Off Topic The Politics Thread

[qprbeth]

It looks like the risk has been reduced because it provides that if the EU acts in bad faith in future trade negotiations or does not use best endeavours to reach such an agreement, thus holding the UK indefinitely in the back stop, this gives the UK grounds to leave the backstop

But absent bad faith, the UK's position to be kept in the backstop is unchanged

Okay, sorry another question...who decides that "the EU acted in bad faith"...the ECJ.

Who is the arbitor, is basically my question?

 

[YorkshireHoopster]

Still wasting your incredibly valuable and productive time responding to me? Jolly D.

Don't know why you still bother. It just raises your own blood pressure. Switch him off. You'll sleep better for it and he will continue ranting to himself without annoying others ie the vast majority . And I don't mean 52/48.

 

[sb_73]

Read back your replies mate and I think (hope) you will agree they were pretty rude. If not, then so be it....we’ll have to disagree on that one.

Don’t worry mate, it really is water off a duck’s back. I’m not at all bothered by what Ellers thinks of me (in fact I’d be worried if my opinions and posts didn’t irritate him) and I’m sure that is mutual, though he doesn’t always give that impression. None of this should be taken seriously.

 

[Goldhawk-Road]

Goldie did you hear David Davis on the radio today saying that before Leo Advaark became leader (or whatever he calls himself) we worked closely with the Irish regarding the backstop and getting on really well. After that, it stopped. Davis says he is now worried that they will stop negotiating with us to keep us in.

No, didn't hear him. It would be a risky strategy for Ireland because we can still leave with no deal

 

[Goldhawk-Road]

Okay, sorry another question...who decides that "the EU acted in bad faith"...the ECJ.

Who is the arbitor, is basically my question?

No, I think it's an arbitration panel with lawyers chosen by UK and EU

 

[Goldhawk-Road]

This could also weaken our hand further in any future negotiations as it means that the EU hold the cards - who decides what bad faith is? The EU will simply turnaround and say "We are offering them this in good faith, and the UK doesn't like it." Ergo we get stuck in the backstrop until the EU gets what they want from the UK.

Yes, I think it would be difficult to prove. The EU could conjure up any number of reasons, commercial and political, to justify the position it had taken in the free trade agreement negotiations

 

[Staines R's]

Staines you don't need to get involved mate. I don't understand why you are worried about it...I'm not. Bs along with his underlings has been goading for some time. They have got personal regarding my education and other stuff...funnily after what I have read recently I could have been very personal about them but that is not my way. I know it's due to my Brexit stance but who cares. Like Bullies they gang up on posters... we know who they are and we know what they are like. I got called a 'snowflake' recently... I will say the same to them.

With respect, and it’s been told quite rightly to me before, I have every right to get involved.....it’s a public message board.
You get called ‘snowflake’, you call others ‘muppets’....are you really THAT bothered (call me a **** for all I care, it really ain’t a big deal).
If the light ribbing about your degree does bother you then sorry.....but come on mate....don’t be such a ‘snowflake’

Anyway, I’m off out for the day at the ‘Bodyworlds’ exhibition up town.....

I’ll be thinking of all you muppets, snowflakes, Brexitards, Remoaners and total ****s all day

 

[ELLERS]

No, didn't hear him. It would be a risky strategy for Ireland because we can still leave with no deal

He also said 2 German institutions said in a no deal the EU would lose 475K job losses to the UK's 12K and Ireland economy will drop 5% and the UK 0.5% so they want a deal.
Oh **** Vince cable is on Sky saying we won't be leaving the EU... he really is irrelevant

 

[YorkshireHoopster]

Okay, sorry another question...who decides that "the EU acted in bad faith"...the ECJ.

Who is the arbitor, is basically my question?

I was going to ask the same question. What I heard was that we retained the right to go to court not to have our dispute arbitrated by a third party. Does anyone actually know or are we all just reading the usual gobbledegook from our free press reciting someone else's soundbites or giving a pithy opinion of their own. Something along the lines of 'It could be this or it could be that depending on how Parliament votes in the next few days" a la Kuenssberg.

That is clearly the breaking point so if someone has access to their MP they'd better get Cox to answer that honestly, without deviation or references to his codpiece

 

[YorkshireHoopster]

With respect, and it’s been told quite rightly to me before, I have every right to get involved.....it’s a public message board.
You get called ‘snowflake’, you call others ‘muppets’....are you really THAT bothered (call me a **** for all I care, it really ain’t a big deal).
If the light ribbing about your degree does bother you then sorry.....but come on mate....don’t be such a ‘snowflake’

Anyway, I’m off out for the day at the ‘Bodyworlds’ exhibition up town.....

I’ll be thinking of all you muppets, snowflakes, Brexitards, Remoaners and total ****s all day

Enjoy. You might get back late enough to learn what our wise representatives have decided. Then again, may be not.

 

[sb_73]

EU expecting to be asked for an extension to Article 50 and prepared to give a year, on the grounds that six weeks is pointless and a year would give time for another UK election and/or referendum. What they do about the EU Parliamentary election would be interesting, presumably they could just give the existing British MEPs a temporary extension rather than making us have new elections. So Farage can continue drawing his expenses and salary for nowt.

 

[ELLERS]

Anyway, I’m off for a day at the ‘Bodyworld


With respect, and it’s been told quite rightly to me before, I have every right to get involved.....it’s a public message board.
You get called ‘snowflake’, you call others ‘muppets’....are you really THAT bothered (call me a **** for all I care, it really ain’t a big deal).
If the light ribbing about your degree does bother you then sorry.....but come on mate....don’t be such a ‘snowflake’

Anyway, I’m off out for the day at the ‘Bodyworlds’ exhibition up town.....

I’ll be thinking of all you muppets, snowflakes, Brexitards, Remoaners and total ****s all day

My Masters degree means more to me than the qualification or the letters. I have said before that while I was studying I had a gravely ill family member who supported me during my degree course and sadly passed away before I graduated. This was heart breaking for me and my family that's why I get touchy when people mock me about it.
I know any academic wouldn't knock another. Maybe they don't have any qualifications and are jealous?
Anyway enjoy your 'bodyguard' day out

 

[sb_73]

With respect, and it’s been told quite rightly to me before, I have every right to get involved.....it’s a public message board.
You get called ‘snowflake’, you call others ‘muppets’....are you really THAT bothered (call me a **** for all I care, it really ain’t a big deal).
If the light ribbing about your degree does bother you then sorry.....but come on mate....don’t be such a ‘snowflake’

Anyway, I’m off out for the day at the ‘Bodyworlds’ exhibition up town.....

I’ll be thinking of all you muppets, snowflakes, Brexitards, Remoaners and total ****s all day

Bit late for you to get a new body, isn’t it? **** off and enjoy yourself. It’s been pissing down for hours up here, at least you’ll be inside.


(What is Bodyworld? Ignore, just looked it up. Thought you might have enough of mutilated bodies in the day job)

 

[Goldhawk-Road]

EU expecting to be asked for an extension to Article 50 and prepared to give a year, on the grounds that six weeks is pointless and a year would give time for another UK election and/or referendum. What they do about the EU Parliamentary election would be interesting, presumably they could just give the existing British MEPs a temporary extension rather than making us have new elections. So Farage can continue drawing his expenses and salary for nowt.

I'm not sure the EU can exclude us from the elections, even by agreement. That's why I'm hearing the extension would not extend beyond the end of May, so we don't get involved in the elections. Lots of uncertainty atm

 

[sb_73]

I'm not sure the EU can exclude us from the elections, even by agreement. That's why I'm hearing the extension would not extend beyond the end of May, so we don't get involved in the elections. Lots of uncertainty atm

Yep. Good for Cox for giving a legal opinion that ignores the interests of his boss, though I suppose other lawyers would have destroyed him if he dressed it up.

Strikes me that if you are going into a negotiation (the ultimate trade one) having to set up clauses about ‘bad faith’ there might not be the basis of a constructive discussion anyway.

£ lost all the gains of first thing today. Which is at least confirmation that currency traders know **** all.

 

[RichardRanger]

I'm not sure the EU can exclude us from the elections, even by agreement. That's why I'm hearing the extension would not extend beyond the end of May, so we don't get involved in the elections. Lots of uncertainty atm

If I was the EU I would say, you can have your extension, BUT ONLY if you hold a 2nd Referendum.

We are very quickly getting to a point that the MP's will have to decide what is most important; their careers, their principals, or their constituents viewpoint. All the potential outcomes are equally divisive.

What a clucking mess.

 

[Goldhawk-Road]

Yep. Good for Cox for giving a legal opinion that ignores the interests of his boss, though I suppose other lawyers would have destroyed him if he dressed it up.

Strikes me that if you are going into a negotiation (the ultimate trade one) having to set up clauses about ‘bad faith’ there might not be the basis of a constructive discussion anyway.

Cox is sensibly putting his legal reputation as a QC before the cobbled together May deal. And as you say, if he'd given a politically influenced, less than objective view, he would be heavily criticised by his legal peers.

The EU could drag its heels on a trade agreement for years without providing evidence of bad faith. At present, there is nothing behind Cox's codpiece

 

[Goldhawk-Road]

If I was the EU I would say, you can have your extension, BUT ONLY if you hold a 2nd Referendum.

We are very quickly getting to a point that the MP's will have to decide what is most important; their careers, their principals, or their constituents viewpoint. All the potential outcomes are equally divisive.

What a clucking mess.

They may make it conditional, as you say, although they probably want to stay out of the UK's domestic politics, so would prefer this to come from the UK Parliament.

At the very least, the EU want to avoid a no deal, so may grant an unconditional delay if pressed hard before March 29. My guess at the moment is 2 months, so we don't participate in the EU elections

 

[ELLERS]

They may make it conditional, as you say, although they probably want to stay out of the UK's domestic politics, so would prefer this to come from the UK Parliament.

At the very least, the EU want to avoid a no deal, so may grant an unconditional delay if pressed hard before March 29. My guess at the moment is 2 months, so we don't participate in the EU elections

One of the chaps on the radio last night (who is a remainer and wants another vote) said it is very very unlikely that they will get it. He said not enough MP's in parliament want one but more importantly, he reckons to organise it fairly you would need at least a year to sort it...anything less would not be acceptable.

 

[DT’s Socks]

I still believe the plot is
Generate the watershed moment
Convince the nation we are having a second final vote ... encourage the nation that leave will win again so as not to lose faith but when the result comes in it will be 61/39 to remain.

Therefore the journey and theatre is complete

Bingo