Interesting in the way that this discussion turned into the terrorist/freedom fighter debate, but I did expect it to! Personally I cannot decide if the end justify the means i.e. using violence. I have no issue with terrorist attacks against the apparatus of the state as long as there are no casualties, so bomb a few pylons leading to police stations and military bases, or destroy a few planes and helicopters. But I cannot justify deliberately targeting groups with violence to ensure support for the ANC, not a lot is written in the media about some of these activities that the ANC carried out - they seemed to have taken a leaf out of the IRA book in ensuring people towed the line. But my initial point remains, I just cannot understand the hype in this country regarding Mandela - 5 Live only stopped their all day coverage for the world cup draw and some of the things they were reporting on were just so contrived. They interviewed a teenager from Birmingham whose family were originally from Jamaica but she is now several generations being born in Briton. At first they explained that when they first asked her she did not have a clue what Apartheid was, she has never heard of it, but when they asked the loaded question regarding Mandela being an inspiration and the poor thing declared he was a huge inspiration to her and her familyâ¦just feeble journalism
Good discussion once again on the Watford board. French TV has covered the news, giving over virtually a whole hour of the program to look at his life. As Yorkie has shown there are times that a ruling class will not be open to discussion. As much as I dislike terrorism in any form I can well see why some are driven to it. Somehow though I don't think that Mandela is being lauded for his activities before he was jailed, but for his work after his release. France never had the same ties to South Africa that Britain did, yet as I said they looked at the world statesman and his influence first of all in his own country and then his work on a far wider stage. I don't think you can compare the leaders of the IRA with the man. They have escaped scott free from their ill deeds and their only trips abroad have been to raise funds to buy weapons. With regards to South Africa still being a dangerous place to live, that is probably true, but now the black and white population are prepared to find a way to improve matters together.
Sharpeville was the public face of the oppression. It was what the SA government did not mind the world seeing. In all these debates what is often forgotten is the broader geo-political landscape. Majority rule in SA and peace in N Ireland would not have been allowed to happen, by the Western alliance, if the Soviet Union had not collapsed. De Klerk was wise enough to realise that western governments would reduce support for SA if it became very unlikely or impossible for SA to become a puppet communist regime. For the same reason Mandela reduced some of his left wing rhetoric, used previously to gain support. He didn't need it any more. In N Ireland there was no way that the US government was ever going to allow the north to become part of the Republic. US bases in N Ireland that monitored Soviet shipping and submarine movements in the North Atlantic would have gone because the republic is officially neutral. The US would have been blind in huge areas of the ocean. Once the Soviet threat disappeared then peace in the north could be contemplated because it wouldn't really matter if The north joined the republic
How long did he survive torture and beatings in prison? 28/7 years or something? Poor bloke R.I.P. After all that he divorced after 6 months of coming out of jail, just saying.
My point about revolution is that it is the majority of the people rising up when they perceive the balance of power is changing not a minority of fanatics waging a terror campainge
Hi Dave, all. We have a nice dusting of snow here. Recovering from the ceiling club dinner last night.
Wonderful blue sky and sunshine this morning, but the downside is it comes with a fairly heavy frost. Need to re-stock the cave this morning and will be hoping to find some more of that lucky Bordeaux. Just looked at the state of the car. The farmers around here seem to have brought out half of their fields onto the roads and it is covered in mud. You can tell in the car parks who lives in the country and those from the towns. Trip to the Blue Elephant while out is called for.
Morning all from a milder bandit country. Just been to Waitrose to buy some bit and pieces and replaced a few bulbs on the outside Xmas lights, just a few more to do! We are off Ice Skating at Somerset House this afternoon and then going to have a wander and find a nice place to have a few drinks and dinner. We are meeting my sister and BIL up in town for the skating and going out all together. It's been a bit of a sad week for them as my BIL's dad passed away on Monday. He was 98 and a wonderful old character who spent years in the Merchant Navy and on the Royal Yacht and had some great stories to tell - he loved the Queen but hated Phil the Greek. He was a great HiFi aficionado and had a lovely QAD Amp which he drove into a huge pair of speakers he had hand made by a student at Cambridge. Sadly over the past few years he became more and more vacant as dementia took hold, but he passed peacefully with my BIL at his side. So we will raise a few glasses tonight in his wonderful memory. Hopefully we can contain the dirty ones this afternoon, unlike that crap going on in Oz - BB must be still in a drunken stupor!
Not at all - it's become so commonplace these days.... Your mention of Somerset House took me back a few years - I worked there for a while on secondment. There used to be a little staff bar where all the 'suits' congregated at lunch time and sipped their whiskies or G&Ts whilst glaring at me for daring to be in there, never mind drinking pints of Guinness. There was also a little record shop around the corner where I first heard the haunting strains of 'Whiter Shade of Pale'. No ice skating though - well, it was the Summer of Love after all...
It does seem to be BB….I love that old building and it looks beautiful at Christmas. Standing out on the balcony overlooking The Thames at night looking at all the buildings lit up, from the huge buildings in The City down to Westminster, I never tire of that view.
Got the Derby v Blackpool game on. Currently 3-1 to Derby but their 1st (the equaliser) was a penalty that made Leicester's one in the POSF look like a stonewall one. After that, the makeshift Blackpool defence has crumbled - 3 goals in 8 minutes. As an additional, I think the FA Cup 3rd Round draw is tomorrow, probably live on ITV after the Tamworth v Bristol City match.
Sun is blazing away, but there is still a good layer of frost about in this part of the country. We are now into the Christmas market season where many small towns set up stalls and locals traders try to sell their seasonal goods. I bought a small box of hand made chocolates last year that were very good and tasty, but when I was told that my selection was costing the same price as three decent bottles of wine I decided to give that stall a miss this year.
