Pathetic

Discussion in 'Gillingham' started by Lenny38, Jan 28, 2012.

  1. Lenny38

    Lenny38 Member

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    Yet again Hessy shows that tactically he's not upto the job, lots of passion but ultimately utterly useless. I compare him to the recently sacked Neil Warnock, very passionate but totally out of his depth. I admire Scally massively, hes allowed Hessy to assemble a large squad that even an average conference manager would do well with in division 2. We dont go to see league football to watch pub football. I'm sure Scally will stick with Hessy , I just hope at the end of the season when we are sitting mid table at best, Hessy does the best thing for GFC and moves back to non league, lets be honest that his level.
     
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  2. gills4everandaday

    gills4everandaday Active Member

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    pathetic is right...hess has lost the plot and is has lost total control of matters within the team.
    so whats improved from last week then...what changes have happened to combat what he said would not be happening again after poor recent weeks?

    lets see, frampton came in who is actually no better than these so called other defenders at the club, alongside richards who has no clue whatsoever where to position himself and tackle/stop a shot on goal.
    lee just is not interested and martin is not good enough, along with may i say montrose who loses the ball in bad areas and gives nothing to our midfield!
    yet we have simon king who doesn't yet again get to play, callum davies not even on the bench and connor essam who was man of the match today by the way for dartford fc, who was not required urgent enough for a recall back to us...because we have these so called better pro's in our team...what are you on hess?! oh and matt fry not signing because he's not any better than that lot or up to our standard...please, what standard!!! <doh>

    so thats one basic change and here we are again...give yourself a pat on the back hess for a job well done again <ok>

    then there's matt lawrence and chris whelpdale who were signed by hess and down as two of our saviours this season...don't think so now...not even in the squad, and can see alot of unrest within the club now for sure!

    hess do you not know what a defence requires (which of course is my guess, not a clue) or is it that you as the manager have never had a challenge of this stature and don't know which way to turn???

    if we don't make these drastic changes and now (signings/youth players)...we won't be anywhere of note and yes hess, you can take the creit for all that...not just the players who are not motivated enough to succeed for gillingham fc under your management!!! :emoticon-0106-cryin
     
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  3. Lenny38

    Lenny38 Member

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    Absolutely spot on. There are managers in this league achieving so much more than us with far less resources. I dont think he has a clue how to sort out this mess.
     
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  4. GeminiSwiftgfc

    GeminiSwiftgfc Well-Known Member
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    I see the title pathetic and oh what a surprise to it's by Lenny38 the guy who only ever posts when things aren't going well, I'd almost forgotten about you seeing as we'd played fairly well since October. Yes we're in a slump at the moment, most teams go through them most seasons, and it's always nice to see the supporters rally around and get behind the team.

    Funny thing about decision making is if it goes right you're generally ignored but when you're you get critised and put down and insulted, generally by people who haven't achieved a fraction of what the guy making the desicison has and of course the guy critising must know better because he has hindsight and no consequences to worry about. Yes Hess may have made incorrect choices, as everybody does from time to time, but let's have a look as to why he may have made some of those choices.

    1: Not bringing back Essam from Dartford, or bringing in someone on loan following the the complete downfall of defensive cohesion at the Dons game.

    Possible answer: bringing in a completely inexperienced player or even 1 with only limited experience into a team following that collapse could have had absolutely dire consequences not only for the team but for the
    Layer brought in. If Essam had been part of the first half on Saturday, bearing in mind apprehension and doubt that would have been in the other players mind he could have quickly been taken over by the same fears and issues that the others players had and disappeared into oblivion and made things worse. Now I say this possibility without any idea of what Essam persona is like. But surely the worst place to come into when a team is not performing well defensively is defence. It could just be too much pressure for some so young. For Essam I believe Hess made the right decision. Do we need changes/additions? Most definately, but I do not think Essam would have been the right call. As for Matt Fry, I feel the same applies, he has lacked any first team, competitive football since his injury at Charlton and I do not feel the Stanley game was the right one to have brought him in. So yet again I can see why Hess may have made this call.

    Why Hess doesn't play Simon King? Well I fear that King may not be able to compete at this level anymore. A horrid fear but surely King's long term well being is the overriding factor here.

    Was there anyone else available to come in on loan at short notice that had the right mix of ability, experience, speed and all those other attributes we need? I very much doubt it. But I'm sure Hess was looking.

    2: Why were there so few changes from the previous match? Generally, and once again this is my opinion and I have no idea what might have gone on in the mind of our manager, the defence has been ok, not good I'll admit but ok. To completely change a whole thing because of a disasterous 30 minutes will not necessarily change anything. If the players do not know how each other work it will not bring order to chaos. In fact it will probably lead to more choas and then by your logic it would have to be changed again and so on and so forth. Not what I would want to see. I do feel that sometimes we forget that the players are mere mortals like you or I. Put yourself in the players positions and ask yourself how you would have like to have been treated by your manager? Would you want the chance to put it right?

    The catalyst for yesterday came from 1 poor throw out by Flitney very early in the game which, to already low levels of confidence, caused even more doubt and fear and uncertainty to take over. Flitney is a confidence player and I think Hess made the right call to bring him off at half time. Any earlier and the humiliation and embarrassment would have been more than I could imagine Flitney, it's bad enough being subbed as a goalkeeper as it. Yes I do speak from experience unfortunately. Protecting the players state of mind is as important in the long term as protecting them physically or fitness wise. Possibly more important in fact as it can be much harder to repair mental issues than physical ones.

    There are many more factors behind the decisions Hess has to make than just what player goes where.

    For the first time in many seasons we are in a positive in the goal difference column, we have still have more wins than loses so Hess can't be doing it all wrong. Again it's far easier for fans to throw criticism and insults at the manager than it is to consider the decisions he has to make and why he would make them as he does.

    The one decision Hess can not make is how a player is going to perform.

    No doubt people will think I'm wrong, insult me, call me deluded etc etc etc, whether they write it or not, who knows. After the game I felt upset and hurt and embarrassed and ashamed of what has happened the last few weeks but try to think, just for a moment, what it must be like for the players and staff and even the manager at that time and what/how you would want to react and how you'd want others to react.

    A positive in my mind is that we improved in the 2nd half and hopefully we'll take that into the next game. There was a seriously bad 80ish minutes (last half hour of Dons game and 1st half of the Stanley one) but hopefully we're past that now. We still look threatening going forward thankfully.

    Let's get behind the boys come Hereford.

    UTG
     
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  5. jayGills74

    jayGills74 Member

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    Spot-on Gemini, very good post <applause>
     
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  6. itstimupnorth

    itstimupnorth Well-Known Member

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    Some very resonable points, Gemini, but I take issue with the situation regarding Simon King. Hessy apparrently doesn't think that he can't compete at this level, otherwise he wouldn't be on the bench. Or, if he does have concerns about King's ability, why hasn't he brought in another central defender?

    What makes very interesting listening is the 3½ minute interview with Hessy on the BBC website - http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/16664375.stm

    Amongst the things he says is that in the first half the players just didn't put into practice what was discussed and arranged during training this week, and that was corrected at half time. But if that is the case then firstly surely some responsibility must fall on the captain (and I can't even remember who was captain yesterday, Andy Frampton maybe?) to get things sorted out, or even Hessy himself to get instructions, or even reminders, accross from the touchline. It was blindingly obvious in the first 10 minutes, even before Accy scored their second goal, that things were not right with the defence. Why did it take till half time, and 4-1 down, to get the message across.

    There's also a promise that travelling Gills fans will get their travel costs back. I won't be claiming for my 30 mile round trip, but I'm sure the gent who I met in the pub beforehand who had come up on the train with (I think) 2 children would welcome that.

    You are right, that hopefully the second half performance has seen the turn-round in the recent poor defensive performance, but I agree with LeedsGill (thanks for your company and knowledge yesterday) that Gazzaniga deserves a run in goal. However I'm sure that the defence will come across greater challenges than those posed by Accrington in the second half. The tide hasn't turned yet.
     
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  7. gills4everandaday

    gills4everandaday Active Member

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    excuses excuses geminiswift, wake up will you, along with a few others.
    this defence has been a shambles since hess took over and with lawrence, frampton, martin etc added this season, they have not improved at all.
    they have no idea defensively as a unit whatsoever and are even worse as individuals on the pitch in the roles they perform and we all know the midfield are no help towards taking this pressure off the defence!

    have some of you guys actually watched many games since hess has been back, and even before that with stimmo...they give the fans no confidence to shout about...let alone there fellow so called pro teammates!!!
    yes they have performed now and again and a very select few as a unit, but without our attack, we would of been found out long before now!

    hess is lost in find answers and has no one to bunce ideas off in his set up...that is only down to himself!

    these so called players that are our saviours where are they now for us i.e. whelpdale, lee, frampton, lawrence, richards, weston, montrose, martin, flitney etc...nowhere thats where!

    only a set few are helping our cause i.e. jackman, kuffour, kedwell, payne and now tomlin.

    fish and oli are not even worth a mention!

    then we have players signed on because they have promise...yet never get alook in...rance, brunt, brown, evans, essam and davies...what the hell for they won't even get a chance next year!!!

    hess you have alot of issues that need to be dealt with and fast...yet still don't see it and won't upset the apple cart, because you don't have either any idea or a ruthless edge as a manager!

    a overhaul is needed and soon...we can say goodbye to any chances this season now!!!

    yes it's harse guy's and some don't want to hear it...but it so obviously true :angry:

    unless we see drastic changes in the next few days or hess keeps to what words he spouts, then nothing will improve whatsoever! :emoticon-0106-cryin


    UTG!!!!!!
     
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  8. bristol407

    bristol407 Well-Known Member

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    Gemini---don't you dare speak any common sense on here!
    A few reflections now;
    -the main problem this season has been inconsistency with erratic performances ranging from sublime to rubbish.
    -there is little doubt that the squad is good enough as evidenced by the defeat of two league 1 teams having been drawn away.
    -for the first part of the season the problem was inability to score which most people have forgotten. This appeared to get fixed but be followed by a propensity to leak goals despite some occasional outstanding defensive displays.
    A few thoughts on a diagnosis
    -we have played 23 people in the team. A ridiculously high number caused more by injuries/suspensions and relying on loan players than indecision on team selection. Players who get injured do not do it deliberately but they must go to the back of the queue when it comes to selection. There is plenty that can be done about suspensions and I would not wish to state the obvious. The problems of taking loan players is plain and going this route has to be treated with caution. One at a time is enough.
    -players have to listen. From what Hessy said yesterday, he took Flitney off because he had failed to follow a direct instruction to kick and his throwing led to at least one goal. How thick can some people be and i am not just talking about Flitney who until the last couple of weeks was a main success story
    -conceding goals is not entirely the fault of the back four and scoring is not just down to the forwards. It is all about having a team.
    -the much maligned Hessy is trying to be Director of football/Manager/Coach and asst manager. Even in league 2 these roles are spread over 2 or 3 people. It is said that Hessy would rather fund players than pay an assistant which may be an error.We have too many players!
    So for my money you would back the squad;back the manager;hire in a credible coach;forget about any loan signings and leave them to it until the end of March. If there is no obvious improvement it may be appropriate to introduce some of the youngsters, sideline the underperformers (who may well be the "big"names) for moving on in the Summer. Getting in the playoffs this year is less important than putting a team together which is not just capable of getting up but doing well in league 1.
     
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  9. Lenny38

    Lenny38 Member

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    Gemini, I dont know how many matches you go to, but I'm guessing based on your recent post....not many. How could you call our defence ok? Its absolutely shocking you need to take your Hessy rose tinted glasses of mate. I also dont agree with the statement he cant influence how they play on the pitch. I think your find a decent manager will be able to influence players/games. As for Lee and Whelpdale whats happened to them? 2/3 of my mates are posh fans and couldn't believe they sold them to us. Lee is played out of position all the time and Whelpdale cant get a game.

    We need changes but its not the players that we need to change.
     
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  10. GeminiSwiftgfc

    GeminiSwiftgfc Well-Known Member
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    The point I was trying to make was that you should take the human factor into consideration as well. You make seem like football management is a computer game and it's a case put the player in a place and he will perform.

    I wonder is this the way you treat your family and friends? If you don't agree with what they do or how they do it you just discard them and move on? Or by chance do you support them, help them through the hard times and see they come through it better? When it comes to the Gills and everything to do with them I try to look at it that way rather than just discard it like a gadget and just move on to the next one. It might not be the right way of looking at it but if I wanted a football club that all I cared about is results I'd go glory hunting and support some soulless premier league team.
     
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  11. WINDYROG

    WINDYROG Well-Known Member

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    Gemini - Bristol
    Two very good posts. Thank you.
     
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