Same old, Same Old

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Cottager58

Cottager58

Well-Known Member
May 2, 2011
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Jol summed up today's performance in one sentence - We had 3.5 chance which is poor at home". Indeed, our shooting attempts on target in the last 5 games is now 10.

The starting line up was as predicticted by most but it wasn't working so why more and earlier substitutions were not made is mystifying. We were shouting for some new effort in midfield. Neither Sidwell nor Kasami could have done worse than their counterparts.

For the Dnpro game he must put in Baird for Senderos, Sidwell for Etuhu and Dembele for AJ. And yes, Kasami for Murphy. We need to take some goals to the Ukraine, then he can stuff the side with defense in mind.
 
Mostly agree with you apart from Kasami for Murphy. I think that is jumping the gun a bit. In as a sub maybe.
 
Was only watching the game over the net as not able to go in person. Agree the team looked a bit overworked without the right formation. RB is a must and if someone is not bought Baird needs to come back. 4-4-2 with AJ is not a workable system. If Bendtner was on instead of AJ yes. If Dembele is on we should be playing 4-4-1-1. Still early and the EL games against lower opposition can't be used to justify AJ up front.
 
Totally agree with the title of the thread, Cottager and most of what you say.

I think part of the problem is that Bobby, who is our main man, is just not firing on all cylinders at the moment. Whether he's distracted by his hand or just not fully fit at the moment I don't know but he looked slower and less sharp than usual. When the ball was crossed into the box (which Riise and Duff did fairly well) too often there wasn't anyone there or they were in the wrong position.

Having said that, after Bobby went off we looked even less like scoring.

Totally agree that Sidwell should start on Thurs and Kasami should be given some time as a sub (was very surprised neither came on yesterday).

I'm not going to criticise Aaron Hughes because he's a geat player and he's doing his best out of position (and his dive into the JH stand was very funny) but, as we say on every thread these days we need a new RB. And a new striker. Now.
 
Morning all.

Was not at the game yesterday but watched the highlights on match of the day. Last spot on there as always, although to be fair, we probably warranted it.

It seemed like the opening round of a boxing match, both teams eyeing up the opposition but never really trying anything too adventurous. From what I saw, we had the better chances but did not put them away. Riises's early effort should have been on target and BZ should have got on the scoresheet.

From what I have read here and on other sites, is that we lacked anything in the middle of the park. Etuhu was seemingly dreadful, whilst Danny seemed a bit off the pace. The MOTD footage showed for me what we have all been saying: Senderos is no where near as effective as Hughes at centre back. He kept giving away needless fouls and played far too tight to players, against better strikers he will be found out.

When we had the ball though, we looked dangerous, although it seemed that we did not get Duff into the game enough.

Agree with 58, we have to hget Baird at right back and Sidwell needs to get some gametime, or bring in Gecov, who I assume is currently injured. All in all, a fairly uninspiring start but only first game of the season against a well organised team. A point is better than getting thumped 4 - 0 at home like QPR !!!!

COYW
 
Agree with many points, the game was a mixed bag. My main concern, was the lack of introduction of substitutes. I was at the game and shouting for sidwell to come on as soon as possible, as etuhu was woefully below par and all the fans really new it. The concern is though, that Jol admitted Dembele was not match fit to play, so to be fair he gave he 15 mins, not really enough time to influence the game. However, besides this no other changes were made in a game where it was anyones to win. This suggests he seriously lacks faith in our bench. I saw no reason why sidwell and kasami could be given a chance to influence, as we looked stagnant for the last half an hour. Also, I believe the main problem with senderos is his ability on the ball. Positionally he knows whats hes doing, though his 1st touch is horrendous and this puts us under pressure straight away. I hope once a right back comes in that hughes reverts back to centre half. As I predicted though, it was Bent's awful offside positions which saved the game for us! Positives I think duff and riise combined well on the left when duff played over there, clearly more effective than when hes on the right.
 
The positives in yesterdays performance were moments of good passing and movement to create 3 or 4 good chances, but not enough. Riise did well as an attacking full back. Schwarzer didn't have too much to do. Bent never really threatened (disallowed goal was offside).
Like the look of Dembele when he came on, started to panick the Villa defense, but needs to know when to release the through ball, Riise and Duff combined well later on.

The negatives.
Etuhu distribution is poor, his forward passing woeful. He did well in defense when marking bully-boy Heskey. He needs to become more consistent in his performance, at the moment his poor games are beginning to out weigh the good games.

Murphy was in and out of the game. a good pass for Zamora to chest down.
Dempsey kept on being fouled, to stop him getting into the game.
Needed some more subs on, Sidwell for Etuhu and Kasami for Murphy, might have brought fresh legs for the last 20 minutes.

Early days yet, lots of time to improve.
 
Still early to start criticising and probably Jol can see more at the training as MH last year... But we should have won it. And if MJ is reading those lines we live in hope!
 
I was at the game - one of my rare forays to the Cottage, and I disagree with some of the above.

I thought Senderos looked a good partner for Hangeland. Maybe I'm not a great judge of defenders - I always feel more like I know what I'm talking about with attacking players - but I thought his distribution looked better than Hughes' and his defensive work seemed sound to me. I agree we need a proper right back, but once we get one I'd be happy for Senderos to keep his place in the centre.

I agree that Sidwell for Etuhu would improve the centre of midfield, and that the substitutions were curious. Bobby doesn't seem like himself yet, and that underlines the need to get a back-up targetman. Taking Bobby off wouldn't have seemed odd if we had had a like for like replacement to come on. Dembele was the best available option from the bench, but Dembele and AJ isn't a natural partnership.

I'm with Khadrim on the Murphy/Kasami choice (welcome to the board, by the way Khadrim, nice to have you here). I thought Murphy looked good yesterday. Someone said Kasami has played as a second striker - maybe putting him in AJ's place would be worth trying?

And, having voiced doubts about the signing of Riise the Elder, let me say once and for all that I'm a fool and I don't know what I'm talking about. I'm now convinced - he's the left back we've been waiting for.

So, sign a new right back and a back-up targetman; give Kasami a run out alongside Bobby on Thursday. If he doesn't look like the long-sought after second striker, we need to go out and get one of them too. Add those three players to the squad we've got, and we're set fair for another cracking season.
 
Adding to what I said earlier I have to say the substitution policy was weird. If you're allowed to make 3 substitutions and with 20 minutes to go you don't look like scoring against an opponent whose not threatening much either then surely most managers would make all 3 not just 1?

I agree that, in the absense of a back up target man, Dembele for Bobby was the right move especially as it gave him some match time when he's coming back to fitness. But why leave Kasami and Sidwell on the bench when they might have made a difference?
 
Penguin, what you say about leaving Kasami and Sidwell on the bench is exactly what I was saying at the time. It didn't make sense then and it still doesn't now. I know that the Spurs fans mostly love Jol, but does anyone know what his reputation is with them regarding use of subs? Maybe it's too soon to worry about that, but...
 
That's a good point Captain - its certainly worth asking any Spurs friends and acquaintances what he did re subs when he was there.

I'm aware that I've sounded a bit negative about Jol and I don't really mean to be - I'm just disappointed that we didn't win a game which really was winnable. As others have said there are a lot of positives to be taken - the passing for instance and the skill of Riise.

On my way to the tube station after the game I heard someone behind me say in a disgruntled tone, "Mark Hughes would have won that game". Obviously we'll never know but I'm certainly not convinced that's true. I like a lot of things about Jol and I'm sure I'll like a lot more as the season progresses.
 
This game was definitely winable,but we should not expect BZ to be our
exclusive matchwinner,"we need a goal scorer,"and not week in week out
play that complete none endity alongside him.
 
Valjing, I thought AJ looked good in everything but his finishing. But finishing is what we most need from whoever partners Bobby up front. While not being as dead set against AJ as you are, I agree that he isn't the right man for the team right now.

I was thinking about the game again this morning. If Riise had put his early chance away, it would have been very different. Zamora had two excellent chances in the second half: one where he put the ball straight at Given, where a yard to either side would probably have scored and one where Murphy put him through, he cut inside the left-back and Given did very well to come out and smother the shot. If any two of those three chances goes in, we're all buzzing about what a brilliant performance it was. We're dealing in very fine margins here. It wasn't a great performance, but we're so close to being right where we want to be.

Penguin, as for 'Hughes would have won that game', I would bet pounds to pence that the people you overheard were among those who chanted for Hughes to be sacked before Christmas last year. For some people, the glass is always half empty.
 
I think we are not giving Villa enough credit. Defensively I thought they were very good. The back 4 - Dunne and Collins were very solid. Their MF was also very workmanlike as well. Up front they lacked and we were never tested. I do feel they were there for the taking. Clearly coming for a point, their manager knowing he could not lose. Well played he got it.

RB - not for Hughes. He does not have the pace nor skill to beat the man and cross the ball well.
LB - Riise look very good. Always over the halfway line whereas Carlos Salcido would normally get a nosebleed. Good in the air as well and can tackle.
CB - Senderos while looking solid (not really tested) gave away too many fouls. He does like to tackle from behind and normally clearing the player out. Its a dangerous game to play.
CM - Etuhu do me a favour. How many time are we going to come out from the back, pass to Etuhu who gives the ball right back to them - normally under pressure because strikers read his game. He lacks confidence and rarely calls for the ball. Sidwell is needed to provide the passing and goal threat. At least he gets into the box. If we want to play 1 up front and 5 across the MF play Etuhu to break up the play and spoil, I've said it before play him away not at home.
Up front - we've lacked goals from the CF for a few years now. A goal scoring CF is required. Not easy to get I appreciate but AJ at this level is NOT the answer. I'd use him as an impact sub, 20 mins to go not from the off.
 
I was at the match on Saturday, and don't have much to add to what others have written. Agree with cottagecravens that we need to give Villa a bit more credit for a solid defensive display. This was the 3rd draw in a row between two sides who finished one point and one place apart last season, and I thought there wasn't much between them. Also, we hardly ever seem to win our first game of the season so I wasn't too surprised by the result. The performance wasn't awful, but wasn't great either, although we were much better in the second half.

Bearing in mind that Roy Hodgson once said after a match that 'players who don't play always seem to have a good game', I'm still a bit puzzled by a couple of Big Martin's selections. I can never see the point of playing players out of position when there are other options available. Hughes is not a RB so why play him there when we had two of them on the bench? Baird has his limitations, but can at least make a contribution to the attack and puts the odd decent ball into the six yard box. We finished last season strongly with Sidwell/Murphy at CM, so I don't understand why we're reverting to Etuhu for all the reasons other people have given. One of Jol's post match comments was that we weren't keeping possession well enough in the Villa half, so switching Sidwell for Etuhu seems like a no-brainer to me. Murphy played a few loose passes as well, but it's far too early to replace him with Kasami.

Up front - from where I was sitting it looked like when Dembele came on Dempsey moved up alongside AJ with Moussa on the right and Duff going over to the left. It will be interesting to see where Jol sees Dembele's best position when he's fully fit. Bobby looked inhibited - either due to his injury or because he still isn't 100% match fit. AJ was his usual self - lots of running but poor finishing when he got in good positions. Anyway, too early to come to any conclusions about the sort of season ahead. We'll get better, and on Saturday's evidence Villa will have a decent season. McLeish looks to have got them better organised defensively and they have the one thing we badly need - a striker who can score 20 goals a season.
 
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