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Off Topic Other Sport

Discussion in 'Horse Racing' started by Cyclonic, May 29, 2017.

  1. Tamerlo

    Tamerlo Well-Known Member

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    Well played Ronnie, you truly are the Greatest Snooker player of all time...!!
    And you’ve got the balls for it!<laugh>
     
    #2401
  2. SwanHills

    SwanHills Well-Known Member

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    A long and happy retirement to Roy Hodgson CBE. He came out of retirement, apparently, to try and save Watford, but i don't think anyone could have rescued them from relegation, which looks pretty likely.

    Roy Hodgson, a thoroughly decent man in a sport which has it's fair share of scoundrels, crackpots, and yes, morons. I am glad the powers-to-be recognised this with a well-deserved CBE.
     
    #2402
    Last edited: May 5, 2022
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  3. Pilgrim

    Pilgrim Well-Known Member

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    Another failure of Guardiola, the biggest swindler in world football, billions spent with Bayern and City and billions thrown away, and there are still people who buy his broken merchandise. Tomorrow the sheikh raises a cent a barrel of oil and all is settled, another hundred million pounds raised in a couple of minutes and to sign another player to keep him on the bench.

    The state clubs are rubbish. It was enough for me that the Champions won't be won by PSG or City, obviously I want Real Madrid to win it, I've been following them for more than fifty years but if Liverpool win it, it won't hurt me as much as if the other two won it.

    Hala madrid!!!
     
    #2403
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  4. redcgull

    redcgull Well-Known Member

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    Not that i want to stir the pot up Pilgrim, being the Liverpool fan myself. But havnt Real Madrid been bailed out by the Spanish government on numerous occasions when the club has been on its arse so to speak...!! They bought the training ground for nowt then sold it back for squillions. Paid for some of those Galaticos back in the late 90's early 00's...?? Not that i am targeting your team, they are all at it, but Mardid have bent the books on several occasions in the past...

    I know where you are coming from, and it dosnt exactly sit well with me all this money sloshing around the sport for people and players are not worth it, but its a whole new game now to the days that you and me used to watch. I first stood on the Kop back in the mid 80's so saw some damn good sides, and money wasnt such a big issue then. Now though, you better have one hell of a sugar daddy to compete at any level...!! Oh well...

    Come on you Red Men...!!!
     
    #2404
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  5. SwanHills

    SwanHills Well-Known Member

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    To be quite honest, I have always liked old Pep. When he was with Bayern (a difficult time for him) he did a lot of thoroughly good work behind the scenes for not-so-well-off folk in Munich. No, he certainly isn't that bad a guy.
     
    #2405
  6. Pilgrim

    Pilgrim Well-Known Member

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    In English I cannot express myself or make myself understood with all the clarity that the subject deserves.

    The first, and very important, is that Real Madrid is not a public limited company, Real Madrid C.F. belongs to its members, who vote every four years (if there is more than one candidate) to elect the president, although it is true that nobody dares to stand against Florentino Pérez, and if he does stand it doesn't matter because he would lose. Furthermore, to prevent any intrusion by upstart multimillionaires or similar people, one of the essential requirements for standing is to have been a member of the club for at least 20 years, as well as having to present a bank guarantee of more than 200 million euros to respond with that money if the management of the club makes a loss. Therefore, there are no sheiks, Russian oligarchs, Mexican or Venezuelan millionaires, or Hollywood stars who can buy the club.

    Regarding the "aid" you refer to from the government, this is another of the myths that the anti-Madrid press, which is, strangely enough, the majority in Spain, has spread.

    Real Madrid had some land where the club's sports city was located since the 60s of the last century (training grounds, basketball pavilion etc.). At that time these grounds were at one end of the city (not on the outskirts), but with the passing of time and the growth of Madrid, their location became one of the most sought-after areas of the city. The same happened with the Santiago Bernabéu stadium, which is now located almost in the centre of the city and in the best area of Madrid. What the city council did was to requalify the land and with its revaluation, it gave part of the money to Madrid and the other part was kept by the city council, so it was a rounded deal. In fact, four towers (which are the tallest buildings in Madrid, and I would almost certainly say in Spain) were built on that land and now form the Skyline of Madrid.

    A few years later, to compensate the other Madrid club, Atletico de Madrid, the city council gave them some land on the outskirts of Madrid (mind you, they did not own any land, unlike Real Madrid), and this was disguised as a "cooperation agreement" between the city council and Atletico de Madrid to give it a legal appearance.

    In fact, Real Madrid have tried a couple of times to move out of the centre of Madrid and build a new stadium on the outskirts of Madrid (as most of the big European clubs have in their city) and the city council has not allowed it, this, the first time it was proposed more than thirty years ago to no avail. That is why Real Madrid has been building a completely new stadium on top of the old one for years and, if nothing unusual happens, it will be inaugurated at the end of this year or early 2023. In order to carry out this work, the club has had to borrow 800 million euros, which it has to pay back in 30 years. The request for this loan was authorised by the members in an extraordinary assembly because it meant putting the club into debt. Again, there are no sheikhs here who raise the price of oil from one day to the next, or Russians who sell gas at whatever price they want. The money is going to be paid by the club and nobody else.

    And another fact (and sorry for the extension) to refute another great hoax spread by F. C. Barcelona since time immemorial. "Franco supported Madrid". This is still much easier to disprove with objective and real data, not opinionated.

    The Spanish civil war ended in 1939 and there began the almost forty years of the dictator Franco in power.

    The last league Real Madrid won before the war was in 1933. How is it possible that, if Franco helped Real Madrid, they did not win a league from 1939 to 1954, while in that time Barcelona won five and Atletico de Madrid four? Lies have very short legs.

    Did anything happen in 1954 for Real Madrid to finally win the league? Yes, it happened that Real Madrid signed the best player in the history of football, the Argentinian Alfredo Di Stefano. Di Stefano changed the history of Real Madrid and world football.

    And one last fact, Barcelona decorated Franco with the club's pin of Gold and diamonds (it's highest distinction) twice in the sixties and seventies. These decorations were for allowing the redevelopment of Barcelona's old football ground "Les Corts" three times! in 1951, 1962 y 1966. With that money, Barcelona built the field where he plays until the day today and is falling for how old he is.

    There are many teams that have history, Real Madrid does it.

    Good luck for the final.

    Postdata.- Sorry for grammatical mistakes.
     
    #2406
  7. redcgull

    redcgull Well-Known Member

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    Superb work Pilgrim, you certainly know your onions, and probably more than any other Real fan i know...<applause><applause>

    Some of your post i knew, some i didnt, which always helps understanding the situation dosnt it...

    Good luck for the final also...<ok> <cheers>

    PS - Don't apologise for the grammar, it was clear enough for me...
     
    #2407
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  8. SwanHills

    SwanHills Well-Known Member

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    Nothing wrong with your English at all, Pilgrim. A little secret, I was a Real fan too in the days of the great De Stefano, et al. What a team that was! Working abroad, I lost touch quite a bit with football, so I had to sort of pick it all up again after I finally retired.
     
    #2408
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  9. Pilgrim

    Pilgrim Well-Known Member

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    DeepL is one of my best friends. Mmmm.... unfortunately I think many of us who write here are too old.

    And speaking of Alfredo Di Stefano, now that the Champions League final is coming up, one of his mythical quotes (among many) is: "Las finales no se juegan, se ganan".
     
    #2409
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  10. Tamerlo

    Tamerlo Well-Known Member

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    Pilgrim, did you ever see Di Stefano play? My father took me to see him at Old Trafford in the European Cup.
    The thing that stood out was his supreme intelligence as a footballer, but he was not a traditional number 9.
    He was all over the field, attacking one minute and then chasing the United winger down the line, poking his foot at the ball.
    A truly magnificent, supreme player, and to think that most of his years at Real Madrid were in his thirties!
    What on earth must he have been like, playing for River Plate in his twenties?
    Matt Busby said at the time that he was the greatest player in the world. He was not wrong.
    His fellow forward, Puskas, wasn't bad, either.
    And Man.Utd played well that night, too.
    A treasured memory.
     
    #2410
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  11. SwanHills

    SwanHills Well-Known Member

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    Well said, Alfredo!
     
    #2411
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  12. Pilgrim

    Pilgrim Well-Known Member

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    No, sadly I didn't get to see him play live (well, sadly maybe not because it would mean I would be older now) but everyone who saw him agrees that he was the "total player". In those days the centre forward only played as a centre forward, the left winger only as a left winger and so on. Di Stefano was the first to play all over the field, and he wasn't that nonsense that is now so fashionable "a box to box player", no, Di Stefano scored a lot of goals and went all the way down to the midfield to collect the ball, something unthinkable at that time. I've seen recordings of the European Cup finals, like the 7-3 final against Eintracht Frankfurt, which is recognised as the best match in the history of football and which, according to what I've read, the BBC replayed on many Christmas, but according to what I've been told, it has nothing to do with how it looked live.

    Well, there were other times, other physical preparation and other conditions of sports equipment (ball, football boots, etc.) and above all, another state of the grounds, not like the "carpets" on which they play now.

    Mmmm... The Hungarian Ferenc Puskas, third top scorer in world football and second top scorer in European and World leagues, although FIFA recognizes him as the top scorer of the 20th century with 512 goals in 528 games, we know that in those days it was not as easy to collect the real data as now and there are always controversies. If it hadn't been for the fact that he had to be exiled from his country in 1956 because of the Hungarian revolution and was out of action for two years, he would have been the top scorer in world history without any doubt. In 1958 Manchester United wanted to sign him after the air tragedy but the English Football Association's rules regarding foreign players and his lack of knowledge of the English language prevented it. That year he signed for Real Madrid. Since 2009 FIFA has awarded him the "Puskas Award" for the best goal of the year. The first winner was Cristiano Ronaldo.
     
    #2412
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  13. Pilgrim

    Pilgrim Well-Known Member

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    Di Stefano has some absolutely memorable quotes, that one is perhaps the best or one of the best, but there is one that I like very much. When he was training Valencia he said to one of the goalkeepers "No te pido que pares los tiros que vayan dentro, pero por lo menos no te metas los que vayan fuera".

    I don't know if the translation is the best but it would be more or less the following "I'm not asking you to stop the shots that go in, but at least don't take the ones that go out".
     
    #2413
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  14. Tamerlo

    Tamerlo Well-Known Member

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    Probably one of the most memorable and yet hilarious statements was made just prior to the start of that famous match at Wembley in 1953.
    As the teams walked out onto the pitch, the England captain, Billy Wright, turned to his goalkeeper,Gil Merrick, and said:
    " Look at that fat little bugger. We'll murder 'em."
    No prizes for guessing who that "fat little bugger" was, but he had the greatest last laugh of all when he pulled the ball back with the underside of his boot to evade Billy Wright's tackle- and then scored one of Wembley's most famous goals.
    As a post script to that match, Sandor Barcs, President of the Hungarian Football Federation, credited the great coach, Jimmy Hogan, for laying the foundation to that victory by saying to the press..."Jimmy Hogan taught us everything we know about football."
    Jimmy was a local Burnley man, a friend of my father, and he gave him two tickets to the match, predicting that they would destroy England. My father went with a friend and was blown away with what he saw.
    During my childhood years, my father often recounted the game and he seemed even more impressed by Hidekguti than he was by Puskas.
    I suppose the 105,000 spectators were blown away, too!
     
    #2414
    Last edited: May 7, 2022
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  15. Pilgrim

    Pilgrim Well-Known Member

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    "The match of the century" There is a very good link (although it is from Wikipedia) where it describes, in great detail, what that match was like.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Match_of_the_Century_(1953_England_v_Hungary_football_match)

    There is a very interesting debate about who was the first "false nine" in history. Some say it was Hidegkuti, others say Di Stefano and some point to the Argentinian Adolfo Pedernera.

    Puskas signed for Madrid at the age of 31 and after two years without playing. Santiago Bernabéu (president of Real Madrid and the most important man in the club's history, first player, then coach and then president of the club for 35 years) was determined to sign him against the coach and the technical secretary of the club. He came from Italy where he had spent a few months after a spell in Switzerland after fleeing Hungary. He arrived with 12 extra kilos, with his famous belly. With Real Madrid he played 262 official matches scoring 242 goals. In the European Cup he played 39 games and scored 35 goals. He won three European Cups, five leagues and one Intercontinental Cup, he was top scorer four years in Spain and top scorer in Europe two years. In Spain he was known by the nickname of "Cañoncito Pum" because of his power with his left foot.
     
    #2415
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  16. OddDog

    OddDog Mild mannered janitor
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    Without wanting to cast aspersions, there is no way you can compare footballers from the 50s or 60s to modern day superstars like Ronaldo or Messi or even the greatest of them all (IMHO) Diego Maradonna. The standards the modern greats play at is unbelievable. In the 50s in England many players still had a full-time factory job and turned out at the weekends for extra pocket money.
     
    #2416
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  17. NassauBoard

    NassauBoard Well-Known Member

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    Older is better EOS

    I do find the “greatest” of any sport a mind boggling thing, it’s impossible to compare most sports over decades. Football being a prime example.

    For me it’s just great to see players like Messi and Ronaldo play for so long and so regularly. The longevity of sports stars is certainly amazing, thinking about Tennis very recently with the great trio of the mens game.
     
    #2417
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  18. stick

    stick Bumper King

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    Murray and who else?
     
    #2418
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  19. Pilgrim

    Pilgrim Well-Known Member

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    Guardiola already has another "little toy" for his collection. Only 350 million euros between salary, various commissions and the transfer to Borussia Dortmund. Ah! and surely there are the famous "variables", those bonus for which the players are paid for not falling asleep during the coaches' talks, not pissing more than four times a day or not eating peanuts. Let's see if next year finally they win the Champions League, if, by chance, that is not the case (some year they will have to achieve it by dint of spending money), rest assured that the sheikh will already release hundreds of millions to try again.
     
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    Last edited: May 10, 2022
  20. OddDog

    OddDog Mild mannered janitor
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    Financial fair play eh? <doh>
     
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