Yeah but what are your politics? Are you a lefty pisser or a righty pisser?
Off Topic Politics Thread
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Yeah but what are your politics? Are you a lefty pisser or a righty pisser?
Nobody said or implied, they are no better; if you're marching along with Robinson at the helm, one of the 110K in Trafalgar Square, you're an extra on the viral clips dramatically signal boosting the guy and his specific cause, you are giving Musk a semi, Bannon some vague stirrings, you are part of the largest nationalist protest in decades.
The political concept and visual purpose of a march is fundamentally about solidarity. There's a difference between a broad coalition, where you might disagree with some participants' other views, versus marching directly under someone's banner and cause. Hardly "funny," you're creating false equivalencies.
As I said "None of us like uncontrolled immigration, an ineffective and failing asylum system, massive processing backlogs, asylum seekers visibly packed into former hotels in our town centres"
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Another Facebook post. Yes of course it’s unverified.
‘I was the anaesthetic consultant on call at St Thomas’ Hospital yesterday. It is on the south side of the bridge that these racists marched over for 5 hours; right under the windows of the hospital chanting their hateful, vitriolic, violent slogans.
It was not lost on me that in our emergency handover meeting of around 15 people at 8am, I was one of only two white British members of staff. The NHS would collapse without the remarkable work that colleagues who are immigrants and the children of immigrants do.
This “protest” was not peaceful as we know. Many broke through what were pretty puny barriers to get into the hospital grounds. Security (all non-white and being incredibly measured) had to fend them off at the main entrance. No police. No other help. Lots of very scared non-British workers inside the building. Lots of the staff on duty with me were really scared about getting home safely. Many booked rooms in the nurses’ accommodation overnight because they didn’t dare leave. I drove several to nearby stations to avoid what was by 5pm an intimidating, abusive, drunken rabble.
Our chief exec sent a weak email on Thursday saying, effectively, everyone is valued in our hospital. She was nowhere to be seen on Saturday.
Colleagues and I are going to write to her to say that the Trust’s response before and on the day was wholly inadequate but I also think NHS leaders and the government need to denounce the overtly racist elements of the march (i.e. most of it) and publicly support non-British NHS workers. They must stop equivocating for fear of offending a group of the electorate that they foolishly think might vote for them, and take a damn stand. They are leaving a vacuum for the radical right; either fight or step aside and let someone else try to save the soul of the country.
I was shocked to see lots of families with their teens proudly marching. People need to get involved and counter this appalling rhetoric. It’s completely disgusting. We need to try to understand why they believe the far right’s lies, counter those lies and offer a genuine alternative for ordinary people otherwise we will be in the US’s shoes with Farage at the helm. I will do whatever I can to help in this cause but it is urgent. Labour are not doing anything effective. Those groups/parties planning to provide an alternative need to get their A’s into G and start campaigning loudly. Farage spent the summer holding weekly press conferences while the government went on holiday.
I felt embarrassed to call myself British in front of my incredibly brave but distressed colleagues yesterday. I’d welcome everyone’s view about the most useful steps that I and others who are equally appalled by yesterday and the rise of the far right here can most usefully do to fight back.
Wishing everyone a peaceful evening."
‘I was the anaesthetic consultant on call at St Thomas’ Hospital yesterday. It is on the south side of the bridge that these racists marched over for 5 hours; right under the windows of the hospital chanting their hateful, vitriolic, violent slogans.
It was not lost on me that in our emergency handover meeting of around 15 people at 8am, I was one of only two white British members of staff. The NHS would collapse without the remarkable work that colleagues who are immigrants and the children of immigrants do.
This “protest” was not peaceful as we know. Many broke through what were pretty puny barriers to get into the hospital grounds. Security (all non-white and being incredibly measured) had to fend them off at the main entrance. No police. No other help. Lots of very scared non-British workers inside the building. Lots of the staff on duty with me were really scared about getting home safely. Many booked rooms in the nurses’ accommodation overnight because they didn’t dare leave. I drove several to nearby stations to avoid what was by 5pm an intimidating, abusive, drunken rabble.
Our chief exec sent a weak email on Thursday saying, effectively, everyone is valued in our hospital. She was nowhere to be seen on Saturday.
Colleagues and I are going to write to her to say that the Trust’s response before and on the day was wholly inadequate but I also think NHS leaders and the government need to denounce the overtly racist elements of the march (i.e. most of it) and publicly support non-British NHS workers. They must stop equivocating for fear of offending a group of the electorate that they foolishly think might vote for them, and take a damn stand. They are leaving a vacuum for the radical right; either fight or step aside and let someone else try to save the soul of the country.
I was shocked to see lots of families with their teens proudly marching. People need to get involved and counter this appalling rhetoric. It’s completely disgusting. We need to try to understand why they believe the far right’s lies, counter those lies and offer a genuine alternative for ordinary people otherwise we will be in the US’s shoes with Farage at the helm. I will do whatever I can to help in this cause but it is urgent. Labour are not doing anything effective. Those groups/parties planning to provide an alternative need to get their A’s into G and start campaigning loudly. Farage spent the summer holding weekly press conferences while the government went on holiday.
I felt embarrassed to call myself British in front of my incredibly brave but distressed colleagues yesterday. I’d welcome everyone’s view about the most useful steps that I and others who are equally appalled by yesterday and the rise of the far right here can most usefully do to fight back.
Wishing everyone a peaceful evening."
He should resign . If you know anything about her you will know that is is the most popular constituent MP in the country and at the forefront of British political thought. She is a visionary.
Radio 3 summizing that today's defection is noteworthy as it was in a different day to the opening of the Conservative conference and that a higher profile might defection may be likely on the eve of this.
Our mate Farage, who invited lovely Lucy onto stage and said she was a victim of people not liking hurty words, has expressed his anger that people who have said they want him dead are not facing prosecution. You can’t make this level of hypocrisy up!
Hopefully he will kill himself with f ags and booze and save someone else the bother. I would still dislike him if he was on the Left. Sadly , I do think someone with an unstable mind will be tempted to have a go. I cannot see how you can spout such hate and not provoke a reciprocal reaction. Regardless of the lack of genuine political nous , hatred should not be the basis of policy for a political party.
Ian Thurmwood been taking the comedy pills again. Couple of absolute crackers there. lol:
Come closer
and there's more
Its the way you tell 'em
Come closer
In her constituency? maybe. in the country? Nope. Visionary?? speechless
and there's more
I think someone has been asleep the last 10 years of absolute free for all in opposition!
Its the way you tell 'em
I agree on growth but the point of me using growth is that is the buzzword that politicians and the technocrats always talk about! Not growth per capita. Not nuanced. Purely growth........and they don't care where it comes from.......hence in the boom time house prices zooming up was a nice little cherry for their growth statements and also saved the day in the alleged "austerity" period.
On the green argument, while I support green policy per se, I do not agree with the way policies are used. you'll not convince me of the cheapness of green energy as it is when everybody's bills are so high and any talk of "international prices" convinces no-one either when we are paying sooo much more than every other country! If green is so cheap then why does it need subsidy? Why do they need to whack penalties on non green? Why can it not compete with non green on a playing field if it is cheaper?
Did you read this before you typed it? Driving costs down for who?
On the flip I notice that my complaint/suggestion of the past 10 years of the government wasting money on the decent homes initiative, where they handed money over to the usual suspects who instead of improving what needs improving would just replace the roofs on a whole council street whether needed or not........they are finally putting solar panels on council houses which kills 2 birds with one stone.........makes the tenants bills cheaper and also surplus makes money for the council going back into the grid. Why did it take so long? I never needed a new roof........or a new bathroom but along they came! They seem to be doing the houses with adaptations first which is also good thinking as the elderly and disabled are the ones that need it first.
On your part about profits. I also agree however see above. state money has been fed straight into the hands of the rich to squander on their own vanity projects. This government has setup more quangos than they have reduced. The whole system from the IMF right down to a pen pusher in the civil service works on the buzzword of "growth" and while you focus on profits in a private sense, the public sense is lost down that rabbit hole. Governments of both sides have been focused on making sure profits are maxed, money goes to their mates new setup or their favourite quango to spend on their vanity projects. All the talk of cheaper energy is just that.......talk. prices go up and up and up and governments just keep slapping more penalties on it!
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I could agree with your description entirely. Very different to the previous descriptionI would say more ground breaking and pioneering
Correct, that's what "the most popular constituent MP in the country" means, the MP who is most popular among their own constituents. It's different from being the most nationally popular MP overall. Abbot has been the Hackney North and Stoke Newington MP for 38 years
I could agree with your description entirely. Very different to the previous description
haha, indeed it is.
Well we read/interpret that statement differentlyCorrect, that's what "the most popular constituent MP in the country" means, the MP who is most popular among their own constituents. It's different from being the most nationally popular MP overall. Abbot has been the Hackney North and Stoke Newington MP for 38 years
Yep, you're right to call out the misstep on consumer bills, I conflated production costs with what people actually pay, getting a bit carried away there! Clean energy production costs have plummeted, but you're right that consumers haven't seen those savings because utilities, middlemen, and government taxes snaffle up the benefits. The technology works brilliantly, but the system guarantees profits flow upward rather than bills coming down. Your council housing solar help actually proves this; when implemented properly, it does reduce tenant bills while generating
revenue, showing the potential is there if we cut out the usual suspects who've been enriching themselves with unnecessary roof replacements.
Otherwise this is reinforcing the core argument. You're describing exactly the "more crap more profits" system - where the focus on "growth" justifies endless spending on consultants, quangos and vanity projects instead of solutions that actually work. Replacing perfectly good roofs and bathrooms is textbook planned obsolescence... just transmogrified to public spending. The fact that solar panels finally got installed and work exactly as intended - lowering costs, generating revenue, helping folk who need it most - demonstrates that effective solutions do exist but, get delayed because they're not profitable enough for the middlemen who've captured the system. Your frustration with rising energy prices - despite cheaper technology - is exactly evidence that the current profit-maximizing system prevents good solutions from reaching us.
"Why can it not compete with non green on a playing field if it is cheaper?"
Clean energy often can't compete on a "level playing field" because the playing field was never level to begin with - it's been tilted by decades of fossil fuel subsidies. They got there first! The fossil fuel industry has itself received massive government subsidies for over a 100 years to build refineries, pipelines, and power plants. Created established lobbying networks and sneakily more lately "regulatory capture". eg; former oil executives running environmental agencies. A new restaurant can't compete with McDonald's when McDonald's has prime real estate, established supply chains, and decades of built-up advantages.
Yet in many places where renewables do compete on genuinely level terms, they're winning decisively; wind and solar are now the cheapest electricity sources in most of the world, when you strip away the subsidies and market rigging.
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Truly remarkable.
My point was that the council should have been putting solar panels up 10 years ago instead of just handing the money over to Kier Group or whoever their chosen made up company was to do no checking and squaff the money on another made up company contract to re-roof houses that did not need re roofing or replace bathrooms that were already "up to standard!"
We agree entirely on where the "money is going" part. The profits are going to the chosen made up companies, crony setups and up the tree while Joe Public pays for it...........just as tax credits was used to bridge the gap employers should have been (and had been) paying when NMW replaced market rate!
Government doesn't snaffle up the benefit. We might not be where we are if governments got the benefit over the past 30 years. That money comes in and straight out and upward!
However I think you end up thinking "at least they got there in the end" in your second paragraph r.e. the solar panels! I daresay there are new uber profitable contracts that have been signed for the same old same old fleecing of the tax purse in the installation (and maintenance) of this new found enlightenment, which you also allude to. It would not surprise me in the least if you or I could get a quote for a single installation that matches or betters what it turns out the government (or the quango in charge) has agreed to pay per installation despite the government / quangos obvious purchasing power..........which should be coming in with a quote way way cheaper than your or I could get for a single installation! I will see if I can spot a company name on the workmen's vans next time I see them. IT would not surprise me at all if it was Kier again but I also suspect that Kier is nowadays subbing out quite a bit of its uber portfolio of state work to non entity cowboys and just creaming the profits off the top for little effort.
My gripe has never been "climate change denial" but in this modern world any dissent means "Denier....burn him." My criticism..........on most things......both Labour-Tory-Labour has been the policies!. And most of the policies designed around the green issue, like others, is about fleecing the tax purse to move the money upwards! I think we could all get on with green policy if it weren't for the fact that a lot of these subsidies are just making a few people very very rich and we're the ones paying for it as usual!
She wasn't always though. She was very good back in the day and there on merit and a shining example to the black community (and other ethnicities) that they could make it into the higher tiers of politics, however in recent times (probably 10 years or more now) she sided with the identity politics stuff and started race baiting a lot.
That shouldn't take away from what she achieved in her earlier half? of her political career though.
And unfortunately that is a problem that we could pin on quite a few politicians, even white ones, that seem to have forgotten the target was equality and instead turned towards demanding parity. I know it will get a backlash but that is one of the things that has created such divides today. Politicians don't like when things look like they are moving towards that kind of goal because they lose their power over a demographic and modern politics seems to have done its best to not just maintain that divide but widen it to continue to her their votes! tbh I think most of the public across the world have had enough of this, not just the white folks, and people are refusing to be told which way they should be voting because they are "X" demographic, and when they then get called "not really black" or "coconut" it just proves them right!
Even in the US there is a little bit of this fightback but the US is a strange country where left and right politicians (both as bad) think all they need to do is reel off a list of "minority" demographics as an addendum to each statement when it just comes across as an "oh...and the Latinos, African Americans, Gays Queers, Trans......etc.