https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-52602580
Obama has called the US handling of the pandemic "an absolute chaotic disaster".
Obama has called the US handling of the pandemic "an absolute chaotic disaster".
Off Topic Politics Thread
- Thread starter ChilcoSaint
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Probably won't be saying that in 4 years time!
Edit - Assuming I've guessed correctly what that amendment refers to.
In general, even good leaders get voted out after a spell. No PM in the UK has reached 12 years since Robert Jenkinson in the early 19th century; no Canadian PM has reached that marker since William Lyon Mackenzie King* eighty years ago. Having a popular and capable leader step aside for the mystery box is silly.
*Yes you have to use his whole name it's a thing.
Yeah I do get your point in general, just pointing out that many will likely be grateful for it when 2024 comes round.
Think it's a good thing overall, or the idea is sound at least
I get the rationale, they didn't want to have pseudo-dictators. But my feeling is that the pressure to win elections is (or at least was) more of a bulwark against doing crazy **** than a long tenure. A second-term president with nothing to lose is scarier than a president aiming for a third term, IMO.
Perhaps, but both Margaret Thatcher and Tony Blair won three elections. Both arguably outstayed their welcomes.
In the case of the latter it really depends if you see Cameron, May and Pfeffel as improvements. Whatever your view of Blair there is plenty of electoral evidence to suggest that he certainly wouldn't have lost in 2010 and probably would still have maintained a working majority.
Labour was exhausted and out of ideas by 2010, and needed a period in opposition to recover and rebuild.
Sadly, everything has gone to **** since then in ways few people could have foreseen, but that was probably inevitable. There is a tide in the affairs of men etc. (capitalism is undergoing a prolonged existential crisis), and the British Labour Party is finally in a good position to take that tide at the flood.
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I don't go along with the ' exhausted ' argument. The Tories were exhausted this time but used Brexit to badger an exhausted electorate. Gordon Brown, who I liked, just didn't have it as a leader. A mere 2% reduction in the swing in 2010 would have altered the balance from 306/258 in Cameron's favour to level pegging. Given a different result Clegg would have dealt with us in preference to them. There would have been no Brexit. Would you say that the last four years Labour saw any recovery and rebuilding?
With respect, I think you need to let go of the past. Yes, we all need to learn lessons from it, but playing the “what ifs and maybes” game isn’t going to help anyone.
Labour currently has it’s best leader since John Smith if not Harold Wilson, the grassroots is re-invigorated (Corbyn’s legacy), and the Tories are now the ones who are exhausted, and publicly unraveling under a lazy deluded narcissistic leader.
Brexit, however, is happening. I don’t like it any more than you do, but the 2016 referendum and The 2019 election make it inevitable. What remains to be decided, is what sort of relationship we will have with our nearest neighbours going forward.
Over the last few years the Government have done **** all else but focus on and push through Brexit.
Everything else was pushed to the side as they were so totally focused on that one outcome.
We are now facing a horrific pandemic that is killing thousands of our citizens and destroying our economy but they still allow themselves to be distracted by Brexit.
If they would put as much effort into protecting the people and the economy through the pandemic as they put into "Getting ****ing Brexit done" we would not have the number of deaths or the economic crisis that we are now experiencing.
This Government is a one trick pony and their trick has **** all to do with fighting Covid 19.
Drop Brexit. Save lives. Protect the NHS.
Everything else was pushed to the side as they were so totally focused on that one outcome.
We are now facing a horrific pandemic that is killing thousands of our citizens and destroying our economy but they still allow themselves to be distracted by Brexit.
If they would put as much effort into protecting the people and the economy through the pandemic as they put into "Getting ****ing Brexit done" we would not have the number of deaths or the economic crisis that we are now experiencing.
This Government is a one trick pony and their trick has **** all to do with fighting Covid 19.
Drop Brexit. Save lives. Protect the NHS.
Well I happen to think that rejoin may be an advantage electorally going forward. By 2024 a further tranche of Brexit voters will have gone and the negative consequences will be clear. Some kind of negotiation with the EU needs to be kept open so that the electorate could be offered the option of rejoining. I think this might be just as potent as Leave was last time.
Sure. There are also plenty of elected officials who have overstayed their welcome within weeks of taking office. But I'd imagine that, in all but exceptional circumstances, most leaders would get three terms at the most before retiring or being voted out, and that hardly represents a threat to democracy.
How the heck Brexit has anything to do with the pandemic is beyond me. Do you really think the government or any government for that matter isn’t doing all it can for their countrymen. Would you rather the government stopped trying to help the people that can’t go to work. The money pot is not endless, all Countries are in the same boat. How the hell is not negotiating Brexit going to help the pandemic ? I’m no lover of the tories and agree they have been a bit slow at times but to say they are concentrating more on Brexit than the pandemic is just ludicrous to me!!
I honestly couldn't disagree more.
Not only does having unlimited terms open the door to a person slowly changing to system to cement his rule and rule of his ideology, a very slippery slope that has had disastrous consequences throughout history. It also limits the ability to bring in fresh ideas and fresh viewpoints which is essential for development and to prevent stagnation. Even the best leaders will get to the point they cant bring anything new to the table.
A bit of a left field example but even mother nature has recognised this as crucial and designed life to revolve around bringing in new Genes to see what works best because the 'mystery box' as you called it is better than stagnation and essential to evolution.
I personally would have 2 terms be a limit as that is enough time for a leader to try out his ideas and put his plans in motion and see what works while also preventing them from becoming completely entrenched and having a negative affect on democracy. After that time you need to pass the torch to the next generation of leader with new ideas.
There is no party that doesn’t have good ideas some practical some not. Sometimes I wish there could be both main parties In a coalition during epidemics like this. That perhaps would possibly keep the people more happy..........Although on second thoughts probably not.!!
Probably. I still think the two election rule makes quite a bit of sense, at least it does seem from this side of the pond. Not just to me either; they adopted it for the London Mayoralty too.
Edit; I have just read that Trump tweeted 100 times in one day yesterday. He shouldn’t be standing for re-election once never mind twice; he quite clearly isn’t of sound mind.
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Yeah, that's why its important we have an opposition to keep challenging the government and presenting different ways of doing things.
That's the only thing that moderates my criticism of him. I used to have a customer with mild Down's Syndrome and I'm pretty sure that he could do at least as good a job of running a country as Trump. Come to think of it probably as well as Pfeffel too.