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Match Day Thread Stoke v Hull City

Discussion in 'Hull City' started by Chazz Rheinhold, Sep 15, 2024.

?

City win ?

  1. City

  2. Draw

  3. Stoke

Results are only viewable after voting.
  1. Walter Sobchak

    Walter Sobchak Well-Known Member

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    That’s what worries me.
     
    #121
  2. Mckechnie Orange

    Mckechnie Orange Well-Known Member

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    It's not a question of disagreeing. There's plenty of tactical analysis of his German sides to support the point, that Walter wants to draw everyone out of the centre to create space for the direct ball from the keeper in the centre of our own half (or edge of the centre circle) up to the edge of their box. It's not launching long balls due to the fact the back 4 and keeper are much higher up the pitch.

    If it was long ball Macca would stay put and launch long diagonals as he's adept at doing, but that's not what's being asked.

    The German guests on 1904 and Humberside alluded to it, Baz referenced it most in the most recent one and there are YouTube videos analysing it both at Kiel and Hamburg.

    Just do a search 'tim Walter tactical analysis and you'll see huge open spaces in the middle of the pitch everywhere he's been.

    Where do you think the phrase 'heart attack football' came from?
     
    #122
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2024
  3. Mckechnie Orange

    Mckechnie Orange Well-Known Member

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    I just don't see it working in the championship.
     
    #123
  4. oozkan

    oozkan Well-Known Member

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    I agree with this, possesion football is an expensive way of playing football, requires high technique - moderate physicality, which is rare to find in market. If an oil lord buys team from Acun, we can try those fantasies, but not today.
     
    #124
  5. Mckechnie Orange

    Mckechnie Orange Well-Known Member

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    Doesn't matter how rich the owner is, would still be limited to FFP constraints.

    But I agree that many leagues are less physical, competitive and punishing than the championship though. Others are more technical and what works in one league doesn't necessarily work in another
     
    #125
  6. Mckechnie Orange

    Mckechnie Orange Well-Known Member

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  7. Steven Toast

    Steven Toast Well-Known Member

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    Well yeah. We keep mentioning other teams that have been successful, but look at what got us promoted the last few times.

    We didn't really have a specific way under Brown, we just did the basics well.

    Under Bruce the first time, we had a system that relied on crosses and pace out wide using a 3-5-2 and a 4-1-4-1.

    The second time, we effectively had a PL team and players like Robertson, Diame and Hernandez, we were just better all round than most teams.

    We don't do the basics well enough. It feels like we're trying to run before we can even stand up, the basics aren't there. We give the ball away in key areas, we play out from the back without exception, our set pieces are all taken short, even the throw ins are defensive and we waste time waiting for a full back to come over to take them.

    We probably have better players than half the league, but what they're being asked to do is just beyond mental when some of them have never played English football, and so aren't familiar with the sort of thing they'll be coming up against. Belloumi is used to playing in Portugal, where I imagine (please correct me if I'm wrong HFFP), there's a bit more time on the ball and a lot more technical play on show. Same with Zambrano in Colombia.

    I imagine Puerta wouldn't struggle as Germany is quite similar to the EFL and it makes sense that Millar seems to have a grasp of what full backs will do and when.
     
    #127
  8. balkan tiger

    balkan tiger Well-Known Member

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    Too many managers, tacticians, data analysists, and armchair experts trying to play football like it's a game of chess.
    The old military saying that all the plans go to **** when you meet the enemy face to face apply to football too.
     
    #128
  9. Mckechnie Orange

    Mckechnie Orange Well-Known Member

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    But of a concern that Puerta didn't get in the squad then isn't it? Selection decision not fitness.
     
    #129
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  10. Mckechnie Orange

    Mckechnie Orange Well-Known Member

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    This is true.

    Ultimately you can set up any way you want but still have to adapt to the situations occurring within games. When a system is over-prescribed then it seems to inhibit players being able to do that.

    But the definition of a philosophy still leaves space for individuals to make decisions within the scope of that philosophy, rather than rigidly sticking to specific instructions all the time.
     
    #130

  11. Ajbtiger

    Ajbtiger Well-Known Member

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    They've hardly had the chance yet though, and yes, there is an element of running before we walk but its pretty unavoidable as the only way to get to grips with it is to do it. The coach and the players deserve a bit of time to try and make it happen. There does have to be a time when our league position comes in to question and our future protected but right now thats very premature and I think ignores all the variables that led us to been so unprepared for the start of the season.

    Maybe it all fails and can never work, but what do people want because it seems like a lot of folk are very negative about Tim and the style but then saying he deserves some time. But what kind of time, surely it would be time within a positive and hopeful environment conducive to success as opposed to what seems like, Go ahead Tim, I really want you to succeed but while you try I'm just gonna hold this gun to your head as I expect you will mess up.
     
    #131
  12. PLT

    PLT Well-Known Member

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    Aren't you being an armchair expert by so confidently dismissing the decisions of the three kinds of actual expert you've listed?
     
    #132
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  13. Steven Toast

    Steven Toast Well-Known Member

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    He picked the team vs Sheffield United from what was essentially a full deck, minus Rushworth (who probably wouldn't have played as GK isn't the issue), Hughes (wouldn't have guaranteed to have come in) and Sinik (usual stuff). It failed badly.

    It's hard not to be negative given that the conclusion we come to is so self evident. Even with the mitigating factors of time, tactical understanding and settling in, it was still overwhelmingly poor and we're kidding ourselves if we think that after two and a half months we shouldn't see some inkling of a plan. Until last Friday, we had been improving little by little, but I didn't see anything in the Sheffield United game that suggested we were still heading in the right direction. Mehlem's header and Belloumi's cross-shot aside, we didn't make their keeper sweat at all.

    After five games, we're not looking good. Odds are we won't look much better on Friday if there isn't a big change in terms of playing style or understanding. We always say "judge after 10 games." Well, we're halfway to 10 and it's nothing short of bullshit, so if games 6-10 are absolute blazers, I'll be stunned.

    I want him to succeed, just like I did Rosenior and Shota, but this just doesn't feel right. I don't get the feeling from the players that they are totally convinced either, judging by their body language.
     
    #133
  14. Amin Yapusi

    Amin Yapusi Well-Known Member

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    Is there a TL:DR?
     
    #134
  15. Mckechnie Orange

    Mckechnie Orange Well-Known Member

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    He does deserve time, I think the majority of speculation is surrounding how much time if we're not seeing a tangible improvement in the next run of games.

    Because there's precious little sign of that so far, and more questions than answers over how his philosophy will fit the championship.

    That said, there's only a few saying he should go immediately. But we know the owner is unlikely to be patient if we look like going into the winter period in a relegation scrap.
     
    #135
  16. askewshair

    askewshair Well-Known Member

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    The previous home game, Zambrona and Symonds were successfully trying to find little pockets, but Two centre backs were ignoring them.
    The worry for me if the bad run continues is the system is probably not for those out of form/ having a crisis of confidence.
    Something I have noticed, everyone seems to love Pandur, and he has looked very comfortable all season to be fair. His heat map is probably ten yards further forward than Allsopp’s. At some point, he will without a doubt get lobbed. I wonder how Tiger Nation will respond then, considering Allsopp was lambasted from that Watford lobbed equaliser on.
     
    #136
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  17. Mckechnie Orange

    Mckechnie Orange Well-Known Member

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    If they were successfully doing what the manager told them then why were they dropped?

    To be fair, re allsopps lob, I think most would have given him the benefit of the doubt and applauded the finish if he hadn't been perceived to have cost other soft goals too. It's all about context.
     
    #137
  18. bradymk2

    bradymk2 Well-Known Member

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    Lets just ****ing beat ****ty stoke
    Thats all there is to say
     
    #138
  19. Walter Sobchak

    Walter Sobchak Well-Known Member

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    We just don’t look like a team at the moment that are all pulling together. Forget the style, the players look lost.

    The buck stops with the manager but he certainly hasn’t been helped by Acun waiting so long to sort the squad out.
     
    #139
  20. Evington

    Evington Well-Known Member

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    A team will always beat a group of individuals even when the numbers are equal.

    I'm expecting another defeat and even worse a lack lustre performance.

    Let's hope I'm wrong.
     
    #140

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