Off Topic Political Debate

It's not really needed - there is this thing called the English Channel

 

You do have to have some sympathy for Comrade Corbyn. This time last week with an open goal and the keeper on the floor, he scuffed his shot and just missed scoring. Then with IDS resigning and Osborne seemingly going AWOL, his opportunity was there for him again..only for the match to be called off. Still if the Tories carry on with their rabid infighting, he is sure to get another shot away soon.

 

I am not minimising the threat but placing it in an overall context. I agree that the free movement through Europe is a problem at the moment, and that there must be some changes to the Schengen agreement. However, this is a completely different thing to the EU. referendum and the argument as to whether the UK. is safer in or out of the EU.

Why disturb the opposition when they're busy scoring own goals - he doesn't have to say anything, everyone can see what is going on.

 

Why disturb the opposition when they're busy scoring own goals - he doesn't have to say anything, everyone can see what is going on.[/QUOTE]

Yes, but people have short memories Cologne and if he wants people to really hear his message he needs to get on the score-sheet. Does anyone remember the internal issues that Blair had when he was sweeping all before him and he EVEN had The Sun on his side!
I am absolutely no lover of State Socialism and most things the Comrade Corbyn stands for, but I do want a strong opposition - relying on Tory infighting is not reliable!

 

It is difficult to feel anything for Corbyn. Over many years he didn't have any regard for his fellow party members and becoming leader has shown up that he doesn't have the backing of many of his fellow party members in return. But who is a stand out replacement?

 

These attacks on European soil and the incompetence of the Belgian security services will undoubtedly add votes for Brexit.

 

Maybe it has gone unnoticed, but yet another bomber seems to have come from West Yorkshire. How long will it be before they turn their bombs onto European soil north of Dover?

 

Probably soon but hopefully the UK has not given the terrorists a head start by allowing free movement of ISIS and their weapons.

 

Horses and stable doors come to mind.

 

That is certainly applicable to the Schengen Agreement area, unfortunately for the victims today.

 

Corbyn is standing by what he said when he elected. He's not playing games, he doesn't need to, this government is vile enough without trying to manipulate the public's opinion.

I respect him for it...

 

No one knows their nationality yet, they're most likely Belgians, how do you stop that? Prevent all muslims leaving the country so they can't go anywhere to get training? How can you blame the EU for their citizens blowing themselves up?

Oh wait, it comes down to more sly racism/xenophobia from the usual suspects...

 

Exactly OFH, our biggest threat is from home grown terrorists. But being part of the EU does not negate this or make Britain safer. Did being in the EU make Sweden safer from the terrorist from Luton?
Making a country safer requires strong intelligence and that requires data...just look at the "jokey" response to any suggestion of measures to collect such data on this thread today. It may need for some "freedoms" to be sacrificed to counter the growing terrorist threat.
Despite trying to lay the blame for the supply of guns on the arms industry, the reality in Europe is that these guns are sourced from the old Eastern European & Balkan countries - this is the home of the AK47. Therefore with limited border controls between these countries (some of which are in the EU) they are easily smuggled into Belgium, France, Netherlands etc etc. Getting guns into the UK is much more difficult and very risky. But making bombs is relatively simple - the ingredients can be easily sourced and the recipes openly available on the internet.

 

You can blame the EU for the foolish political decision to do without internal borders without securing the external ones.

 

Nor being part of the EU makes the situation worse. I listened to a UKIP MEP talking tonight urging closer cooperation between all countries in Europe to try and stop such actions. There are many things happening in sharing of information, but at the end of the day no one in any country can stop a terrorist blowing himself up in a place chosen to create maximum damage. It is up to each individual country within the EU how they use the information they receive, so some will be better than others.
The UKIP defence spokesman last week stated that despite Calais being a fortress, they still cannot stop people getting through Dover. He went on to say that with other ports further north not being so well protected, it would be quite easy to get into the UK. He did not have a solution apart from a huge increase in police at the main ports up the east coast. But as you say making bombs is simple, and this has become the chosen weapon rather than guns. You can do more damage against a population in a minute with a bomb than with an automatic weapon.

 

The UK budget was approved by a very healthy majority of 35, 310 votes to 275. The Tory MP's came together to support the government as they will after the referendum.

George Osborne put on a rather defiant and confident speech today, although his stock has been damaged somewhat.

 

I was discussing this with one of my sons tonight, who was been reading some of the facts coming out of the Paris attack and subsequent Police action in Brussels before today Apparently the Police found boxes and boxes of new mobile phones - it seems they changed phones every day and also never send messages, they only speak. In addition after the rock concert massacre, the terrorists used the victims mobiles to talk to the Police. They are very well organised and use very professional counter intelligence measures and will be very difficult to defeat.

 

So we should leave the EU to stop this from happening?

 

There was a rather attractive security expert on TV tonight agreeing that the terrorists are extremely well organized and every country in Europe was at risk from attack. Her idea was that there should be a coordinating body to oversee what information was available and make sure it was passed on quickly to the country under threat. She said that the structure existed within the EU, but it was not developed enough to be more than 80% effective at present. She wanted that other 20% gap closed.
If you disagree with her, I would be interested to know what suggestions are out there to make Europe more secure.

 

I think the biggest challenge OFH is obtaining the relevant information before analysing and disseminating it. There are some measures that would help, but there would be massive objections about states obtaining this information. A good example is the monitoring of mobile phone and Internet usage of suspects, every time this is raised the civil rights groups are out demonstrating. Are people prepared to give up some of their rights to help secure our safety?