it makes old gits poisoned by decades of propaganda feel better to pretend it’s not happening then they’re free to do so.

Or spoilt younger people who have spent their lives being told that if you came last in the school race you really are the winner and the result doesn't count?
As I said we are 10 days in. Give the thing a chance to work. Come back in 5 years and moan

 

[Star of David Bardsley]

Or spoilt younger people who have spent their lives being told that if you came last in the school race you really are the winner and the result doesn't count?
As I said we are 10 days in. Give the thing a chance to work. Come back in 5 years and moan

We’re currently last in the race and it very much counts as people who have suffered terribly for nearly a year already are finding out. They can’t afford to be ****ed for five years on the off chance we somehow magically emerge better off than we would be.

You’ve gone very Express this year.

 

[ELLERS]

We’re currently last in the race and it very much counts as people who have suffered terribly for nearly a year already are finding out. They can’t afford to be ****ed for five years on the off chance we somehow magically emerge better off than we would be.

You’ve gone very Express this year.

This country will do just fine. We always expected the EU to try and make things hard for us. France will kick off again at the border as we start doing well. Truth is the EU will miss us and when other countries see how well we do they may also jump ship. It's actually laughable that the Guardian and Independent have been trying to scare the crap out of people from Jan 1st... one day after we left.
A good story... Businessman trades with the EU, EU get funny with documentation, businessman gets his products from Canada, EU company loses out.
Rather than keep moaning and like some others on here wanting our country to fail, try and support it. You live here and I can tell you those EU bods in Brussels don't give a 2222 about you or your family.

 

[bobmid]

He is right in one part. If the country, as a whole respected the result and moved on instead of years of trying to overturn it, we would have been in a much strong position when dealing with the EU. The Blairs/Adonis and Co only hindered our hand. Sadly this country has many hypocrites that are only too willing to support democracy in other countries while trying to ruin ours. The tories will deal with these people in time.

Or years of the Tories not being able to agree on what Brexit they preferred.

 

[Star of David Bardsley]

This country will do just fine. We always expected the EU to try and make things hard for us. France will kick off again at the border as we start doing well. Truth is the EU will miss us and when other countries see how well we do they may also jump ship. It's actually laughable that the Guardian and Independent have been trying to scare the crap out of people from Jan 1st... one day after we left.
A good story... Businessman trades with the EU, EU get funny with documentation, businessman gets his products from Canada, EU company loses out.
Rather than keep moaning and like some others on here wanting our country to fail, try and support it. You live here and I can tell you those EU bods in Brussels don't give a 2222 about you or your family.

Aren’t you embarrassed to be a Tory member right now? I don’t even know where to begin unpicking this car crash of a post.

 

[ELLERS]

Aren’t you embarrassed to be a Tory member right now? I don’t even know where to begin unpicking this car crash of a post.

This country will thrive with or without people like you who want it to fail. I would be more embarrassed at your obvious dislike of this country?
As I said Watford, if you hate this country so much you should be abroad?

 

[Star of David Bardsley]

This country will thrive with or without people like you who want it to fail. I would be more embarrassed at your obvious dislike of this country?
As I said Watford, if you hate this country so much you should be abroad?

That will be a great comfort for the people losing their livelihoods thanks to a Brexit they didn’t know the details of until it was far too late.

It probably goes without saying that you shouldn’t display such fascist opinions (again).

 

[ELLERS]

That will be a great comfort for the people losing their livelihoods thanks to a Brexit they didn’t know the details of until it was far too late.

It probably goes without saying that you shouldn’t display such fascist opinions (again).

It's getting boring now Watford.
Funny how people are so quick to talk about democracy in other countries.... funny enough, one is in the news at present? And those same voices are the ones that tried to stop democracy here? F'ing hypocrites.
Watford we have left the EU mate. Move on and support the country that will give you money if you lose your job or look after you in hospital when you eventually need it rather than knock it at every opportunity? Trust me those bods in Brussels won't help you out. They are only interested in the money they get from us.... well that is changing.
I will leave it with this.... lets have 40 years of Brexit and then see if people want to be part of the EU again? only fair way mate.