Off Topic Politics Thread

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I Sorry I Ruined The Party said:
Well sure. I'm certainly not saying it's impossible for government agencies to do a crap job. Or that any particular government agency can't be run much better.

I'm just saying don't expect them to provide things cheaper than one would pay in the free market. They obviously can subsidize costs for a certain group to make things cheaper for that group. But the subsidy is money coming from someone else.
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It's funny (well not in a ha ha sort of way) but I guess the point I was making about hidden value in public service delivery was reinforced yesterday evening. Meeting my wife for our Fri evening drinky was delayed as she dealt with the aftermath of a patient death in the community. Sadly nothing that unusual (it was natural causes) and she just did what anyone would, whoever's paying them I guess. The real heroine was an admin assistant in the team who stayed behind with her and eventually took the dead chap's dog home to care for it as no other agency seemed able to act. In past years Social Services used to organise this sort of stuff but under new arrangements the out of hours service just shrugs.

Private sector employees are not less kind of course, to suggest so would insulting, but I'm suggesting a focus on targets and contracts erodes the morale when your "business" is a people centered one.
 
greensaint said:
It's funny (well not in a ha ha sort of way) but I guess the point I was making about hidden value in public service delivery was reinforced yesterday evening. Meeting my wife for our Fri evening drinky was delayed as she dealt with the aftermath of a patient death in the community. Sadly nothing that unusual (it was natural causes) and she just did what anyone would, whoever's paying them I guess. The real heroine was an admin assistant in the team who stayed behind with her and eventually took the dead chap's dog home to care for it as no other agency seemed able to act. In past years Social Services used to organise this sort of stuff but under new arrangements the out of hours service just shrugs.

Private sector employees are not less kind of course, to suggest so would insulting, but I'm suggesting a focus on targets and contracts erodes the morale when your "business" is a people centered one.
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In my experience, when organisations and institutions cease to be referred to as "services", but instead become "businesses" they become a lot less people friendly, and a lot less satisfying to work for.
 
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Archers Road said:
In my experience, when organisations and institutions cease to be referred to as "services", but instead become "businesses" they become a lot less people friendly, and a lot less satisfying to work for.
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Language is important.

Think I've said before how I was threatened with disciplinary action for refusing to call those I worked with as "end users", there was even a push to use the term "customer", in the Health Service ffs.

Patients was seen as insulting for some reason, clients I thought ok, service user a little cold, end user seemed rather, um, fatal. The people concerned of course just wanted some bloody help and were bemused by it all. They tended to refer to themselves as "smack heads" which is where my work started!
 
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Archers Road said:
In my experience, when organisations and institutions cease to be referred to as "services", but instead become "businesses" they become a lot less people friendly, and a lot less satisfying to work for.
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Consequence of letting accountants run an organisation
They know the cost of everything and the value of nothing
The 'best' businesses are run as services and consequently make a profit
The capitalist ideal from a time before it broke due to lack of regulation?
 
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ChilcoSaint said:
What he was saying was that this ransomware was so sophisticated it didn't matter what OS was in place, it could get through. Obviously the antivirus software on the NHS networks and PC's hadn't been updated to protect against it either, which is always going to be a problem. The NHS is very strict about uploading data to network PC's from external sources like CD's and USB sticks, and most network PC's don't allow it to non-admin users. The feeling is that the ransomware must have been lurking on the server of a legitimate website which NHS users had a valid reason for going into, and the bug got in that way.
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A little out of date now but my memory was once the NHS Trusts set up their own intranet, with off site servers, many IT chaps thought 'my work is done' and relaxed. With daily multiple backups the view was even a local meltdown could be easily rectified next day. To an extent they were right. So much of the service still runs WinXP as updating costs £££ and some local stuff (I'm looking at you addictions service prescribing software) would just not run on Win 7&8.

I thought Microstuffed agreed an extended security scheme for corporate customers, is that still current? My guess is those affected did not subscribe (£££ again) or simply did not apply any updates.

Oh and I demonstrated booting a linux DVD on a local NHS computer last year to prove a point. The twits don't even disable usb/dvd/network boots at bios level.
 
greensaint said:
Language is important.

Think I've said before how I was threatened with disciplinary action for refusing to call those I worked with as "end users", there was even a push to use the term "customer", in the Health Service ffs.

Patients was seen as insulting for some reason, clients I thought ok, service user a little cold, end user seemed rather, um, fatal. The people concerned of course just wanted some bloody help and were bemused by it all. They tended to refer to themselves as "smack heads" which is where my work started!
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You are so right. Language is important. 25 years ago I discussed labels we were encouraged to use in my Masters Dissertation. The title of which was, 'Prescription or Choice'. The political climate of the day was a push towards bringing the market economy into the NHS, 'The Commissioning/Provider Split'. We were being encouraged to move from the 'label' Patient to either client or service user, (next stop customer). It was, of course, a not so subtle attack on the medical model. Anyway, my research suggested that patients/clients/service users preferred prescription if they were first time referrals to the service and hoped for more choice if they were a second time, or third of fourth etc. Labelling was not on their agenda. The important point was that there was an unholy alliance between those who rightly wanted to challenge the paternalistic nature of the doctor/patient relationship and those who saw opportunity for privatisation. The blurring of libertarian-ism with the aims of liberalism,(with a small l), has been a tactic of the right wing of the Tory Party in attacking public services for many generations. It is at the core of repeated attacks, some might call them reforms, on both the health and education services but permeates through social services. Perhaps in recent years the service most devastated by these attacks is the probation service, now contracted out, wholly unprofessional, privatised and of little use to anyone.
 
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tiggermaster said:
You are so right. Language is important. 25 years ago I discussed labels we were encouraged to use in my Masters Dissertation. The title of which was, 'Prescription or Choice'. The political climate of the day was a push towards bringing the market economy into the NHS, 'The Commissioning/Provider Split'. We were being encouraged to move from the 'label' Patient to either client or service user, (next stop customer). It was, of course, a not so subtle attack on the medical model. Anyway, my research suggested that patients/clients/service users preferred prescription if they were first time referrals to the service and hoped for more choice if they were a second time, or third of fourth etc. Labelling was not on their agenda. The important point was that there was an unholy alliance between those who rightly wanted to challenge the paternalistic nature of the doctor/patient relationship and those who saw opportunity for privatisation. The blurring of libertarian-ism with the aims of liberalism,(with a small l), has been a tactic of the right wing of the Tory Party in attacking public services for many generations. It is at the core of repeated attacks, some might call them reforms, on both the health and education services but permeates through social services. Perhaps in recent years the service most devastated by these attacks is the probation service, now contracted out, wholly unprofessional, privatised and of little use to anyone.
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I don't think the blurring is restricted to the Tory party nor do I think it is restricted to Libertarianism or Liberal (small or large l) Cameron and Blair as well as Clegg and others would intermittently call themselves Libertarian, Liberal or Social Democrat without ever seeming to think they were any different to each other. To modern politicians I think they see these 3 terms as just different names for the same thing.
 
TheSecondStain said:
He said it was a joke. I would suggest that any MP who honestly thinks that kind of comment can be qualified as a joke isn't qualified for the position of Member of Parliament.
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He was also one of those implicated in the expenses inquiry. In 2 years he's done absolutely nothing for the people of Wells or the Mendip Hills. The former Lib Dem MP Tessa Munt has done more for the constituency since she lost the 2015 election than the MP has.
 
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