Ruby or Fehily

[Baracouda]

Hi guys.

I dont post on here too often but thought that I will put this discussion that me and my mate was having yesterday.

It looks like W Mullins may not have a runner in the Gold Cup with Ruby Ball ruled out although they still have Boston Bob in the race what would be the chances of Ruby riding Silviniaco Conti in the race.

Me and my mate agree that it would be stupid not to consider this after watching another masterclasss from him yesterday and we all no that nicholls has no loyalty where it comes to jockeys ruby apart. If I was fehily I would be seriously looking over my shoulder at the thought of this happening.

What would you do? have the best jockey riding sat in the weighing room or give him the leg up on your number one hope.

Thoughts

 

[NassauBoard]

Retain Fehily, he did nothing wrong on him in the King George, and Ruby made his choice by going to ride full time in Ireland. I can see why you would consider it, but Ruby made his choice.

Now, I can see Ruby getting a ride in the race, but on whom?

 

[Sir Barney Chuckles]

In the past 2 years Noel Fehily has won a ‘Champion Hurdle’ and a ‘King George VI’ for Mr Nicholls from limited opportunities. Give him the ammunition and you can guarantee the old boy will hit the target. Personally, I can see absolutely no reason to jock him off Silviniaco Conti.

Re NH saddle monkeys I’ve always been of the opinion that providing you have one of the ‘top 50’ riding your horse which one it is doesn’t matter one jot.

 

[Baracouda]

In the past 2 years Noel Fehily has won a ‘Champion Hurdle’ and a ‘King George VI’ for Mr Nicholls from limited opportunities. Give him the ammunition and you can guarantee the old boy will hit the target. Personally, I can see absolutely no reason to jock him off Silviniaco Conti.

Re NH saddle monkeys I’ve always been of the opinion that providing you have one of the ‘top 50’ riding your horse which one it is doesn’t matter one jot.

Sorry Barney but I have to disagree with that statement.

 

[SaveTheHumans]

Possibly one of the worst comments i've ever read on here regarding your last paragraph Barney.

 

[stick]

FEHILY rides and Nicholls is delighted to have him. There will be no jocking off. Barring injury Fehily will be on board and the horse could not be in better hands. EOS.

 

[beeforsalmon]

Its certainly a legitimate question and is very much one up in the air should R Walsh be available as looks likely. One thing we know about Paul Nicholls is he is extremely ruthless with his jockeys and wouldn't be afraid to jock one off to put Ruby up. We all know how highly he thinks of Ruby, as good as Fehily is, R Walsh is the greatest jockey riding today (and many would argue ever).

I personally think it would be very harsh to kick Fehily off SC, as he's done nothing wrong, but realistically Nicholls would have Ruby on aboard all of his horses if he could. I don't for one second think he'd spare Fehily the same treatment he's served his other jocks down the years. Will be an interesting side story to the Gold Cup!

 

[SaveTheHumans]

Ruby is clearly the best jockey but Fehily had no problems on SC last time and he should remain on board in my view. Similarly will Bryan Cooper now ride Last Instalment or First Lieutenant in the GC?

 

[beeforsalmon]

An interesting aside to all this jockey chat which SaveTheHumans has touched upon is there are a lot of fancied horses with inexperienced jocks on such as Bryan Cooper, Danny Mullins and good old STD. I personally think Danny Mullins lessens the chances of Our Conor, The Tullow Tank and Mossey Joe considerably. I also think Bryan Cooper hasn't shown yet that he's any better than Davy Russell either. STD seems to suffer on the big occasion and has got TNO beaten on more than one occasion.

One added edge Mullins horses have is the assistance of a certain R Walsh in the saddle and it's unquantifiable how many 'lengths' that's worth. Stick Walsh up against the 3 young jockeys I've highlighted on similarly talented horses and the outcome is pretty certain. I think a few races at this years Festival could be decided by good / poor decisions by these so called saddle monkeys!

 

[TopClass]

An interesting aside to all this jockey chat which SaveTheHumans has touched upon is there are a lot of fancied horses with inexperienced jocks on such as Bryan Cooper, Danny Mullins and good old STD. I personally think Danny Mullins lessens the chances of Our Conor, The Tullow Tank and Mossey Joe considerably. I also think Bryan Cooper hasn't shown yet that he's any better than Davy Russell either. STD seems to suffer on the big occasion and has got TNO beaten on more than one occasion.

One added edge Mullins horses have is the assistance of a certain R Walsh in the saddle and it's unquantifiable how many 'lengths' that's worth. Stick Walsh up against the 3 young jockeys I've highlighted on similarly talented horses and the outcome is pretty certain. I think a few races at this years Festival could be decided by good / poor decisions by these so called saddle monkeys!

With you on that Beefy, it has crossed my mind a few times

I'd be imploring the owner to get Brian Cooper on Our Conor. I actually think Cooper is a seriously talented young jockey and will prove that with time and experience. Sam Twiston-Davies isn't my favourite jockey at all but I do trust him on The New One who he knows well. The key to his chances in the Champion Hurdle is to not get too close to his pacemaker- all he needs to do is hold his challenge until late and then press the button with the turn of foot. If he gets in front turning for home I'd have doubts about him holding off a late challenger.

Surely someone could get Ruby on a Gold Cup horse? I'm assumung that Annie Power goes World Hurdle- why else would Ruby not be back to ride Big Bucks, especially as he and Nicholls never fell out.

 

[OddDog]

Most horses capable of running in the Cheltenham Gold Cup will have their regular pilots and I can actually see Ruby sitting out the big one this year. If Nicholls puts Ruby on SC instead of Noel Fehily then he is an absolute ****er. Fehily rode a superb race on him to win the King George and don't forget Ruby fell off SC at the 3rd last in the 2013 renewal of the CGC.

Just looking at the betting tonight, the top horses already have their jockeys sorted:

Bobs Worth - Geraghty
SC - Fehily
Cue Card - Tizzard
Last Instalment / First Lieutenant - O'Connell / Cooper or vice versa
Harry Topper - Maguire
Al Ferof - Jacob

You're then down into the no-hopers and you'd struggle to see Ruby getting on one of those.

 

[SaveTheHumans]

Ruby for Al Ferof?

 

[Istabraq]

Ruby is the best horseman since Dunwoody...

Noel Fehily as been one of the most underrated jockeys to ever sit on an horse, Given the ammo he rarely doesn't hit the target!

Both top jockeys and in an ideal world I think Nicholls would love to jock his old stable jock back up, But I think he'd make a point of keeping Ruby in the weighing room after snubbing his stable from this season onwards, We all know if Master Minded, Kauto, Denman, Big Bucks were all still going Ruby wouldn't be full time in Ireland now and as much as they both want to butter it we all know that.

Back to the point...

Fehily rides
Ruby sits in the weighing room through the Gold Cup and its sacrilege to even say that!

 

[Ron]

Fehily is the jockey I wanted to ride Kauto Star when Ruby was injured. Very good jockey and I'd be very surprised if he were to be jocked off. I'd be more worried about the distance. Bearing in mind he didn't get past the 3rd last at Cheltenham, he hasn't ever raced beyond 25f. He has never raced on going softer than soft and on his only attempt on soft beyond 24f (barring the GC) he was beaten by Cue Card and Dynaste. Interestingly he reversed those placings, on the same terms, on better ground on an easier track.

 

[DanishPastry]

Fehily is the jockey I wanted to ride Kauto Star when Ruby was injured. Very good jockey and I'd be very surprised if he were to be jocked off. I'd be more worried about the distance. Bearing in mind he didn't get past the 3rd last at Cheltenham, he hasn't ever raced beyond 25f. He has never raced on going softer than soft and on his only attempt on soft beyond 24f (barring the GC) he was beaten by Cue Card and Dynaste. Interestingly he reversed those placings, on the same terms, on better ground on an easier track.

I think this is a very valid point Ron. I was dying for Silviniaco Conti to have a go at the King George last season, never mind this season. This is a horse who was 10/1 for a Champion Hurdle at one point - and then he runs in a couple of novice chases and suddenly PFN was saying he looks more like a Gold Cup horse than a King George horse. I've got no reason in particular to think that he won't stay the Gold Cup trip, but at the same time I haven't seen much to change my mind that 3m at Kempton is pretty much perfect for him.

 

[DanishPastry]

And regarding the actual topic of this thread (!)...

I think that the Gold Cup is such a high quality race that the jockeys will probably make little difference - all the horses in contention are so good that all of the top jockeys will I'm sure do a fine job. The only one I wonder about is wether Tizzard is really the best thing for Cue Card.

I would be more than happy with Ruby or Fehily. I'm a big fan of both and would be more than happy to have either riding my horse. I wouldn't be too surprised if Ruby ended up riding one of the 'no-hopers' though - he's free and even on a no-hoper, who wants to sit out the Gold Cup!?


...on the other hand... Tidal Bay to be re-routed and Ruby on board?

 

[NassauBoard]

Perhaps he could get the leg up on Long Run.

 

[Sir Barney Chuckles]

Perhaps he could get the leg up on Long Run.

Old boy hang your head in shame. Outrageous remark. There’s only one jockey for Long Run and that’s the forum’s favourite Corinthian, the younger Mr Waley-Cohen.

Not that Long Run will be going anywhere neat the CGC or Cheltenham this term. He’s got an engagement at Aintree, in early April, don’t you know!

 

[NassauBoard]

Old boy hang your head in shame. Outrageous remark. There’s only one jockey for Long Run and that’s the forum’s favourite Corinthian, the younger Mr Waley-Cohen.

Not that Long Run will be going anywhere neat the CGC or Cheltenham this term. He’s got an engagement at Aintree, in early April, don’t you know!

The best warm up to the Grand National hurdle race is the Gold Cup. I am really surprised they are going to Kelso rather than wait for the better ground and prep him in the Gold Cup, a race he can still run well in. We have seen Aintree horses do this (Hedgehunter, Mon Mome) and I would rather they did that than run in a egg and spoon race at Kelso (saying that, who remembers Binocular's trips northwards!)

 

[Sir Barney Chuckles]

The best warm up to the Grand National hurdle race is the Gold Cup. I am really surprised they are going to Kelso rather than wait for the better ground and prep him in the Gold Cup, a race he can still run well in. We have seen Aintree horses do this (Hedgehunter, Mon Mome) and I would rather they did that than run in a egg and spoon race at Kelso (saying that, who remembers Binocular's trips northwards!)

I think you mean Zaynar, as opposed to Binocular, but let’s not dwell on that!

Personally, I think Kelso, or Kempton Park a week on Saturday, is the perfect ‘prep’ for Long Run. Get a run into him to blow away the cobwebs and then let him be prepared for 6 weeks, at home, by Mr Henderson who will slowly bring him to 100% capacity for the 10 minutes that count in early April. His ‘magic hands’ will perform miracles and deliver Long Run to Aintree in A1 shape. In contrast I think a run at Cheltenham could potentially ‘bottom’ him and leave the old boy in no condition to do his best at Aintree. His next run needs to be no more than a ‘prep’. Nothing else.