The argument/complete nonsense thread...

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I do find it strange that peoples view on the lawfulness/morality of this shooting are purely based on their political views.

If the person shot dead was a proud boy demonstrating and the shooter was a police officer from a liberal state I'd still think it was wrong based on the footage.

I've have not time at all for the scumbags who broke into Wormwood Scrubs this weekend but I wouldn't want them shot for protesting.
 
I do find it strange that peoples view on the lawfulness/morality of this shooting are purely based on their political views.

If the person shot dead was a proud boy demonstrating and the shooter was a police officer from a liberal state I'd still think it was wrong based on the footage.

I've have not time at all for the scumbags who broke into Wormwood Scrubs this weekend but I wouldn't want them shot for protesting.

No difference to the lawfulness/morality/celebration displayed after the shooting of Charlie Kirk...I found that strange as well.
 
It's ****ing strange to carry a gun everyday full stop IMHO.

However, thousands of Americans wouldn't dream of leaving home without one and for them it isn't about politics.

Personally I don't think you can make it perfectly lawful to carry a gun and then use it as a justification for killing someone.

If the weapon had been drawn then that's a completely different situation.

I don't know. I'm not committing to a viewpoint as think more will come out about this matter (that may or may not be true). I completely understand that some states in the US have concealed carry permits, but then there must be legal restrictions regarding political protests. Doesn't make sense why he'd carry a loaded weapon to this.

He may have been killed unlawfully. He may have not. Recent history has shown that the initial information isn't always the full story.
 
I do find it strange that peoples view on the lawfulness/morality of this shooting are purely based on their political views.
They aren't. At least mine aren't. Maybe re-read what is actually written.
I find it strange that you jump to that conclusion. It's probably a sign of your own blinkerdness and bias.
 
I don't know. I'm not committing to a viewpoint as think more will come out about this matter (that may or may not be true). I completely understand that some states in the US have concealed carry permits, but then there must be legal restrictions regarding political protests. Doesn't make sense why he'd carry a loaded weapon to this.

He may have been killed unlawfully. He may have not. Recent history has shown that the initial information isn't always the full story.

Was it a stupid thing to do to take a gun to a protest - Yes.

Should be have been arrested for interfering with / wrestling with ICE officers - Yes.

Should he have been shot while being held down by several officers and after having his weapon removed from its holster - No.

At the point he was shot he wasn't a threat. He was being a pain in the arse and was resisting arrest but I don't personally see a justification for shooting him. I do absolutely see why they were trying to arrest him.
 
It seems to me that guns might actually be the problem , more guns = more deaths
the exact opposite of what a lot of Americans will tell you

That just is not true. Criminals will have firearms whether they’re legal or not. Allowing civilians to legally carry weapons gives them a chance to defend themselves. A good guy with a gun can stop a bad guy with a gun.

If you look at the statistics around the world you will see that countries where firearms are legal to own and carry have significantly lower crime and in particular murder rates than those where they’re illegal.
 
Was it a stupid thing to do to take a gun to a protest - Yes.

Should be have been arrested for interfering with / wrestling with ICE officers - Yes.

Should he have been shot while being held down by several officers and after having his weapon removed from its holster - No.

At the point he was shot he wasn't a threat. He was being a pain in the arse and was resisting arrest but I don't personally see a justification for shooting him. I do absolutely see why they were trying to arrest him.
at the very worst, shoot to disable not to kill.
 
That just is not true. Criminals will have firearms whether they’re legal or not. Allowing civilians to legally carry weapons gives them a chance to defend themselves. A good guy with a gun can stop a bad guy with a gun.

If you look at the statistics around the world you will see that countries where firearms are legal to own and carry have significantly lower crime and in particular murder rates than those where they’re illegal.
Research consistently shows a positive, robust correlation between gun availability and increased firearm-related deaths, suggesting that more guns do not act as a reliable deterrent to crime.

Objectives. We examined the relationship between levels of household firearm ownership, as measured directly and by a proxy—the percentage of suicides committed with a firearm—and age-adjusted firearm homicide rates at the state level.

Methods. We conducted a negative binomial regression analysis of panel data from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention’s Web-Based Injury Statistics Query and Reporting Systems database on gun ownership and firearm homicide rates across all 50 states during 1981 to 2010. We determined fixed effects for year, accounted for clustering within states with generalized estimating equations, and controlled for potential state-level confounders.

Results. Gun ownership was a significant predictor of firearm homicide rates (incidence rate ratio = 1.009; 95% confidence interval = 1.004, 1.014). This model indicated that for each percentage point increase in gun ownership, the firearm homicide rate increased by 0.9%.

Conclusions. We observed a robust correlation between higher levels of gun ownership and higher firearm homicide rates. Although we could not determine causation, we found that states with higher rates of gun ownership had disproportionately large numbers of deaths from firearm-related homicides.

 
That just is not true. Criminals will have firearms whether they’re legal or not. Allowing civilians to legally carry weapons gives them a chance to defend themselves. A good guy with a gun can stop a bad guy with a gun.

If you look at the statistics around the world you will see that countries where firearms are legal to own and carry have significantly lower crime and in particular murder rates than those where they’re illegal.
No civilian fecker needs an assault rifle like the fruitcakes in the US are allowed to have, FACT.
 
No civilian fecker needs an assault rifle like the fruitcakes in the US are allowed to have, FACT.

I beg to differ. I think the USA is a bit tight with their gun laws. They really ought to be allowed proper snipers, rpg’s and guided misiles for those with the means to afford such things. An assault rifle isn’t going to cut it vs a heavily equipped rogue government or any foreign power with the means to invade the USA. Either go all in or it’s pretty pointless.
 
I beg to differ. I think the USA is a bit tight with their gun laws. They really ought to be allowed proper snipers, rpg’s and guided misiles for those with the means to afford such things. An assault rifle isn’t going to cut it vs a heavily equipped rogue government or any foreign power with the means to invade the USA. Either go all in or it’s pretty pointless.

Or anyone who cuts you up in traffic or says nasty things to you.

Will soon make for a nicer place.