Off Topic The Politics Thread

I think Frank should form his own party with IDS.

 

Judging by comment and applause, Cardiff audience seems to be Labour and Leave

 

Pretty bland stuff really. No shouting at the TV, just mild cursing.

 

...Corbyn, Lucas, Miliband, Livingstone, Adams, Scargill, Kinnock, Clinton, Abbott, The Guardian, Camilla Batmanandrobin, Roy Jenkins, Blair, Sturgeon, Salmond....

 

I thought Frank Field wiped the floor with the rest of them on QT.
I'd vote for him.

Hamilton is a ridiculous idiot.
The Welsh audience seemed to be in favour of leaving.

 

Clegg

 

I've elected to stay off this thread but I'm impressed by the responsible debate "most" posters have managed to engage in.

I did see this poll while having a lurk over on fantasy Island. While we have a 50/50 spilt it would seem their poll have achieved quite a different result.

http://www.wearetherangersboys.com/forum/showthread.php?192980-Europe-In-or-out

My feelings on the issue are this, we are the former masters of the largest trading empire this planet has ever seen, do we need membership of the EU at the expense of our own sovereignty? Probably not is the only sensible answer I can come up with.

The lack of trade deals hasn't stopped India or China trading with Europe, and given our position as the historical referee of Europe I'm trying to work out who would be stupid enough to refuse to trade with us out of spite. Paying off our national debt instead of giving the cash to the EU. 13 years to clear the national debt.

But there are so many advantages to staying in I hear you all say. Well which of them are negligible to me? not bloody many.

If we leave the EU I will still be able to Visit the Canary Islands or Malta If I wish, I will still be able to work in all the major economies, I just don't understand what we get for what we pay for.

Land of Hope and Glory......

 

What's the problem with Roy Jenkins?

 

if we could still be part of the single market, and travel and work in the EU without red tape or hindrance - but not pay anything and keep out johnnie foreigner. I would also vote out. So would everyone in fact.

 

Roy? No, Katherine.

 

Ah, yes, in the spirit of the great Woy Jenkins. Who can forget Katherine's covers of Lady in Wed, Born to Wun, Moon Wiver, and of course, Frankie's Welax...

 

I have to say that I cannot stand that horrible little cocky Guardian gobshite ****, Owen Jones. It may surprise people, but there's very few people that I really cannot abide, but Owen Jones is one of those. Urgh, hate the little twat.

 

But is he worse than Roy Jenkins?

 

Field joined in the lying game by stating that 250k of the 330k net inward migration came from the EU.

A bit like Johnson's £350m a week bollocks.

 

No, probably not as bad as Mr Liberal-Permissiveness himself.

 

Field reminds me of of a pound shop Enoch Powell, socially conservative, bible thumper, clearly very intelligent in a dessicated kind of way, but revelling in the role of prophet in the wilderness, avoiding ever being held accountable for his unfathomable ideas. A whole year of ministerial responsibility before he felt obliged to resign when Blair wouldn't create a new Secretary of State role for him. No one invited him back. One year of working in 37 as an MP. Adored Thatcher and adored by her. He'd fit in very well with Redwood and Rees Mogg. Anyway he's irrelevant now.

 

Both sides are talking bollox, it's their stock-in trade. They think the electorate are mugs and, it has to be said, we must be putting up with the tosh that has been claimed virtually from the first day they started campaigning. Last night Cameron was treated to a semi-hostile line of questioning from 'normal' people and was found wanting. Too much of this campaign has been to hand-picked audiences which just makes them think they can tell bigger lies.

Nobody can predict what it will be like if we leave the Union but we certainly know what it will be like if we stay...

 

You're a confusing chap Ubes. I thought you were a libertarian. I'm trying to guess what especially of Roy's reforms you dislike. End of corporal and capital punishment? Decriminalising homosexuality? Ending censorship in the theatre? Making abortion easier? Relaxing the divorce law? OK the first one I'm pretty sure, from an ancient and feisty thread of yours which was great fun.

I don't particularly like Jenkins, though I think we was a great Home Secretary. Difficult to warm to the son of a Welsh miner who ended up with an accent like his.

 

I am confused, but I try to repress it.

 

Exaggerated scare stories are deplorable, but outright lies about knowable facts are far worse imo.