Moyes

[Teessidemackem]

I appreciate the fact his hands are tied with regards to what team he can pick due to our injuries. Our first choice midfield should be Catts, Kirchoff and NDong with McNair as 4th choice, instead of playing Seb, Jack and Denayer (who should be playing cb with Kone).

One thing that is bugging me though and I think Moyes has alot to answer for is how HE spent the little money he had available.

NDong 13.5m
PAPY 8M
McNair 4.5m
Love 2.5m

= 28.5m.

Some people keep harping on about how he didnt have alot of time to plan who he wanted to buy etc, but that is a shocking way to blow 28.5m in my opinion when you look at that list of players.
He then followed that up by singing Denayer (decent player),Manquillo and Januzaj on loan who have both been awful.

We also still only have 1 Leftback in our squad and he looks like hes on his way.

 

[jdsafc]

NDong is definitely a strange one - a big risk. Blowing our budget on inexperience is questionable
Papy - I think that was a done deal before Moyes got appointed. He pulled the plug on the Mikah Richards deal, but maybe this one was too far along...
McNair - just starting to come good when he got his injury
Love - I thought he was £0.5m, and looks like he will be a good player

 

[Teessidemackem]

NDong is definitely a strange one - a big risk. Blowing our budget on inexperience is questionable
Papy - I think that was a done deal before Moyes got appointed. He pulled the plug on the Mikah Richards deal, but maybe this one was too far along...
McNair - just starting to come good when he got his injury
Love - I thought he was £0.5m, and looks like he will be a good player

McNair and love signed for a combined fee of 7m. Correct me if im wrong?

We then have the Khazri situation. We have next to no creativity or goal threat and yet he still chooses to keep him out the team?

 

[jdsafc]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/37034471
Had a quick google - £5.5m says the above link.....but reports can conflict

I must admit that I find the Khazri situation strange based on his effectiveness last season, but Moyes sees him in training, and makes his decisions there

 

[Teessidemackem]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/37034471
Had a quick google - £5.5m says the above link.....but reports can conflict

I must admit that I find the Khazri situation strange based on his effectiveness last season, but Moyes sees him in training, and makes his decisions there

I just had a quick look on Ssn and it says 6m. Even so thats still about 27m spent and 2 loan signings (i wont include Denayer), spent on players that have made no impact on our team whatsoever?

McNair and Love probably will end up decent players especially if/when we go down, but we needed players to come in and make an instant impact, we dont have time to nurish players, our squads too weak.
Same goes for Ndong. Hes only 22 and very raw. It beggers belief that we spend 13.5m on him!

 

[marcusblackcat]

I appreciate the fact his hands are tied with regards to what team he can pick due to our injuries. Our first choice midfield should be Catts, Kirchoff and NDong with McNair as 4th choice, instead of playing Seb, Jack and Denayer (who should be playing cb with Kone).

One thing that is bugging me though and I think Moyes has alot to answer for is how HE spent the little money he had available.

NDong 13.5m
PAPY 8M
McNair 4.5m
Love 2.5m

= 28.5m.

Some people keep harping on about how he didnt have alot of time to plan who he wanted to buy etc, but that is a shocking way to blow 28.5m in my opinion when you look at that list of players.
He then followed that up by singing Denayer (decent player),Manquillo and Januzaj on loan who have both been awful.

We also still only have 1 Leftback in our squad and he looks like hes on his way.

Figures are different depending on what you look at - @Brian Creampie said the other day that we've only actually paid £1m up front for N'Dong - structured deals and so forth. (Brian please correct me if I've misquoted you there as I'm going from memory)

I though McNair & Love were £5m total according to numerous reports as well. But I don't argue that they're worth that - I truly think they are money well spent. They weren't bought as "now" players as you say, moyes hands are tied pretty tightly at the moment.

Djilobodji - with Kone, was getting a decent partnership and they were looking a decent pairing. Since he's been put with O'Shea, neither of them look capable! I won't write him off yet - he's been no worse than Denayer over the last 4 games TBH!

I don't think we've spent £28m or anywhere near that - I reckon we probably haven't spent more than around £10m on fees if that. Wages are our problem not transfer fees

 

[Teessidemackem]

Figures are different depending on what you look at - @Brian Creampie said the other day that we've only actually paid £1m up front for N'Dong - structured deals and so forth. (Brian please correct me if I've misquoted you there as I'm going from memory)

I though McNair & Love were £5m total according to numerous reports as well. But I don't argue that they're worth that - I truly think they are money well spent. They weren't bought as "now" players as you say, moyes hands are tied pretty tightly at the moment.

Djilobodji - with Kone, was getting a decent partnership and they were looking a decent pairing. Since he's been put with O'Shea, neither of them look capable! I won't write him off yet - he's been no worse than Denayer over the last 4 games TBH!

I don't think we've spent £28m or anywhere near that - I reckon we probably haven't spent more than around £10m on fees if that. Wages are our problem not transfer fees

Not sure how true that is about Ndong? Why would they let him go for 1m?

Like i said im not saying Mcnair and Love wont end up being worth that value, but we dont have the time, squad or money to sign players and wait for them to develop.

I disagree about Papy aswell. He makes Anton Ferdinand look like Franco Baresi.

 

[jdsafc]

I just had a quick look on Ssn and it says 6m. Even so thats still about 27m spent and 2 loan signings (i wont include Denayer), spent on players that have made no impact on our team whatsoever?

McNair and Love probably will end up decent players especially if/when we go down, but we needed players to come in and make an instant impact, we dont have time to nurish players, our squads too weak.
Same goes for Ndong. Hes only 22 and very raw. It beggers belief that we spend 13.5m on him!

Agreed, it has been disappointing to say the least.
When things were going well for us at the tail end of last season Sam was able to keep playing the same team (more or less)
That has not happened at all this season - mainly due to injuries (but replacing Kaboul with Djilabodji hasn't helped).
So people compare then with now and draw the conclusion that Moyes is the reason.

Personally I think Moyes is a good pragmatic manager who will build a team for us. He has very little room for manoeuvre due to FFP restrictions, so we will probably incur relegation during this rebuild

 

[marcusblackcat]

Not sure how true that is about Ndong? Why would they let him go for 1m?

Like i said im not saying Mcnair and Love wont end up being worth that value, but we dont have the time, squad or money to sign players and wait for them to develop.

I disagree about Papy aswell. He makes Anton Ferdinand look like Franco Baresi.

They didn't - if it is a structured deal, it'll be like the deal that took Bent to Villa - £6m a year for 4 years I believe it was so they'll get their £13.5m but over the course of a few seasons (I think - as I say Bri seems to be much more clued up on this stuff than me)

Papy was looking every bit a decent signing IMO before the ACON - him and Kone were looking solid at the back and it's only since that partnership has been broken up that he's gone back to what he looked at the start of the season. I see a player in him - he was winning almost everything with Kone there but him and O'Shea seem to just not be able to defend together. Just an opinion mind as yours is!

 

[Teessidemackem]

They didn't - if it is a structured deal, it'll be like the deal that took Bent to Villa - £6m a year for 4 years I believe it was so they'll get their £13.5m but over the course of a few seasons (I think - as I say Bri seems to be much more clued up on this stuff than me)

Papy was looking every bit a decent signing IMO before the ACON - him and Kone were looking solid at the back and it's only since that partnership has been broken up that he's gone back to what he looked at the start of the season. I see a player in him - he was winning almost everything with Kone there but him and O'Shea seem to just not be able to defend together. Just an opinion mind as yours is!

If thats true about Ndong then it is still an expensive risk. We could be finding ourselves in the Championship next year with no Sky money and having to use some of our budget paying an installment of 13.5m on a player that will have a market value of about 5m, which would have been a more realistic fee for us to have paid for him in the first place.

 

[clockstander]

Circumstances have broken up the team, and so far, the replacements brought in are way below the required standard.

 

[DAPARKERSAFC]

The issue is for me, is the plan to stick with Moyes no matter what happens?

I can't see anything other than three defeats in our next three games and the Moyes out calls will grow stronger.

We really need Bain or Short to come and back their man publically and try and get the fans back on board.

Given our injuries and lack of January investment I'm almost resigned to relegation but it's a hell of a project next year for whoever is manager.

We get the parachute payments and if we get what we should for Pickford Kone and others we could have the biggest budget in years to build a team from the ground up around some good youngsters in Gooch Asoro Honeyman Watmore etc.

Plus the wage bill will be pretty much wiped clean.

Don't want to go down but long term I think it could benefit us.

 

[clockstander]

Shorts record of back room appointments does not make me confident, and Bain has done nothing yet other than make a very bland statement that I could have written.

 

[flandersmackem]

I would question his 2 biggest buys...Papy and Ndong. Regardless of how its structured SAFC are committed to about 20 million give or take. No way on God's earth are they worth that. I just don't rate Papy at all...if/when we go down, lets see how many takers from the premier league queue up to take him off our hands. Ndong is not so bad..but about 5 mill' at the most. All that said, our chances next season will be better by staying with the same manager.

 

[Teessidemackem]

I wonder what kind of loan fees we paid for Manquillo and Januzaj?

 

[Tel (they/them)]

I wonder what kind of loan fees we paid for Manquillo and Januzaj?

Adnan went to Dortmund for nowt, with no option to buy. I'd imagine you got the same deal, you tried to get him permanently but we wouldn't sell him permanently. That's worked out well for you really.

 

[Teessidemackem]

Adnan went to Dortmund for nowt, with no option to buy. I'd imagine you got the same deal, you tried to get him permanently but we wouldn't sell him permanently. That's worked out well for you really.

Id pay to send him back to free up his loan space though ha.

 

[Tel (they/them)]

Id pay to send him back to free up his loan space though ha.

Seems that's a unanimous vote.

I'm not certain but it says two season long loans domestic allowed, is there no option to add a 3rd since it's not a full season? I've brought this up a few times now, nobody seems to know and it doesn't bother me enough to go and look myself.

I'd like him back too, to be honest, I'd rather he was back with our kids than involved in the toxicity that your club owner has created. He'll be used as a scapegoat, but your old man hit the nail on the head for me, the two that deserved fingered for all of this mess is Quinn and more so the owner.

Blaggin' it, is exactly what Quinn attempted to do as chairman, he's not qualified, never will be, he's found his level now, chatting **** on TV.

Perhaps a little brutal for the happy clappers to swallow, it's just my observation, doesn't necessarily mean anything does it?

 

[red&white wanderer]

I appreciate the fact his hands are tied with regards to what team he can pick due to our injuries. Our first choice midfield should be Catts, Kirchoff and NDong with McNair as 4th choice, instead of playing Seb, Jack and Denayer (who should be playing cb with Kone).

One thing that is bugging me though and I think Moyes has alot to answer for is how HE spent the little money he had available.

NDong 13.5m
PAPY 8M
McNair 4.5m
Love 2.5m

= 28.5m.

Some people keep harping on about how he didnt have alot of time to plan who he wanted to buy etc, but that is a shocking way to blow 28.5m in my opinion when you look at that list of players.
He then followed that up by singing Denayer (decent player),Manquillo and Januzaj on loan who have both been awful.

We also still only have 1 Leftback in our squad and he looks like hes on his way.

Dead right but another of my concerns of him is he repeatedly blames player mistakes. These happen to unfocused unmotivated players as do injuries - half hearted players get injuries.
Moyes may need to think about how he uses the media and get the players focussed

 

[Nacho]

Seems that's a unanimous vote.

I'm not certain but it says two season long loans domestic allowed, is there no option to add a 3rd since it's not a full season? I've brought this up a few times now, nobody seems to know and it doesn't bother me enough to go and look myself.

I'd like him back too, to be honest, I'd rather he was back with our kids than involved in the toxicity that your club owner has created. He'll be used as a scapegoat, but your old man hit the nail on the head for me, the two that deserved fingered for all of this mess is Quinn and more so the owner.

Blaggin' it, is exactly what Quinn attempted to do as chairman, he's not qualified, never will be, he's found his level now, chatting **** on TV.

Perhaps a little brutal for the happy clappers to swallow, it's just my observation, doesn't necessarily mean anything does it?

I don't see Adnan being made a scapegoat and neither should Quinn be, despite your hatred of him. Is it because he used to play for City? Bit unnecessary for you to slag him off the way you do on here in my opinion.

If Januzaj can't handle adverse conditions then he's not much use as a footballer, I'm sure he'll be fine here. Not like he's going to be emotionally scarred by anything more than his own poor performances.