Off Topic Politics Thread
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Everyone has failed the people of Palestine. Their leaders, their Arabs neighbours, Israel, the UN, the international community. They've been abandoned by the world.
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I just wish the media would report these blatant lies, if this was anyone but Reform it would have 24/7 coverage.
Thumwood's post is yet more Hamas propaganda from our resident antisemite.
As Libby said there isn't a country in the world who wouldn't respond in the way Israel have. The 7th October has got to be one of the most barbaric events in modern history. Somehow, that is put to one side by people with an anti Jewish agenda. If it is mentioned, it's always accompanied with a caveat of something like "but the Israeli's are no better" as some sort of justification for the inhuman behaviour. Hamas started this war and Israel have every right to hunt them down in Gaza, the shame is they haven't been able to finish the job.
Mealy mouthed organisations like the UN and Amnesty International have freely banded the genocide accusations around even when it didn't fit the set down criteria of a genocide. The BBC had to apologise for mis information they had repeated from the Palestinian Ministry of Health, a mouthpiece for Hamas. The BBC although usually not untruthful, have leaned heavily on anti Israeli news reports during this war. Hamas have exploited anti Jewish sentiment entrenched in certain groups and organisations very well, so much so that the victim has now become the perpetrator. You can only do that though, if those groups are only too happy to believe anti Jewish propaganda in the first place.
There are some groups in this country that actively celebrated or excused the stabbing of jews here and the 2 yr anniversary of 7th October. Some have also stated they will continue the "peace" marches even if a ceasefire is achieved. These people have not only, never been concerned for the innocent Gazans, but are calling out Hamas propaganda for them. They and their supporters are quite clearly anti Semites and I detest them with a vengeance.
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Do you also detest the killing of innocent Gazans? What death toll is ok for you? Do you take pleasure in videos - shot and shared by Israelis - of snipers targetting children and laughing? Of burying ambulances to hide their murder? The killing of hostages with white flags raised, calling out who they were in Hebrew?
I think anyone who picks a side and justifies death on the other is just as detestable.
ETA: I don’t remember the UK flattening Ireland during the troubles.
I give up with IOAG.
67 thousand civilians have been killed by the Israelis. I doubt if a fraction of those killed were pro Hamas. The response was totally disproportionate and was in no way justified. It was just a convenient excuse to carry out ethnic cleansing.
The West should have urged restraint and not added fuel to the fire by suppling Israel.
Theoretical country I admire for trying to find a peaceful solution is Qatar. They got attacked by Israel for the privilege.
This is the only place I have seen unequivocable support for Israel albeit from one individual. Even my Right leaning friends have condemned the action of Israel. Not quite sure what kind of person thinks killed 67 k civilians and leaving an entire population as homeless as being acceptable . There can be no excuse for the carnage unleashed by Israel. As bad as Putin and Hitler. It is a 19th century response to a 21st century problem.
IOAG should hang his head in shame.
67 thousand civilians have been killed by the Israelis. I doubt if a fraction of those killed were pro Hamas. The response was totally disproportionate and was in no way justified. It was just a convenient excuse to carry out ethnic cleansing.
The West should have urged restraint and not added fuel to the fire by suppling Israel.
Theoretical country I admire for trying to find a peaceful solution is Qatar. They got attacked by Israel for the privilege.
This is the only place I have seen unequivocable support for Israel albeit from one individual. Even my Right leaning friends have condemned the action of Israel. Not quite sure what kind of person thinks killed 67 k civilians and leaving an entire population as homeless as being acceptable . There can be no excuse for the carnage unleashed by Israel. As bad as Putin and Hitler. It is a 19th century response to a 21st century problem.
IOAG should hang his head in shame.
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I agree with overall sentiment, but I don't think the coverage has been equally balanced. Western media has had interference from other agencies (particularly Qatar) drumming up anti-Jewish feeling letting people think it's OK to hate on the Jews because Israel and Jews are the same.
Tbh I'm ****ing sick of the hassle my kids get because they go to a Jewish school and have a crest on their jumper which makes them targets for hate (fwiw the school takes kids from all faiths and has Muslim children happily attending).
At the start of the war we had police outside the school and since the attack in Manchester last week we've had the same. No other school in the UK has to have the same. The security office by the gates even has a mirror to check under cars for bombs.
I'm not Jewish, my wife and my kids are and everywhere we go she is reminding them not to let people know they are Jewish. She is sick of hiding who she is because of the intolerance and ignorance proliferating the West. This unfortunate irony was not lost on me as we visited Anne Frank's house earlier in the year and her taking pains to remind the kids not to mention they were Jewish or had family in Israel.
As I said, anyone justifying murder on either side is deplorable. I think Israel says it is a multicultural democracy, so criticism of such should not be antisemitic. Antisemites exist and undoubtedly are stoked up by anti-Israeli sentiment, but that doesn’t make the vast majority of us antisemitic. I don’t know anyone who doesn’t wish the violence in that region was over.
And to take us back, I said two years ago that Israel’s reaction would have a profound impact on how the country was seen by the world, and that Hamas actively wanted them to destroy Palestine. The fact Israel did it is not a win for Israel.
Undoubtedly Israel has also tried to control the narrative. Banning foreign media. Being caught in lies about what has happened. Hiding evidence of mistakes. And on the other hand the Islamic propaganda machine working against them.
What has no ‘sides’ is caring about the death of innocents. And that is what 99% of Brits are invested in.
I really think that Israel's reaction to the Hamas attack has altered any sympathy they had. The narrative would be totally different if they had purely responded against Hamas.
The fact they they didn't do this has exacerbated the problem from regional issue to a global one so that we now have attacks on synagogues in UK and an increase in anti Muslim hate crime. Israel's response has brought these problems to our shores.
I think the UK has Jewish population of 300,000 people. It is a fraction of the size of the British Muslim population which is four million. I resent the fact that Israel has provoked issues of civil liberties, the right to protest and the criminalisation of protest groups to the UK. We would not be having weekly protests nor antagonism between supporters of both sides had Israel taken a different and difficult step. Israel has effectively passed it's problem in to the West where there is effectively religious and cultural tolerance in our liberal society.
In no account can Israel be defended and I also feel that many Jewish people have been silent on this matter so that it gives the false impression of tacit consent. I would have hoped more Jewish Brits were out on the streets protesting too.
British people do not want to be dragged into this argument, especially when Hamas is so odious. Just feel that without American support, Israel would be very lonely on the international stage.
The fact they they didn't do this has exacerbated the problem from regional issue to a global one so that we now have attacks on synagogues in UK and an increase in anti Muslim hate crime. Israel's response has brought these problems to our shores.
I think the UK has Jewish population of 300,000 people. It is a fraction of the size of the British Muslim population which is four million. I resent the fact that Israel has provoked issues of civil liberties, the right to protest and the criminalisation of protest groups to the UK. We would not be having weekly protests nor antagonism between supporters of both sides had Israel taken a different and difficult step. Israel has effectively passed it's problem in to the West where there is effectively religious and cultural tolerance in our liberal society.
In no account can Israel be defended and I also feel that many Jewish people have been silent on this matter so that it gives the false impression of tacit consent. I would have hoped more Jewish Brits were out on the streets protesting too.
British people do not want to be dragged into this argument, especially when Hamas is so odious. Just feel that without American support, Israel would be very lonely on the international stage.
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Who armed Hamas and facilitated their takeover from the legitimate Palestine Authority in Gaza? Benjamin Netanyahu, that’s who. Don’t lecture us on who is responsible for the mess we are in right now. Most sane Jewish people despise BOTH Hamas and the Netanyahu government.
Netanyahu would have been jailed a few years ago if he wasn’t in power I think .
I don’t think he will ever face jail , as Trump will let him live in the US if things get that desperate for him .
That’s not true, Hamas was elected in 2006 by the Palestinian people and it was the US/EU and Israel who tried to help the PA gain back control in Gaza via a failed civil war in 2007, because Hamas failed to recognise Israel as a legitimate state, whilst the PA were more willing to proceed with a two state solution.
Pretty sure I read that it was Israel ( Netanyahu) that armed Hamas , in the hope they would cause damage in Palestine , then Israel could wipe them out .
Read all abaht it.
"PRIVATE Eye has identified the true owner of 11 derelict mansions in north London's upmarket Bishops Avenue, widely seen as an emblem of a malfunctioning property market that values investment over use.
A detailed search of multiple corporate registers indicates that one of Iran's richest men is the ultimate owner of what has been dubbed the "billionaire's wasteland".
The 11 mansions are owned by Isle of Man company Birch Ventures Ltd, which bought them in 2013 for £73m. The huge houses and extensive plots are empty and falling into ruin, some hit by fires, floods and animal occupation.
Banker's branches
Since 2018, one Ali Ansari has been listed as the ultimate beneficiary of Birch Ventures.Previous press reports have described the owner as a "Cypriot businessman", but by searching multiple international registers, using a date of birth, common business connections and other data, Private Eye can confirm he is in fact the Iranian banker and entrepreneur."
"PRIVATE Eye has identified the true owner of 11 derelict mansions in north London's upmarket Bishops Avenue, widely seen as an emblem of a malfunctioning property market that values investment over use.
A detailed search of multiple corporate registers indicates that one of Iran's richest men is the ultimate owner of what has been dubbed the "billionaire's wasteland".
The 11 mansions are owned by Isle of Man company Birch Ventures Ltd, which bought them in 2013 for £73m. The huge houses and extensive plots are empty and falling into ruin, some hit by fires, floods and animal occupation.
Banker's branches
Since 2018, one Ali Ansari has been listed as the ultimate beneficiary of Birch Ventures.Previous press reports have described the owner as a "Cypriot businessman", but by searching multiple international registers, using a date of birth, common business connections and other data, Private Eye can confirm he is in fact the Iranian banker and entrepreneur."
That’s an opinion piece
Netanyahu or Israel had no influence on Hamas taking control of Gaza and as I stated previously were behind high profile attempts to overthrow the regime along with many other international powers including Egypt and this also led to the blockade of Gaza border crossing from both nations
The money entering from Qatar started a full decade into their tenure and was two fold.
To steer Hamas from the influence of Iran and to the more diplomatic Qatari Government and to prevent a humanitarian crisis in Gaza
I understand the criticisms of these policies by Israel’s and the hindsight of the attack, but to suggest Netanyahu armed Hamas and he kept them in power is wholly inaccurate