Off Topic Politics Thread

  • Please bear with us on the new site integration and fixing any known bugs over the coming days. If you can not log in please try resetting your password and check your spam box. If you have tried these steps and are still struggling email [email protected] with your username/registered email address
  • Log in now to remove adverts - no adverts at all to registered members!
......loading...... said:
Look, I agree 100% in principal. However, the radicalisation has already happened. Anybody who sees the slaughter of Israeli children (deliberate and premeditated) and then becomes more anti-Israel when they retaliate was already lost. The people dying now have been set up to die by Hamas. It is the gameplan. If Israel stops short of making it logistically impossible for this to be repeated, it just will be.

Iran want all this bloodshed and Iran have one huge advantage. They aren't there. They don't care. They are not impacted. Therefore it doesn't matter which hearts and minds Israel win right now. They are simply screwed.

On the other hand, they need to become overly nice and friendly after. They need to stop the brutal policing and horrendous behaviour of their own troops. They need to stop pushing into areas they shouldn't be in.

This is two religious states butting heads. Basically theocracies based on divisive ideologies. Religion and race and state have no business being in bed together.
Click to expand...
We’re in the same ballpark here but I think you are describing an endgame which is impossible and that the situation requires stepping stones with an endgame in mind, but which will take its own course

‘Getting the job done’ involves massive civilian suffering g, surely we can’t support that?

You say the radicalisation has already happened, but there are many Palestinians and Israelis who want peace and a fair solution. The more atrocities there are, the more this group can lose that view. You can’t solve this problem with war although I recognise it has to start that way and the Hamas organisation has to be ‘disabled’

But the next stage has to be diplomatic and winning hearts and minds as well as military defence of Israel

The trouble is that Netanyahu has no desire for diplomacy so, as much as Hamas needs to be disabled, Israel needs a govt that wants a peaceful solution. And the next elections aren’t until Oct 2026

This is a tough subject to discuss by this means, but hey, debate on these matters is good right?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Osvaldorama, ......loading...... and StJabbo1
shoot_spiderman said:
We’re in the same ballpark here but I think you are describing an endgame which is impossible and that the situation requires stepping stones with an endgame in mind, but which will take its own course

‘Getting the job done’ involves massive civilian suffering g, surely we can’t support that?

You say the radicalisation has already happened, but there are many Palestinians and Israelis who want peace and a fair solution. The more atrocities there are, the more this group can lose that view. You can’t solve this problem with war although I recognise it has to start that way and the Hamas organisation has to be ‘disabled’

But the next stage has to be diplomatic and winning hearts and minds as well as military defence of Israel

The trouble is that Netanyahu has no desire for diplomacy so, as much as Hamas needs to be disabled, Israel needs a govt that wants a peaceful solution. And the next elections aren’t until Oct 2026

This is a tough subject to discuss by this means, but hey, debate on these matters is good right?
Click to expand...
Of it's good to debate but recognising it will get heated at times.
 
shoot_spiderman said:
We’re in the same ballpark here but I think you are describing an endgame which is impossible and that the situation requires stepping stones with an endgame in mind, but which will take its own course

‘Getting the job done’ involves massive civilian suffering g, surely we can’t support that?

You say the radicalisation has already happened, but there are many Palestinians and Israelis who want peace and a fair solution. The more atrocities there are, the more this group can lose that view. You can’t solve this problem with war although I recognise it has to start that way and the Hamas organisation has to be ‘disabled’

But the next stage has to be diplomatic and winning hearts and minds as well as military defence of Israel

The trouble is that Netanyahu has no desire for diplomacy so, as much as Hamas needs to be disabled, Israel needs a govt that wants a peaceful solution. And the next elections aren’t until Oct 2026

This is a tough subject to discuss by this means, but hey, debate on these matters is good right?
Click to expand...
I think the issue is that we are already in an endgame phase. This is the time after failed diplomacy and antagonistic actions. This is a time of consequences. I don’t think Mohandas Gandhi could work out a peaceful route of this at this moment.

I totally agree that we should do something to protect the people. I just think it is actually harder than people think to simply pause a war for civilians without the other side using it to their own ends. Anything that prolongs the war is as bad as not having a ceasefire at all.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Osvaldorama
......loading...... said:
I think the issue is that we are already in an endgame phase. This is the time after failed diplomacy and antagonistic actions. This is a time of consequences. I don’t think Mohandas Gandhi could work out a peaceful route of this at this moment.

I totally agree that we should do something to protect the people. I just think it is actually harder than people think to simply pause a war for civilians without the other side using it to their own ends. Anything that prolongs the war is as bad as not having a ceasefire at all.
Click to expand...

The Israel Defense Force has stated that over 50,000 Palestinians have been Evacuated from Northern to Southern Gaza over the last 3 Days, utilizing IDF Protected Evacuation Routes which prevent Hamas and the Palestinian Islamic Jihad from launching Attacks against the Evacuees like we had seen previously.

As usual; Israel are trying to prevent civilian casualties, Hamas are looking to use civilians as shields and propaganda.
 
Osvaldorama said:
The Israel Defense Force has stated that over 50,000 Palestinians have been Evacuated from Northern to Southern Gaza over the last 3 Days, utilizing IDF Protected Evacuation Routes which prevent Hamas and the Palestinian Islamic Jihad from launching Attacks against the Evacuees like we had seen previously.

As usual; Israel are trying to prevent civilian casualties, Hamas are looking to use civilians as shields and propaganda.
Click to expand...
Really that simple is it? I'd rather read from trusted, verifiable sources and condemn the ongoing atrocities by both sides.

https://reliefweb.int/report/occupi...ilities-gaza-strip-and-israel-flash-update-33

On 8 November, the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights, Volker Türk, stated that “parties to the conflict have the obligation to take constant care to spare the civilian population and civilian objects, which remains applicable throughout the attacks. The actions of one party do not absolve the other party of its obligations under international humanitarian law. Attacks against medical facilities, medical personnel and the wounded and sick are prohibited.”

"" Clashes and shelling on and around the road reportedly continued, endangering evacuees with reports of corpses alongside the road. Most evacuees are moving on foot and Israeli military reportedly forced those evacuees who use vehicles to leave them at the southern edge of Gaza city, at Al Kuwaiti roundabout. The evacuees then walk 4-5 kilometres down the corridor, with an estimated distance of up to 20 kilometres for those traveling farthest."

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/live-blog/israel-hamas-war-live-updates-rcna124349
 
  • Like
Reactions: shoot_spiderman
I thought Labour could be in real trouble over differing attitudes and splits caused by the Israel conflict.

Then Dorries and Braverman decide to compete for top numpty status today. The disgust inspired by Braverman is almost eclipsed by the bonkers conspiracy rants of Nadine.

Oh hold on, I've just seen Priti Patel is next up at the covid enquiry, she'll be her usual modest self I expect :)
 
  • Like
Reactions: shoot_spiderman, OddRiverOakWizards and StJabbo1
greensaint said:
I thought Labour could be in real trouble over differing attitudes and splits caused by the Israel conflict.

Then Dorries and Braverman decide to compete for top numpty status today. The disgust inspired by Braverman is almost eclipsed by the bonkers conspiracy rants of Nadine.

Oh hold on, I've just seen Priti Patel is next up at the covid enquiry, she'll be her usual modest self I expect :)
Click to expand...
Mad Nad and Sue Ellen campaigning for the opposition.
 
greensaint said:
I thought Labour could be in real trouble over differing attitudes and splits caused by the Israel conflict.

Then Dorries and Braverman decide to compete for top numpty status today. The disgust inspired by Braverman is almost eclipsed by the bonkers conspiracy rants of Nadine.

Oh hold on, I've just seen Priti Patel is next up at the covid enquiry, she'll be her usual modest self I expect :)
Click to expand...
Patel looks looks a denizen from the dungeon.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Lemons and Oranges
Onionman said:
Oh, mate. Tragic. Can't speak for anyone else but the quotes of mine were times when I'd previously asked the question (like a normal person would) then not had a response.

Slight difference from your standard "I can't believe nobody is discussing children identifying as feather dusters" (or whatever fake story you found on the internet that morning).

You used to annoy me but now you just make me laugh.

Vin

EDIT: just realised I shouldn't be laughing at someone rage-posting at two in the morning.
Click to expand...

I can understand why someone as full of themselves like you would be upset about being found out. Trying to explain yourself is a bit pathetic especially when you claim not to be annoyed. It's been pointed out before that you sound continually angry, you really should get it sorted.

You see, the difference is you get annoyed by me but I don't give a rat's arse what you or your parrot have to say. Posted at 15.35
 
  • Like
Reactions: SR get out of my club
It's Only A Game said:
I can understand why someone as full of themselves like you would be upset about being found out. Trying to explain yourself is a bit pathetic especially when you claim not to be annoyed. It's been pointed out before that you sound continually angry, you really should get it sorted.

You see, the difference is you get annoyed by me but I don't give a rat's arse what you or your parrot have to say. Posted at 15.35
Click to expand...

You go back and collect the posts below and post in the early hours then claim someone else is annoyed? You come over as the original Mr Angry shaking his fist at clouds, get the help you obviously need.

↑
* Funny how often people on here say "I'm surprised xx hasn't been mentioned on here" rather than just raising a question or point. I think they assume it's a kind of "Gotcha! Hiding from the truth'
↑
This has become such a bizarre regular occurrence on here. IOAG getting pretty angry just the other day when I pointed it out then too..
I agree it's so bizarre. Some of them don't even remember doing it themselves. Gotcha!
Breezer, has everything got to be explained to you? Look at what you were posting about and then read my reply. If you still don't understand, I'll post it in bigger letters or something.

↑
I note there's been no response from people telling us that 'remainers' need to do something to make Brexit work.
Vin
↑
I am surprised that there has been little comment on this thread with regard to the calls for restraint regarding the potential clash between pro-Palestinian protests and the services of remembrance next Sunday.
↑
It would appear, judging by the silence, to be: Stop asking an awkward pertinent question.
↑
Surprised that no one has piked up in the news that it now very much looks like the SAS were involved in war crimes in Afghanistan and Iraq
↑
Genuine question that nobody on here has ever answered. Nobody. Not once.
↑
I wonder what Os and IOAG have said about this vile creature and her hate politics, almost trumpian.

#41958
It's Only A Game, Today at 3:12 AM
 
It's Only A Game said:
I agree it's so bizarre. Some of them don't even remember doing it themselves. Gotcha!
Breezer, has everything got to be explained to you? Look at what you were posting about and then read my reply. If you still don't understand, I'll post it in bigger letters or something.
Click to expand...

It is still hilarious to me that you think anyone else represents me. I said it's bizarre, I stand by it, regardless of who does it.

Your obsession with identity politics is alarming.
 
  • Like
Reactions: StJabbo1
Onionman said:
You must log in or register to see images
Click to expand...
There was something not quite kosher with this story such that I posted to the effect that if proven those responsible should face the ful weight of the law. As it was the likes of the express, mail, telegraph and spiked media disgraces outraging the right.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom
Back