Scottish Independence

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Chaninbar said:
Not all Aussies think like you Cyc. On my only visit down under a local was keen to explain the difference between Kiwis and Aussies. He carefully explained the different accents (fush and feesh and all that) but concluded by pointing out that all kiwi ladies are easily identified because they are all complete sluts <laugh>. I would point out that I was in Western Australia at the time and I understand that they are viewed as a breed apart.
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I love those Kiwi women, they are nice "earthy" folk. Wonder what that says about me. <laugh>
 
For me it's simple it has to be a yes ! I think that with this vote it will be achieved ! My thinking is in any voting be it for Europe or a general election there is such a poor turn out people who are in between and don't know won't vote most of the no camp will not bother ! But the people who think yes will 100% go and vote ! The way I see it is that why settle for less when you can have so much more . If we are a burden on the rest of uk why fight to keep us ? Why do we put more into the pot and get less out of it per head ! But biggest thing for me is that millions have died all over the world by fighting for independence we can have it by crossing a box
 
Betting is only there because of opinion polls which is 2000 people asked of 3m that can vote so it's based on 0.0067% of the population that can legally vote !
 
I did not get to see the debate tonight but reading around I get the sense that both ran to form in that Alistair Darling did not have anything much to say beyond it will be a bad thing and Alex Salmond simply avoided answering the difficult questions with any clarity as he always does. By the sounds of it neither did anything to get people to warm to them or mask the fact that personally they are quite easily dislikeable for different reasons.

I do always go with the bookies on these things and they see it as a no contest, I also think there may be a lot of people who outwardly may not want to appear unpatriotic or nationalist among friends but in the privacy of a polling booth may not want the uncertainty which a yes vote would bring. If there is one thing people hate it's uncertainty and there is a lot of that involved with a yes vote.
 
Funny ol business this Scottish referendum. A year ago when the odds were compiled I thought that the yes vote was the classic back to lay. I didn't invest mind. I considered Salmond a fairly shrewd political operator who would grow support over the year. The odds and polls would suggest that hasn't happened. The yes campaign can point out that they currently have a Westminster govt where the dominant coalition partner has virtually no representation in their country. That should be an easy vote winner. However Salmond needs to get himself out of a right fix with the currency issue. He felt he could ride this out by playing the role of the bully's victim in that the scottish have just as much right to the pound as the rest of the UK. He may be right but in my view it totally undermines the reason for splitting up. If scotland are to prosper and venture off to the promised land where the streets are all paved with gold, how can he want to tie his countrymen to the economy of his plodding neighbours. Anyway I think I have the answer. Let the scots have the pound, yes it's all your Mr Salmond. The rest of us can adopt another currency. Euro? No chance! How about the guinea - 21 shillings. According to wiki (seldom wrong) it was first minted in England though I'm sure we wouldn't mind sharing it with our welsh and northern irish friends. Although should scotland actually do a Norway I suspect the other celts will soon be giving us the 2 finger salute too. <laugh>
 
Looks funny know as we will be back in &#55357;&#56834;&#55357;&#56834;&#55357;&#56834;! Salmond was smart he made darling say negative things such as ! Scotland can't ! Scotland are not capable off ? Scotland won't be able to ? Polls are a thing of the past only one poll counts and September 18th it does ! For me a yes voter will definitely go and vote will a no voter ? Why settle for less when we have the potential to have so much more in the present and the future ! The great went out of Britain a long time ago ! I seen all those commonwealth nations in Glasgow and not 1 has came running back . Obama says no to independence but celebrates Independence Day on 4th of July will America come running back ? Must be the only group of countries that are run as 1 ! Yugoslavia gone the ussr split up but the uk still being run as democratic country that is no more democratic as Cuba Russia and North Korea even Iraq got the goverment they voted for Scotland must be the only country in the world that has 1 member of parliament that is with the Tories we even have more giant pandas than Tories ! Labour is doomed if we get Indy that's why there against it ! But I want a Scottish labour to come after the Indy for the Scottish working class like the morals the Labour Party where founded on not Tory in red ties !
 
Salmond is the arch politician. And what is the diet of a politician? They have to eat their words, and that's exactly what he'll have to do whether the vote is YES or NO.
 
What I'd like to know is: would independence mean that Scotland would have its own Top 10 Chart?
 
It's not looking good for Salmond after his remark yesterday that they are keeping the pound in a monetary union because it's theirs to keep and he claims the right to do so lays with the sovereign right of each Scottish person.

All A. Darling needs open the next debate with is this remark.

Alex, you are the first minister, you are leading a campaign to persuade the people of Scotland to vote for independence but with this one comment you have demonstrated that you do not understand law, you do not understand politics and you are asking people to accept something as a certainty that you simply have no power to deliver. You cannot claim a sterling monetary union without the consent of the Uk in which you will then have no say. Furthermore your reliance on a scenario in which the UK govt are bluffing is not a suitably mature political platform in which to ask the nation to vote for independence, were they to be bluffing they would lose all political credibility overnight, a fact that surely would not escape them and be enough to ensure they stuck to their position. If we as Scots are being asked to vote on a promise of keeping a monetary union, then I must expose you now as someone who does not have the legal right to enforce such a thing, if we as Scots are being asked to vote on your hunch that the Uk govt are bluffing then I must expose you now as a politician who should never have been leading this campaign in the first place. If you are reverting to the position that if they do not let us have what we want we will accept no part of the credit card debt we jointly built, then I say even worse, as you do not stand for the sincere and moral attributes that I believe are held proudly by us Scots.


I feel he used the remarks yesterday as he has been completely boxed in and it was his last throw of the dice. The truth is he can keep the pound but not in a monetary union, he can establish a new currency or he can apply to join the Euro, he cannot have a monetary union with another country without their say so.

I feel he has made a monumental error in his handling of this, his position should have been in my opinion that.

During the period of negotiation which I expect to be around 18 months from the vote we will explain what we believe are clear and obvious benefits for both independent countries remaining in a monetary union. It is my belief that although not a perfect solution it will be seen by both sides to be the most sensible on in the light of the many other issues which will need be negotiated. Should the UK Govt decline this option however then we will assess our options very carefully and hopefully decide to either apply to join the Euro or establish our own currency. Should either of these options not be implemented within that time scale we will retain the pound outside of a monetary union until a more long term solution is agreed among all of us. Our message to the scaremongers is that after the vote nothing will change for 18 months as we will still be a member of the UK during this period, we will then have time to assess our options and engage in sensible discussion away from the politics of this referendum. What I will say however is that we are voting not to avoid some immediate issue that can and will be reconciled, we are voting to change course, to begin to take the wheel for ourselves, and this will have positive effect for generations.

I believe this would have put him in a much better light.
 
You should be out here. Most people think this is all Braveheart revisited, and they believe it (both the film as a truthful account and the sentiments expressed in it being relevant).
And once in the US when I said I lived in England but worked in Scotland I was asked if the Scots didn't hate me being English and didn't make it difficult for me!!

There is no doubt that the arrogance of the English gets up people's noses. But it's less dangerous than ignorance, and you can trust the people more.
 
That's my worry that the nationalists make this about patriotism, which in 2014 is the last thing it should be about. A big problem is the divide it could cause between the Scots themselves. I actually think Salmond just wants to be Braveheart, a place in history. I actually feel if there is a NO vote that he will be cast aside along with his sidekick, Nicola Sturgeon. I think people will look back and see them as a couple of nationalist chancers, way out of their depth in 2014. I think people will reflect that they made it about the wrong things, went about it the wrong way and did not have the personal depth and abilities to lead something of this magnitude.
 
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