Off Topic Politics Thread

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San Tejón said:
Another £14 million recently, I believe.
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Enough to build and staff a Greensaint Reception Centre* with English Language, skills training and employment placement units?

Think of all the extra taxes being paid, could maintain the welfare state a bit longer even with the increase in demand.
The only reason not to do this seems to be a reluctance to have your botton wiped by a non-uk born carer when you're 97ys old.

*trademark.
 
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San Tejón said:
Two quick points.
On Rwanda, how many of the public are aware that the UK will receive “a portion of Rwanda’s vulnerable refugees” as part of this deal.
Will the number be equal to or greater than those the government are trying to send to Rwanda, in which case what’s the point, other than politics?
Second point.
Between 2020 & 2022, the NHS in England spent £3.2 billion on agency nurses, according to figures from 182 trusts. This is equal to paying 31,000 full time nurses.
The country needs to know who is behind the agencies supplying the temporary nurses and what their links are to the Tory party. I’m quite sure I have read that the owner of the top agency for supplying doctor/consultants is strongly connected to the Tories and must be making a fair bit of money as a result of the understaffing in the NHS.
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Good points. I did know about the reciprocal agreement, This from Sky https://news.sky.com/story/what-has...th-the-new-rwanda-deportation-treaty-13023542 "Notably, the treaty also contains a provision for the UK to resettle "a portion" of Rwanda's "most vulnerable" refugees." But didn't go in to number or costs.
This from https://freemovement.org.uk/uk-rwanda-refugee-offshoring-deal-first-thoughts/
"Under paragraph 16 of the agreement, the UK has agreed to resettle a portion of Rwanda’s “most vulnerable refugees”. This raises the question of how we can be confident that Rwanda can care for vulnerable asylum seekers being sent from the UK. It reflects the surreal and inhumane two-tier system the Home Office is creating: performative cruelty for those arriving in the UK without permission, justified by some limited and restrictive routes for resettled refugees.
This is against both the spirit and the letter of the Refugee Convention. "

As for the agency and bank staff I found this from the BMJ https://www.bmj.com/content/379/bmj.o2749 and this in today's Telegraph
"Nurses received a 5 per cent pay increase this year, plus lump sums of between £1,700 and £3,700.
The deal was never accepted by the RCN but was imposed.
Last week, the RCN threatened further strikes, with the union saying nurses were “appalled” that consultants had now been offered a far more generous pay rise.
The senior doctors have been offered an increase of up to 12.8 per cent – meaning as much as £20,000 for the best paid.
The RCN said the £3.2 billion spent on agency nurses and similar workers over three years could have paid the salaries of almost 31,000 full-time nurses or trained more than 86,000 new ones.
Official figures show 43,000 nursing posts are now vacant in England – meaning one in ten jobs.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/12/06/nhs-spent-13bn-pounds-agency-nurses-strikes-last-year/
 
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StJabbo1 said:
Good points. I did know about the reciprocal agreement, This from Sky https://news.sky.com/story/what-has...th-the-new-rwanda-deportation-treaty-13023542 "Notably, the treaty also contains a provision for the UK to resettle "a portion" of Rwanda's "most vulnerable" refugees." But didn't go in to number or costs.
This from https://freemovement.org.uk/uk-rwanda-refugee-offshoring-deal-first-thoughts/
"Under paragraph 16 of the agreement, the UK has agreed to resettle a portion of Rwanda’s “most vulnerable refugees”. This raises the question of how we can be confident that Rwanda can care for vulnerable asylum seekers being sent from the UK. It reflects the surreal and inhumane two-tier system the Home Office is creating: performative cruelty for those arriving in the UK without permission, justified by some limited and restrictive routes for resettled refugees.
This is against both the spirit and the letter of the Refugee Convention. "

As for the agency and bank staff I found this from the BMJ https://www.bmj.com/content/379/bmj.o2749 and this in today's Telegraph
"Nurses received a 5 per cent pay increase this year, plus lump sums of between £1,700 and £3,700.
The deal was never accepted by the RCN but was imposed.
Last week, the RCN threatened further strikes, with the union saying nurses were “appalled” that consultants had now been offered a far more generous pay rise.
The senior doctors have been offered an increase of up to 12.8 per cent – meaning as much as £20,000 for the best paid.
The RCN said the £3.2 billion spent on agency nurses and similar workers over three years could have paid the salaries of almost 31,000 full-time nurses or trained more than 86,000 new ones.
Official figures show 43,000 nursing posts are now vacant in England – meaning one in ten jobs.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/12/06/nhs-spent-13bn-pounds-agency-nurses-strikes-last-year/
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So we send them a load of refugees, then they send us a load of refugees (presumably the ones that they don`t want under any circumstances), and we send them a load of dosh. Brilliant!
 
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St. Luigi Scrosoppi said:
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Literally in reality too, there is some suggestion they will pull out if we bypass international law because the whole point of this from their perspective (money aside), is that its meant to improve their standing globally... so they don't want to be part of something like that.

Also Sunak doesnt get questioned enough about the deal involving us taking people from Rwanda in return, which will surely go down well with the people this is meant to impress.
 
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The total bill for the Rwanda scheme has risen to £240 million, with not a single person actually being flown there, apart from various government ministers.
 
Many people dislike Femi as he is wheeled out on to many political discussion programmes and uses intelligence, facts and knowledge of the law to destroy so many of the arguments of the right wing people he is up against.
Here’s his take and destruction of Sunak’s speech about Rwanda and the change in law he is bringing in.

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San Tejón said:
Many people dislike Femi as he is wheeled out on to many political discussion programmes and uses intelligence, facts and knowledge of the law to destroy so many of the arguments of the right wing people he is up against.
Here’s his take and destruction of Sunak’s speech about Rwanda and the change in law he is bringing in.

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Can’t be dealing with intelligence , facts and knowledge of the law when what random right wing talking heads on Twitter are involved. How would we ever take them seriously ? Oh…
 
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Didn't realise that they are shafted if the Lords block it because there isn't enough time left in the Parliament to work around it.

That would mean the only way for them to pass the legislation is to get a fresh majority...
 
Shandy_top_89 said:
Didn't realise that they are shafted if the Lords block it because there isn't enough time left in the Parliament to work around it.

That would mean the only way for them to pass the legislation is to get a fresh majority...
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Surely the Lords will block it

But they probably don’t mind because they can blame them. Although given labour want to abolish it that probably isn’t a winning strategy either

Surely the worst thing would be for this to be passed? Because if there is better weather next year the boat crossings won’t fall and will probably rise. And hardly any people will actually be sent

I guess the plan is to get it just squeaked through and then call a spring election before any results / impact can be assessed ?
 
Gregm1988 said:
Can’t be dealing with intelligence , facts and knowledge of the law when what random right wing talking heads on Twitter are involved. How would we ever take them seriously ? Oh…
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I can't be arsed to look at Telegraph or Spiked, there'll be much wailing, gnashing of teeth and spittle laden expletives
 
StJabbo1 said:
Sunak and the home office getting their pips squeezed. Best part of £300m spaffed and more to pay. Number of flights 0 that's none, zilch, SFA. It's a farce, what a bunch of unelectable ****s. Apologies to useful ****s.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...r-costs-of-rwanda-deportation-plan-says-no-10
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It’s vying with Thatcher’s Poll Tax and Attlee’s Tanganyika Ground Nut Scheme for the title of worst self-inflicted act of utter imbecility by a British government.

Leaving Brexit out because Cameron didn’t want Brexit.
 
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