Off Topic The Politics Thread

[Stroller]

The benefits side looks selective. What about unemployment benefits?

They're all working, Goldie. Otherwise we'd have kicked them out after 3 months.

You were quick to jump on the fact that the report from the Migration Advisory Committee, which was published today, recommended that EU migrants should not be given preferential treatment after 2020. Here are a couple of its other conclusions:

"The average adult migrant from the European Economic Area (EEA) contributed approximately £2,300 pa more to the UK public finances than the average adult resident in the UK. The average non-EEA migrant contributed around £840 pa less than the average adult resident in the UK."

"EEA migrants contribute much more to the health service and the provision of social care in financial resources and through work than they consume in services"

 

[YorkshireHoopster]

I like the way you try and twist that. She did not win a landslide and she has failed at her job so she should go. The country voted in the biggest ever democratic vote and wanted to LEAVE the EU (yes Leave, I know you don't like it, but tough). It never said how we leave it said leave. We have not implemented it yet so stop moan until we leave.
One other point.... it is not 3 Brexitiers but 17M that wants out.

Realise fully you occasionally lose your sense of humour when it comes to Brexit. Let me come at it another way. Simple multiple choice. Two options for each one Yes or No. Without hesitation repetition and especially deviation. You are not a politician so don't try to twist what I have said in your usual way.

1. Was the Tory leader election a democratic decision by the Conservative party?
2. Was Teresa May ever not going to win by a landslide given the tidal wave of support for her and the sheer vanity of the 3 Brexiteers which knocked themselves out in the first round leaving her to face the mighty Leadsom
2 Did 17 million Brexit voters stand for election?
3 Did 3 stand? You get extra points if you can name all 3
4 The one I dismissed - does anybody take him seriously?
5 Was the back stabber the alleged QPR supporter?
6 Was the one who flounced off once the Mayor of London and most recently seen putting his foot in it at the Foreign Office?
7 Did I miss any out?

You either forget things you don't like or have a very poor memory. I have never said there should be a re-run of the Referendum and have in fact told you that several times

 

[ELLERS]

Realise fully you occasionally lose your sense of humour when it comes to Brexit. Let me come at it another way. Simple multiple choice. Two options for each one Yes or No. Without hesitation repetition and especially deviation. You are not a politician so don't try to twist what I have said in your usual way.

1. Was the Tory leader election a democratic decision by the Conservative party?
2. Was Teresa May ever not going to win by a landslide given the tidal wave of support for her and the sheer vanity of the 3 Brexiteers which knocked themselves out in the first round leaving her to face the mighty Leadsom
2 Did 17 million Brexit voters stand for election?
3 Did 3 stand? You get extra points if you can name all 3
4 The one I dismissed - does anybody take him seriously?
5 Was the back stabber the alleged QPR supporter?
6 Was the one who flounced off once the Mayor of London and most recently seen putting his foot in it at the Foreign Office?
7 Did I miss any out?

You either forget things you don't like or have a very poor memory. I have never said there should be a re-run of the Referendum and have in fact told you that several times

OMG ZZZZZZZZZ
Yorkie you really do need to take a chill pill and stop talking rubbish.

 

[kiwiqpr]

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[DT’s Socks]

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This sums it up for me exactly how stupid and narrow minded Brexiteers are

It’s a nice dream for the U.K. to become 100% independent if it was at all possible I would have voted leave

The facts are there is no plan after Brexit just blame and insults from the Union Jack brigades and that won’t stop after Brexit imo

It’s the core of the rotten culture that sold out years and years ago

I won’t be living in a society that thinks like that ... never

 

[Goldhawk-Road]

Well, hopefully things will be different post Brexit. people who come here should be vetted and working (or at least be able to support themselves. Not being inhumane here but we have plenty of problems with UK citizens that need sorting first.
We need to get our own house in order and then worry about others. Plenty of homeless, sick, poor people here to deal with.

As Strolls says, enforcement has been lacking in the UK. This is in part because it's hard to check when we don't have identity cards. The largest number of illegals we have in the UK come from visa overstays, where visitors disappear into the population and are hard to trace.

Of course, some will associate identity cards with Nazi officers raiding houses in Amsterdam and demanding papers in search of Jews. But i.d. cards are common on the Continent and I believe David Blunkett was right when he tried to introduce them here with cutting edge technology. Who put an end to that proposal? Theresa May. She will need to think again, otherwise the idea of limited visa's for Romanian summer fruit pickers won't convince the public post-Brexit.

 

[Goldhawk-Road]

They're all working, Goldie. Otherwise we'd have kicked them out after 3 months.

You were quick to jump on the fact that the report from the Migration Advisory Committee, which was published today, recommended that EU migrants should not be given preferential treatment after 2020. Here are a couple of its other conclusions:

"The average adult migrant from the European Economic Area (EEA) contributed approximately £2,300 pa more to the UK public finances than the average adult resident in the UK. The average non-EEA migrant contributed around £840 pa less than the average adult resident in the UK."

"EEA migrants contribute much more to the health service and the provision of social care in financial resources and through work than they consume in services"

Strolls, here's the Office of National Statistics data in 2017:

One in seven of the 2,733,000 EU migrants aged 16-64 - a total of 390,000 - are unemployed or “inactive”.

 

[bobmid]

Strolls, here's the Office of National Statistics data in 2017:

One in seven of the 2,733,000 EU migrants aged 16-64 - a total of 390,000 - are unemployed or “inactive”.

What does inactive refer to? I'm guessing...They don't have a clue where they are or what they're doing!

 

[Goldhawk-Road]

What does inactive refer to? I'm guessing...They don't have a clue where they are or what they're doing!

It would be those that are unemployed and aren't looking for work, and would also include long term sick or disabled.

 

[bobmid]

It would be those that are unemployed and aren't looking for work, and would also include long term sick or disabled.

Ah ok

 

[kiwiqpr]

is there a reason people sneaking into the country cant be sent back to france
when i watch these border control programmes on tv people who are refused entry are held and sent home on the next plane

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.

 

[sb_73]

The Initiative for Free Trade ‘Think Tank’, which is backed by Liam Fox and Boris Johnson, has proposed that the UK should allow US healthcare firms to compete to run bits of the NHS and that we should accept US environmental and food standards (GM, chlorinated chicken etc) in return for a trade deal. In other words do exactly what the Donald wants.

How is accepting US standards wholesale different from accepting EU standards wholesale? How does that give us ‘independence’ and control?

It might be a brain damaged think tank. US firms have already spent a lot of time seeing if there are opportunities for them in UK healthcare. Simon Steven, CEO of the NHS, used to work for United Health. They dipped their toe in the water and quickly withdrew it, concluding that there was no serious margin for them unless the whole NHS was privatised and the funding of it put on to individuals rather than tax. I suspect that the ultra pro business alleged free marketeers, like Johnson and Fox, might quite like that vision of healthcare.

 

[Deleted.......]

The Initiative for Free Trade ‘Think Tank’, which is backed by Liam Fox and Boris Johnson, has proposed that the UK should allow US healthcare firms to compete to run bits of the NHS and that we should accept US environmental and food standards (GM, chlorinated chicken etc) in return for a trade deal. In other words do exactly what the Donald wants.

How is accepting US standards wholesale different from accepting EU standards wholesale? How does that give us ‘independence’ and control?

It might be a brain damaged think tank. US firms have already spent a lot of time seeing if there are opportunities for them in UK healthcare. Simon Steven, CEO of the NHS, used to work for United Health. They dipped their toe in the water and quickly withdrew it, concluding that there was no serious margin for them unless the whole NHS was privatised and the funding of it put on to individuals rather than tax. I suspect that the ultra pro business alleged free marketeers, like Johnson and Fox, might quite like that vision of healthcare.

What is it with this chlorinated chicken nonsense? The argument should be dead - period. If we import it we lose a huge chunk of the EU market for our food exports - pretty much all of our meat and dairy - and there are genuine health and welfare grounds for it. And, as I've said before, we were the ones pushing for stronger controls It would be utter madness. There's loads of countries out there who have deals with the US that don't include poultry or cattle so they can have one with the EU. We should be no different.

 

[ELLERS]

I won’t be living in a society that thinks like that ... never

No good living in France then.
You might need to move to the North Pole to get what you want.

 

[bobmid]

No good living in France then.
You might need to move to the North Pole to get what you want.

Thing is, if this chequers deal goes through nobody is getting what they wanted!

 

[ELLERS]

Thing is, if this chequers deal goes through nobody is getting what they wanted!

except May.

 

[bobmid]

except May.

The remain voters are pissed off that they lost the referendum 52/48 but lose they did. The leave voters must be even more pissed off as I presumed leave meant leave. There wasn't a third option on the ballot paper of a chequers deal. If the chequers deal goes ahead (or something similar) and if I'm correct in my presumptions then why would anyone not welcome another vote on the matter as democracy will have been made a shambles of. Not one single leave voter anywhere voted for this type of exit as it wasn't even thought of nevermind announced before the referendum took place. This is why people say 'You didn't know what you were voting for'. Not insinuating a lack of intelligence, far from it but rather having being led up the garden path (in hindsight) so to speak.

 

[ELLERS]

The remain voters are pissed off that they lost the referendum 52/48 but lose they did. The leave voters must be even more pissed off as I presumed leave meant leave. There wasn't a third option on the ballot paper of a chequers deal. If the chequers deal goes ahead (or something similar) and if I'm correct in my presumptions then why would anyone not welcome another vote on the matter as democracy will have been made a shambles of. Not one single leave voter anywhere voted for this type of exit as it wasn't even thought of nevermind announced before the referendum took place. This is why people say 'You didn't know what you were voting for'. Not insinuating a lack of intelligence, far from it but rather having being led up the garden path (in hindsight) so to speak.

We voted Bob and the result was leave. That must be implemented. Another vote will only cause more problems.
let's say remain win 51/49 do we go for a third? Not to mention that it would end democracy in this country.
let's say Leave win 51/49 will people accept it? Probably not. Do we keep voting until you get the result you want?
The problem is that May is not implementing the result properly. That's what needs fixing not another vote.
It's gone fella, move on.

 

[bobmid]

We voted Bob and the result was leave. That must be implemented. Another vote will only cause more problems.
let's say remain win 51/49 do we go for a third? Not to mention that it would end democracy in this country.
let's say Leave win 51/49 will people accept it? Probably not. Do we keep voting until you get the result you want?
The problem is that May is not implementing the result properly. That's what needs fixing not another vote.
It's gone fella, move on.

But that's the point, it's not gone. You didn't vote for this! It's not about voting until people get the result they want, hence in reality only remainers voted with the knowledge that they would remain and leave voters have been screwed! That's if the chequers deal goes through of course! we are yet to hear of any no deal scenario that's worth a piss in a pot. Sovereignty, own laws blah blah bullshit, we are all governed by others regardless. It's a matrix world ha!

 

[bobmid]

But that's the point, it's not gone. You didn't vote for this! It's not about voting until people get the result they want, hence in reality only remainers voted with the knowledge that they would remain and leave voters have been screwed! That's if the chequers deal goes through of course! we are yet to hear of any no deal scenario that's worth a piss in a pot. Sovereignty, own laws blah blah bullshit, we are all governed by others regardless. It's a matrix world ha!

I think the point I'm trying to make is if there was another vote then logic would state it should be a choice between no deal and chequers.