Musty, there are so many things that you have said in this thread that are absolutely ridiculous, I don't even know where to begin. Let's start with your last post; how many goals did Van Nistelrooy score for Man Utd from outside the box? I'm pretty sure the answer is none. He is one of the best strikers to ever play in Britain. Do you consider him over rated? Sinclair and Dyer are doing exactly the same as they did last year, just playing against much better teams. Sinclair would often run down blind alleys and Dyer couldn't cross. They are ball carriers that relieve pressure better than most wingers in the premiership. Maybe you don't realise, but Vidic is widely considered to be the best central defender in the Premiership, and although Ferdinand has lost a yard of pace, he is still a top class defender. If you expect any striker that cost £3.5m to get much change out of those two, you are living in cloud cuckoo land. 2 upfront is never going to be a starting formation for us this year, as we don't have the players or the experience of playing that system. And finally, your 'pass pass oops' comments are just ignorant. If you can't see the value in attempting to play passing football, at least form a proper argument.
point 1 - man utd had more goalscorers than VN point 2 - so they should improve or be replaced, what they did last year is does not matter, what they are doing this year does point 3 - agree re vidic and ferdinand but now u r making apologies that DG only cost 3.5 mill so he cant score against them? or any defence rated more than Darlington? point 4 - BR is after 6 players so maybe he is looking at 4-4-2 so maybe he can see what he is doing wrong point 5 - i like pass pass if it achieves something, sometimes it achieves nothing Leeeeon, another armchair expert?
1) You weren't talking about other people in the team, you were talking about Graham not scoring from outside the box, and therefore you don't rate him 2) They have improved a lot from last year, but you seem to forget we were predicted to finish mid table in the chamiponship, so how much can they improve in a season. Replace our two best players? With who? Where are you going to find better wingers than those two at a decent price 3) I am saying that £3.5m players are not at the same level as Vidic and Ferdinand. That is not an excuse. I am saying to expect him to play to the same level as the top strikers in the world is unrealistic. And he has 4 goals in 6 games, which as has been mentioned is a great goals to game ratio for a player of any value 4) BR isn't doing anything wrong if we get a draw at anfield, and we lose 1-0 to Man Utd and Arsenal because of individual errors. That surely means the tactics are right, and we are just missing quality players. Something we all knew at the start of the season 5) I would rather 'pass, pass, oops' rather than 'hoof, win second ball, hoof, win second ball'. Passing football has put us mid table in the premiership, with only two goals conceded at home, which when you consider one was against the champions, and the other was in a home win, suggests we have got to grips with the premiership quicker than expected. All styles work sometimes and don't work other times. Different teams have different styles, and we will stick with ours. If you are talking about varying our play, that is what you get from signing top class players. You can't just get Dyer to cross better, or teach Dobbie to pass better, they are what they are, and until we have lots of money to spend on several attacking players, we will stay the way we are. Musty, don't need to be an expert to argue with you.
I still don't get the scoring outside the box being relevant at all, graham has scored 4 goals and like all good players got into the position to do that, saying that he is a waste of space, even if you withdraw that, and use other words in their space makes me wonder if you know the role a single striker has ! Jason Scotland scored most of his goals in the box for us , and so does Sinclair for us now, probably most goals are scored like that, it just proves that they are quality players that can and do win us points! Saying someone is an armchair expert suggests that his opinion doesn't count, and let's face it musty, isn't that exactly what you are ?
Musty obviously you missed my last answer to you in regards to this I played football for my school and rugby for that matter, I never came the professional football player like you I guess, and I never became a pundit either, what I became was a supporter of my local club, and have followed them since I was a child. I also follow the swansea youth development as well as I have a vested interest in it. I am a season ticket holder and have been for years, I think I qualify as being someone who knows my team, knows the players, knows the system of play and know how a lot of my fellow Swansea fans feels, as I speak to a lot of them on a daily basis!
1. no comment, he is a poacher, not a striker 2. who predicted - a pundit who knows SFA? who cares who predicted what, i predicted we will stay up others didnt 3. rubbish, if he is playing in the PL he should be beating them or he should be sacked 4. i agree, missing quality players, and a striker is one 5. i sort of agree but how many points have been lost??????????? wolves, sunderland, wigan, man u, arsenal due to incompetance and a couple of managerial feux pas, i admit players make mistakes but this 4-5-1 is really pissing me off when the one can only score from 3 yards and the 5 are not much better
1) a quality striker will poach goals, that's his job! 2) most people here predicted we'd stay up, but will struggle 3) that really is the dumbest comment you have ever came out with, and you have made a few! 4) quality players cost more money than what we have, so we do it the Swansea way, as we can't do it any other! 5) I would say that saying its incompetence that we lost and dropped points is completely idiotic, that suggests that the team is not worthy of being here, and does not compete, we have 13 points ! Also for someone who says you have played this game, can I suggest that you write to Brendan and ask to completely change the philosophy of the team because you are the expert afterall, and he knows sod all
Musty get real will you, the reason why players cost more is that overall they are better players, and clubs will pay for that! I would love to have a rio or a rooney in our club, but we can't afford it, but you are saying to sack graham because of his inability to compete against a certain person, or to score from outside the box, now guess what even the best players in the world have the same problem at times !
Just because one player is worth 27 Million, and another 3 Million, doesn't mean that the 3 million player can't compete, or even outclass the 27 million player, matter of fact that quite often does happen, take for example our game against Manu, did any of you notice, how easy it was for Sinclair to cream Rooney, and cross into the box!! Also did any of you observe how young Joe Allen had Liverpool's Brazilian International Lucas, in his pocket!! so the reality is that the price tag, can be deceiving, and player values are momentary, for example, who would now pay £30 Million for Carol?? I wouldn't not even half that, so to be fair to Musty, he's being quite realistic in expecting Graham to do the business against such so called top players. We have a game coming up against Villa tomorrow, and they have an X west ham defender who's value on paper, is somewhat higher than our strikers, but I would be very disappointed if we didn't show up Collins for what he is, a complete wast of space, who, I'm glad is out of the Wales setup, and I would be very disappointed if Rodgers and our boys didn't make a complete ass out of him, he needs to be targeted by Sinclair and Dyer, and if Graham can't put one past this donkey, then I'm afraid some of you on here will need to go cap in hand to Musty!.................. please log in to view this image
a player is only worth what you are prepared to pay for him. it dont mean the player is better at all. how many times have you seen players move to another club for huge sums of money only to flop and not be as good for his new team as he was for his old team. A player is only as good as the players around him who make the player look good......
Phil, I understand that, but why are players worth more? well its because some of them are better its that simple, and clubs will pay the cost of getting those players, whether its one player worth £35m or £3.5m its a matter of what clubs will pay as Dai says, but when you look at it over the course of the whole season, these higher priced players generally will prove their worth. Off on a tangent slightly, we consider Vorm as our best summer signing, we paid £1.5m for him, bargain! but now we have a team coming in for him we are getting values of £10m for him from us, now somebody looking in on that will think we are mad, but we (swans fans) are all agreeing to it, so I think its a matter of perspective. we were well beaten by Man City, yet we held these players worth hundreds of millions at bay for an hour, yet they beat us by 4-0, now hands up who would tak any of the players off them in a straight swap for one of ours? Dai a comment was deleted because of the content of it, not that it was a debatable issue that I disagreed with!
While I agree with you in general Jager regarding player values, I don't in the specific issue that you are disagreeing with Musty over, Musty is quite right in expecting our Striker to be able to handle the CB's of any team in this devision, and that's why I gave you the example of young Joe in my previous post, and to make the excuse that, we can't expect our center forward to handle CB's because of their value, is ridiculous, and no amount of pontificating will change my view on that, not to mention the fact that any striker is usually gifted with twice the intelligence and ability than most centre backs, that's why they are at the back, and not at the sharp end of the pitch!................ please log in to view this image
Yes phil our players should be able to handle the opposition, but some players are worth more because they are better it's that simple, if that wasn't the case why are we getting new players in January ? And why do we want better players ? The answer is simple as well, there are no huge differences between players, one is not superman while the other is a wimp, the better players are a few percent above others, that few percent makes a difference over the season. So it's very marginal the differences between say a £30m player and a £3m player, but I would put money on the more expensive player being the golden boot winner, or in the team of the season, or being fancied for a big money move elsewhere.
I'm not disputing they are worth more Jager, just simply saying Musty is right to expect Graham to be able to handle Ferdinand, and if he can't then he should not be playing in the Premiership for us, it's that simple Jager!.... please log in to view this image
