That will be especially sad for Putin. He was thinking of entering himself. He was going to sing waterloo barechested on stage.
What everyone appears to be forgetting is that help from Russia was requested after the elected government was literally overthrown. So if you are Russian, or have Russian ancestry which is common in Ukraine, then do you take the forced rule of nationalist extremists or do you go for the lesser of two evils and one far more palatable? Russia did not invade Ukraine. They didn't have to be pushed once a request was made sure and there are always other reasons but everyone has to remember that there was no revolution in Ukraine, just a violent overthrow of an elected government and a bunch of people who have given themselves the power without being elected by anyone and are proceeding to apply that power, over people who don't want or didn't elect them, with force. One that has had US and EU backing but as soon as the other side in this Ukrainian internal matter seeks outside support it's all Oh World War 3 is going to start ect ect. I find it ****ing hilarious, people are so ignorant of what is happening around the world. Only when something like this blows up in or close to Europe and people suddenly give a damn for like 10 minutes. What makes me laugh is Kerry saying Russia is invading a country of a false pretext! Really, those murican leaders have ****ing short memories. The US also boycotted the 1980 Olympics because Russia occupied Afghanistan, really short memories.
Yes and it still made no sense as the obvious answer is that I wouldn't like to see any country invaded and occupied, we've been watching that happen for decades and since Afghanistan and Russia it's been the US and Israel that have been doing most of the occupying and war mongering. Get your facts straight, Russia did not invade and take over Ukraine. They were asked for help, lets see what happens in the UK if the BNP managed to pull off what the opposition did in Ukraine, there would be NATO in England in no time to sort out the violent protestors. As for being better off with Russia or EU. Finland doesn't need either. Iceland? Doing much better because they told the EU to f**k off. They let their banks collapse. unemployment below 4% and they are aiming for 2%. Ireland didn't tell the EU to f**k off and it ended up paying 42% of the bailout for the Eurozone. All because German banks took big risks with Irish and other banks. Being in the EU meant Ireland's people will be paying money owed to risk taking German banks and bond holders till 2054. Yep that's the EU for you, a population of 3 million people paying 42% of the Eurozone banking debt. Your view on Russia is stuck in the 40s man,even then Stalin when he could have just taken over Finland at the end of WWII, quite easily too, did not, Finland fought them in 39 and again with the Nazis in the 41-2 and Stalin who liked to expand influence did not occupy Finland. Economics is the new Western occupation, it is just that some times war is needed to help set up the economic enslavement first.
I see now Sisu. This isn't about right or wrong. Its about you not liking the EU. So anything that goes against the EU is good for you. Weird Al Yanocovich is no longer president of Ukraine. Him asking the Russians to invade is not the same as Ukraine inviting them. Weird Al broke the constitution. He attacked peaceful protestors. He broke the laws of the state and then fled rather than face prosecution. He has no authority to invite Russia in. You keep saying the Russians are coming to protect their people. But zero threats had been made against the Russian speakers. Zero deaths. Zero acts of violence. They had been living in peace for years. I do believe a case could and should have been made for cessation... but not for Russian invasion. What I see is someone who hates the EU so much he is wishing occupation on 45 million innocent people just because it is a snub on the EU. Russia is not the gentle giant you portray it as. Its a land where political dissidents are killed or imprisoned . Where a dictator has complete control of the press and rigs the elections. Whose only friends are pariah states with fellow dictators. It is a country that once was a superpower and is annexing its neighbours with the goal of becoming a superpower again. To support it in overthrowing its neighbours just so you can laugh at the EU is sickening. I'm neither pro nor anti EU; but I do recognise it as being preferable to Russian authoritarianism.
Nothing is ever black and white. And there is no such thing as good and evil in world politics. There is just interests. World is overpopulated, probably is about time for a world war based upon that. Personally what i think will happen is that over the next few weeks there will be tensions that are consistantly highlighted by the media. Over the next few weeke the price of petrol will raise at least 20p per litre. Then this will all quieten down and the petrol price will remain 20p higher......Strange that.
I am sure you are right. If we impose sanctions it will be more than 20p though. I hope and suspect Kerry and Putin will have a quiet chat. They will agree in private that Putin can keep his conquest in Crimea but that as long as he doesn't cross any more lines... everything is OK. Things will be fine for a fee years until Russia gobbles up another piece of territory and we'll either ignore it or bluster a fee insults at Russia again. Worst case. Russia takes all of Ukraine in a two day blitzkrieg puts weird al back as dictator under orders to obey Moscow. We impose sanctions and we have another global recession. Doubt there will be war.
The bull**** media line. Russia has had over 15000 troops in Ukraine since the 90s. Is the media reporting on that? Are they reporting that Russia by agreement are allowed up to 25,000 troops in the Crimea? Nope bet not. Also lets look at the list of "puppet countries" of Russia. There's ermmm? Who? I think some of you have not copped yet that the soviet union is gone The truth about Ukraine is that most people were not involved in any protests or the following coup. These are Ukrainians and Ethnic Russians or in between mostly and they have been caught in the middle of a coup of an elected government. Ethnic Russians want Russian help, they won't get it from the Nationalists who have installed themselves as a government illegally. There is a civil war brewing and one side has no protection or militias, those non nationalists and anyone else ideologically opposed will be at the complete mercy of those who have taken over the country. What makes me laugh is that Russian presence is preventing a purge, plain and simple, a bloody violent purge and also fighting for control of areas but because it is Russia it's bad, it's invasion, it's occupation, when the US does it it's bringing democracy. Funny though, that some see Russia as still the old Soviet union If Russia's presence prevents a civil war it was worth it for that alone. I have no doubt the nationalists will try initiate fighting as they have done with the protests but unfortunately for them there is nothing the US can do and certainly f**k all little Britain can do, none of the major military powers even consider Britain a power since the 2nd world war. I am glad that there is someone to temper the nationalists because it will mean less Ukrainian deaths, the US and EU will idly sit by and the media will be very quiet as the nationalists carry out their purge if the Russians did not intervene. We'd have war in Syria right now had Russia not got involved, for whatever reasons they still prevented the US from starting yet another war on fabricated evidence. The bottom line is there is no legit government in control in Ukraine. Just a gang of criminals and nazi skinheads. I'd sooner ask Putin for help myself before accepting the rule of that kind of brainless power hungry racist ****ers.
No puppet states? You mean like the two created from Georgian territory? The one carved from Moldova? Now Crimea. Lots of territories in Russia want independence but fear retribution. Belarus is being pressured into being taken over. You keep saying civil war brewing but there was zero evidence of that before Russia got involved. Civil war means when people of one country fight themselves. Russia invading is not a civil war. Its not the same as the USSR. USSR a handful of men in one party held power and the country was isolated and impoverished. The new Russia is one dictator with all the power. The borders are open and the dictator has lots of money. Current Russia is more dangerous because single man has power. Link to one article from before Russian invasion where there was threat of civil war (other than weird als attack on protestors or his impeachment). There are none. Russia should invade Finland to stop the civil war there. I say civil war is brewing in Finland. Russia is blocking Crimean military bases how can you say they are not invading? 75% of Russians claim the invasion of Crimea is unjust and Russia should butt out. Yet you think its OK because it sticks one to the EU.
What you are talking about with puppet states is in fact previously owned territories with significant ethnically Russian people. Take Viipuri in Russia. It was Finland's from 1812 to 1945, practically in 1939 but officially in 1945. There little if any Finns there. If Russia somehow allowed that back into Finland then you'd have mostly Russian people, now if some militarised nationalists took over the government with militias, yeah not protestors, I seen the footage in ranks under orders, they were not angry protestors those were en masse out in Kiev but the front lines, the shield walls and well armed men behind them were not a random milling crowd, they were organised and commanded, so if someone like that took over Finland and Russia was close by I reckon the district of Viipuri would request Russian troops to protect them, it would be a natural reaction, you have seen the same in the Crimea, remember these people voted in a government, it was forced out violently and replaced by no elected officials. Is it not right that the people who chose their leader to reject the legitimacy of this gang that just took over the country, let alone the polar ideologies that will obviously result in some harsh **** going down, we've seen it all before, the west will watch Russia and the nationalists will do as they please unwatched and unreported on just like in Libya where serious amounts of killing went unreported. If you read my post, Russia by agreement can have up to 25,000 troops in the Crimea. The elected president and government asked for their help. In any other country supporting the nationalists the nationalists would be criminals, they would never tolerate a political movement instigating violent insurrection in a bid to take power. How would that be handled in the UK, US amongst other countries. Build a catapult across from Westminster or Congress ans fire it and see what happens. Again about Russia blocking Crimean bases, they had an agreement that was recognised by the elected government, are you saying the nationalists are a legitimate government? Half of Ukraine disagrees. Lets make a comparison for the laugh, not so funny though. Ukraine - Nationalist movement forcibly takes power, installs cronies into government. Backed by US EU. Bahrain - Population over 70% Shia. They have been protesting and rioting because they want the Sunni Monarchy gone, over 70%, pretty legitimate vote. People violently repressed police squads hit homes in the night and just take people. Many killed. Monarchy Supported by the US and UK, Bahrain Monarchy are actually paying customer of CNN, they pay for a positive image in the region, CNN have many despot clients who pay for "coverage" Shouldn't they all be supporting the just protestors in Bahrain, not giving the king guns to shoot people with No one gives a **** about Bahrain, but if Russia for some reason send troops there then BOOM! Even though the US has been giving the monarchy the weapons and training to suppress the people it matters not RUSSIA is here, run in fear, the ruskies are coming. please log in to view this image
Here we have the terrible sight of the Russian invasion as a Russian naval ship entering the Naval port in Crimea. Oh the terror, look at those people cowering in fear from the Ruskies. please log in to view this image And here we have the much more civilised NATO intervention in Iraq and the obvious benefits for all Iraqis. please log in to view this image Libya anyone? More democracy. please log in to view this image This was what Libya was like before Libyans were saved from this hell please log in to view this image Yep, those ruskies are Evil and the EU and US are great.
US playing Ukraine today, hopefully nothing goes wrong ( they are playing in Cyprus but still, some nut jobs out there).
Even if he hadn't been legally impeached by parliament (as he was) he still does not have the authority under Ukrainian constitution. Russian troops do not have authority to mobilise at will outside military bases or take over government facilities.
no. and that's my point. We're on the same side here (I think!). Who the **** do we think we are? We held the Americans' coats whilst they kicked the **** out of the Iraqis and Afghans and now we think we tell Russia what to do on its borders. Let's say the six counties became part of the Irish Rebuplic, then the Dublin government decided to install a fundamentalist, Spanish Inquisition-style Roman catholic theocracy throughout the land - I think we'd be back in Belfast quicker than a fart after a vindaloo to 'protect ethnic British' interests. a wobbly analogy, but you get my point. Likewise, do you think the US would stand by and watch if Canada introduced Sharia Law?
Which civilians are the British opening fire on then? (Not that I particularly agree or disagree with the point your making lol)
Oh I've just realised from other comments that this was a reference to our involvement in the Middle East?
Milk I am not anti EU, well I am But I have always been, I always saw it as smaller nations giving up their sovereignty and even the larger ones too they still get the say though. Union my arse, one slave fits all more like. The EU has hindered countries recovery from financial crisis by lending money and imposing austerity rather than let capitalism take it's course, the weak die and the strong survive. What the EU did was give the weak an exoskeleton as in continually funded failed institutions. Greece should have just went bust because they would have hit rock bottom and would be coming back now, same for Spain, Ireland one of the richest per capita in the world, now in debt for 3-4 generations and not one of those people owed anyone **** but being in the f**king EU made sure that is how it played out. f**k you EU, f**k you big time with your funny money that isn't worth ****. Merkel has done peacefully what Hitler never managed to achieve with military might.
