On the other hand, anyone relying exclusively on a state pension to survive, is probably struggling as it is. And why should people who have paid into the system for half a century, have to claim benefits to just about scrape by?
Off Topic Politics Thread
- Thread starter ChilcoSaint
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On the other hand, anyone relying exclusively on a state pension to survive, is probably struggling as it is. And why should people who have paid into the system for half a century, have to claim benefits to just about scrape by?
You appear to know little about people and their pride, that’s not a dig at you or it’s not meant to be.........
My generation and the ones before me always had it drilled into them that it was a lowly thing to do and a blight on their character to have to ask the state for help. It was always drilled in to us that the only way to get money is to work. That is why so many pensioners are now working. Also maybe taking jobs from the younger workers. So don’t look down on those that prefer not to go to the state for aid
My wife who is a pensioner by the way does work and she tells me she is working with at least two people over the age of 85 who are fit enough to still work. Why.......because they need to.......to enhance their pensions.
I have nothing but admiration for persons like that. Not to be a drag on the welfare system.
I don't deny it's unfair, but the pension system long ago went past the point that taxation covered future pensions, so maintaining pensioner incomes, even if by a little comes at a cost to other groups.
The whole cradle to grave social contract was a fabulous concept but is ultimately unaffordable in actuality.
If we could actually start taxing some of the hidden money out there, the public purse could be significantly more generous but that is another story.
My parents are 81, I know lots of their friends very well and have friends who are pensioners. I think I know pensioners pretty well to be fair. I accept that some of "your generation" might have high ideals about charity from the state (even though I know its not charity) but equally I know plenty who put their winter heating allowance towards a nice break in the sunshine. I also know a few that have played the system all their lives and contributed next to nothing to the economy. Pensioners are a demographic group, but they certainly aren't all alike, either in viewpoint or work ethic.
Some will suffer, I'll not deny it, but most won't.
The current working poor will never have the kind of retirement that pensioners mostly have today, and will struggle for the rest of their working lives on low incomes and deprivation until they reach an impoverished old age... That's what needs fixing, not patching the system until there's nothing left for anyone.
Sadly it’s a vicious circle........what ever I or my wife earn although both are pensioners we Give back quite a lot back to the state. So in fact paying a fair amount of our pension back to them.
I understand governments have to make difficult choices. And a lot of pensioners are doing quite well, if they are fortunate enough to have a decent company pension to go with their state pension. And of course, people are living longer now.
But it’s always the poor, the sick, and the vulnerable who have to pay - while the front runner for next Tory leader proposes tax cuts for the affluent.
Me too. The state pension is taxable, but you don’t pay tax on it. When I got my state pension last year I was surprised to get a letter from HMRC lowering my tax allowance by the same amount as my state pension, so the tax on my NHS pension went up by over £100 a month.
And if either of you end up needing Social Care, either residential or in your own home, chances are you’ll have to pay for that.
Yup, that's taxes for you. The thing is, current costs need covering from taxes. Contributions over a lifetime of working do not cover the costs of future retirement, especially with people living longer so everyone who reaches a threshold where their income attracts tax should pay it. The crime is that so many individuals and businesses don't pay their share which puts more burden on those that do.
It is, as you say, a vicious circle and it is society that needs fundamental changes if anyone other than the wealthy is to have any kind of comfortable old age.
In general I agree but I'm still worried that those in thier 20s and 30s are fighting the efforts to raise their work pension contributions. The outcry when the % was put up to over 3% was silly. Many exercised their 'right' to opt out. I suspect the same peoplewill be, in 40yrs time, moaning about not getting enough from the work pension.
I know few of us thought about pensions in our younger years. I'm glad the NHS had such a good scheme but note I never contributed under 6%, for the last decade it was about 9%.
In another bit of sillyness they've changed the rules so once you reach 55yrs or 30 yrs contributions you continue to pay in but it doesn't increase your pension pot a bit, not a jot. With this in mind my wife has just given the NHS her notice pointing out she can claim her pension while also working in the private sector who are desperate for nurses. She points out the NHS want her to now pay £337 a month in pension contributions with no further benefit to her.
The rules are just potty.
Completely agree, one of the main reasons I didn’t do my full 40 years in the NHS but went 18 months early was because of the rise to 9%. The new rules, as you say, are even more ridiculous. It’s almost like government policy is to drive the longest-serving, highest skilled staff into the private sector...
I'm a NHS pensioner, left as fast as I could. At the time, not because of pension contributions but because of the decimation of the NHS culture.. Now, 13 years on I'm still employed on a sessional basis in the private sector. Sadly the area I have specialist skills in are not valued within the NHS..
Corbyn “eviscerated” at a PLP meeting:
https://www.theguardian.com/politic...sted-by-labour-mps-in-worst-meeting-as-leader
https://www.theguardian.com/politic...sted-by-labour-mps-in-worst-meeting-as-leader
Thus making it easier to break up the NHS as a direct result of not having enough qualified staff.
I very much doubt that this is accidental.
You perhaps are not aware but back in 1947/8 the Tories voted against the welfare system that labour wanted to bring in. In some ways they do seem to be tearing it apart.........
They voted against the NHS umpteen times, and I agree that they are tearing it and the entire welfare system apart.
Yet people will still vote for them despite knowing that this is happening, based on the “I’m alright, Jack” principle.
I'd strongly recommend opting back in mate, as soon as you can afford to.
One day, if you're lucky, you'll walk past a shop window, check your reflection, and see an old geezer looking back at you. You'll have no ****ing idea where the years went, but you'll thank yourself if you've got a few shekels in your pension pot, to go with all the memories (of Saints winning trophies).