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Spare Parts (F1 odds and ends)

Discussion in 'Formula 1' started by Masanari, Sep 22, 2011.

  1. ched999uk

    ched999uk Well-Known Member

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    Seems like FIA have issues a statement on the Ferrari PU. It reads to me that they were not 100% positive they could prove, in a court, that the Ferrari PU operated in an illegal way. So they chose to stop them in future by using an additional fuel flow meter!

    That is a much better answer then the 'we came to an agreement' statement.
    OK so it's not proof either way but at least they are stopping foreseen methods of using more fuel than the fuel flow meter was showing by using an additional fuel meter.
    While, in my opinion, Ferrari did use a little more fuel than the 100kg/hr max (+ tolerance) they did it in a way that was not clearly breaking any rules. So well done to them.
    I would be very surprised if there was a single team that had not broken or bent the rules in their time. In fact I would even go so far as to say every team have some devices or operating modes that bend the rules until FIA issue technical directive 'clarifying' the situation.

    Engineering innovation is great, I just wish we could have more of an insight of it.
     
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  2. Big Ern

    Big Ern Lord, Master, Guru & Emperor

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    IIRC Williams didn't bother complaining because they felt they would look callous using the courts to claim the title due to Senna dying. Flabio & Schumi got off the hook, but I can't see RBR or McLaren doing the same, unless the goal is to permanently break Ferrari's hold over the FIA.
    Motor-racing is full of cheats, the higher up the formulas you go, the better the art of cheating.
    Water-cooled brakes will always be my favourite, pure genius.
     
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    Last edited: Mar 5, 2020
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  3. Number 1 Jasper

    Number 1 Jasper Well-Known Member

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    We’re the water cooled brakes from 1982 where the foca teams started the race at the legal weight limit then as the brakes were cooled and the water tank emptied they were well under at the end ?
     
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  4. Big Ern

    Big Ern Lord, Master, Guru & Emperor

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    Yeah, though I'm not sure the water ever got to actually cool the brakes.
     
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  5. ched999uk

    ched999uk Well-Known Member

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    I think I read that they dumped it before even getting to the grid :)
     
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  6. Number 1 Jasper

    Number 1 Jasper Well-Known Member

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    Must admit I winged it with the actual cooling bit , was not sure .

    Brilliant though :)
     
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  7. El_Bando

    El_Bando Can't remember, where was I?
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  8. Number 1 Jasper

    Number 1 Jasper Well-Known Member

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    Renaul Furlough their staff .

    IMHO it was not set up with F1 in mind !
     
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  9. El_Bando

    El_Bando Can't remember, where was I?
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    RIP Sterling moss. What a life he has led.best driver never to win a champ
     
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  10. Number 1 Jasper

    Number 1 Jasper Well-Known Member

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    #4310
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  11. ErnieBecclestone

    ErnieBecclestone Well-Known Member

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    Imagine driving around Italy of all places averaging 100mph for 1000 miles in 1955 and not hurting anyone, top man, set a world record.

    Stood very close to Stirling at Goodwood pits fencing a few years ago without realizing who he was until he turned around and walked off and I turned around to walk off and bumped into Chris Evans ffs. How lucky can you get EH
     
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    Last edited: Apr 12, 2020
  12. SgtBhaji

    SgtBhaji Well-Known Member

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    They just don't make racers like that anymore. And absolute legend, icon and a gentleman. God-speed! :'(
     
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  13. TopClass

    TopClass Well-Known Member

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    #4313
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  14. ched999uk

    ched999uk Well-Known Member

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    Ferrari have now been 'clarifying' what they said!!! They seem to be back tracking at an incredible pace that if seen in it's F1 cars would have them winning races!!!!!!

    I've seen other reports where Ferrari and Red Bull are suggesting that as they make parts for other teams they should have a bigger budget!!!! Surely they are making some money out of the extra components they sell? Doesn't that mean that their 'budget' will go further as they have the income from parts sales or doesn't that count?
    I guess the alternative is 'Hass' design and make the suspension components and 'sell' them to Ferrari to spread the costs???
     
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  15. Justjazz

    Justjazz Well-Known Member

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    Culturally I think it runs deep in Ferrari. The history of motor racing is about building the best car and until recent times that is what it has always been about. Pushing boundaries. The sport has changed, it has become big business, brand creation and maintaining. Why are Ferrari in F1, because it fits with their ethos. If F1 is no longer compatible with that ethos, why would they not quit. It is not about being scared.

    Ferrari, as a company, have to consider who they are going to be in 10, 20 years time when cars are no longer drinking high octane fuel. The brand Ferrari is synonymous with speed, don't damage the brand by dumbing down to the lowest common denominator. A decision would be a commercial decision, what is the right direction for Ferrari, the branding etc, in a post historical F1 style. That old saying, quit while you are ahead.

    I would love a Ferrari car but doubt I would buy one. Seems pointless. My cousin has had several classics over the years, still does, along with his practical (<laugh>) Bentley. I would rather waste my money on a sail boat and turn up in a practical Range Rover, second hand of course.
     
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  16. ched999uk

    ched999uk Well-Known Member

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    I think you are right about Ferrari should be thinking of 10 -20 years. I do think FormulaE played a blinder in securing themselves as the only all electric series for 25 seasons. I don't think that ends till 2039!!! So either F1 switch to an alternative fuel, maybe hydrogen or they will have to come to some sort of financial deal with FIA and Formula E to go all electric. Seeing as most of Europe are pushing for electric cars Ferrari need to be seriously investing in electric power. So to stay relevant I think that within the next 5 years or so F1 needs to switch Power Units. I think the current concord agreement is due to cover next 5 years using same PU as now, maybe with more synthetic fuel and or more electric power?

    You just have to look at the Teslas to know that performance is relatively easy from electric power units. Unless Ferrari and the other manufacturers push for a change in F1 Power Units to something more akin to what will be on the road they will all die........
     
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  17. Justjazz

    Justjazz Well-Known Member

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    I agree with a lot of what you are saying. If F1 becomes irrelevant it will die, much as we like it. The times, they are a changing, faster than we think.
    I can't see that Formula E has a patent on electric power. Covid 19, Climate change, F1...what is the world coming too, nothing is sacred.
     
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  18. ErnieBecclestone

    ErnieBecclestone Well-Known Member

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    Agree totally, I am 74 years of age,thinking of retiring this year and believe the entire human race has to change direction, how !!! I dont have a clue, but petrol based F1 is finished, I followed F1 since 1959 loved it, attended most British GPs up to 2000, never gave a thought about the environment until more recent years. Personally I dont trust electronic Technology, have worked with it virtually all my life, and it constantly fails basically due to incorrect specification and environmental isues, water, temperature, vibration, human ignorance, and the list goes on and on, Flying driverless cars never ever going to happen.
    The root problem is energy generation produces unwanted and harmful side effects, however I do think Nuclear power generation could be considered as a way froward, Nuclear power generation is a simple idea and works brilliantly just look at our Trident submarines, however the undesirable waste products need to be handled and isolated away from planet earth, the harmful waste could be rocketed into the sun where it would simply be consumed and destroyed. A global Nuclear power generation process under transparent controlled management needs to be considered. At the very least this would provide clean electrical power for the recharging of electric cars.

    Although maybe we could continue for a couple more years to allow Hammy to exceed Schumacher,'s record, eh.
     
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    Last edited: Apr 24, 2020
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  19. ched999uk

    ched999uk Well-Known Member

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    Not sure that's a great plan. Years ago we dumped waste in the sea and then learned that was bad and caused pollution etc No idea what possible consequences there could be of trying to put nuclear waste on a rocket, imagine it exploding on take off plus I thought nuclear waste was very heavy.

    Anyway I do think a combination of renewable energy sources, batteries and nuclear power is the way forward for our electrical needs.

    F1 wise we are all so used to noise of some description electric doesn't really have the same impact. My guess is then need to look at hydrogen as a fuel source. Synthetic fuel is a non started for me as it's just burning other stuff and creating the same pollution as 'petrol'.

    As for trusting electronics it's all about how it's specced and used. Think about how many times you hear a jet engines ECU (FADEC) fails??? Very rarely as they are specced, made and tested very well. Consequently they are expensive!!! For non life critical electronics they do cut corners big time partly due to building in obsolescence. I bet the control and safety systems for nuclear plants are quite well specced <laugh><laugh>
     
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  20. ErnieBecclestone

    ErnieBecclestone Well-Known Member

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    Yea, what an opportunity for someone to progress the creation of safe Global Nuclear Power Stations complete with visible management and maintenance procedures and management and disposal of waste material, I'm convinced that a safe rocket system to dispose of waste can be achieved, and where else is safer than the sun to dispose of radioactive material, thats where it came from, we just need the right people on board to achieve the target, going down to see my bank manager on Monday to see if he can finance the project, will be in touch, looking for project managers.
     
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