Mick McCarthy - discussion

[Oldsparkey]

Right man at the right time - probably coming in too late to be honest. Could have arrived here well before Christmas especially after that dreadful home Swansea game, but would we any better off than we are right now given more recent events?

After Mick's first half dozen games we knew we weren't going down - now after his last half dozen games we know we're not going up. So where does that leave us for next season?

To me, managing a team during a game at this level needs more than just standing on the touchline shouting at your players for 90 minutes. In his first game with us at Barnsley, we were 2-0 down. He recognised the problem and switched to 3 CB's at half time. It was a success and we came away with a point that seemed unlikely at half time and he's stuck with that format ever since.

Has his lack of action on the hoof during recent games contributed to our playoff chances slipping away? To be fair they were non existent when he arrived on the scene, and to be even in the frame a few games ago was brilliant. Is it just the squad or the manager utilisation of what's available that's the problem?

Obviously Mick has got his contract, albeit a bit prematurely in the opinion of some, so what can we expect from him and Connor?

 

[Masky]

Average team boss at a very average club, Championship is a comfortable watch for us fans, nothing expected really! Why didn’t they hold off to keep his hunger! Amazing blunders by those who should know better in their positions! Team boss for sale, hurry because Celtic are eying him up!

 

[irishbluebird]

I think we have to remember that Mick is playing with the players he inherited and it really is too soon to judge him. I agree that the hoofball tactics he has employed are not going to get us anywhere fast but maybe they were needed to get us clear of relegation. However we now need to try and start playing some proper football, like passing the ball to feet. If this means dropping Moore so that we can attempt to play the ball on the ground more so be it. For the rest of the season I would also like to see some of the developing players given a chance before we enter the transfer market. We simply cannot keep playing the way we have been if we are to push for promotion next season. Many have commented on here about how suboptimal our midfield are and I agree that that's an area in need of remedial action (among others).

Then of course there's the financial aspect. Let's face it money rules in todays game. Where would the so called big clubs be without deep pocketed backers? I wonder if we would have stayed longer in the Premier League if we had appropriate funds. Unless Mr Tan can be convinced to increase his funding (and I think we should be grateful for all that he has done), or if someone else can be persuaded to invest, we'll be talking the same old, same old this time next year. And what are the board doing to help push us forward? Surely they can work harder for the club and it's supporters. Apart from Tottenham Hotspur I believe that Cardiff are the only team in the Football League that doesn't have its ground named after a sponsor. Now there may be a reason for that, although I can't think of one, but surely stadium sponsorship could bring in some much needed funds. If Disney want to invest a few million and call if the Mickey Mouse stadium go for it. And after all the money we have lost through the turnstiles during this pandemic we really need to step up to the touchline and increase our income drastically if we are to improve our overall present situation.

But still, we live in hope. What else can we do?

 

[BluefromBridgend]

Agreed, now it is mathematically impossible for us to go down and the play offs are a nearly forgotten dream then why not give Moore a bit of a rest, and bring in some younger players in their favoured positions e.g. Sang in midfield, Colwill as a playmaker plus Watters up top and the other under 23's who have had a good year, Evans and Davies.

As for naming the stadium, despite MM's drop off recently if the managerial changes hadn't been made then the Donald Ducked Stadium would have been more appropriate than Mickey Mouse.

 

[ninian opinion]

City brought him in to stop the rot. He did.

It was described as a short term appointment with the stated understanding his position would be reviewed at the end of the season.

It was surely not the intent to make the decision - a hugely instrumental one for the future of the club - before the season ended, and certainly not on the back of a massively successful new manager bounce (for which he rightly got plaudits but should not have got anything else).

That was a major error and was yet another terrible decision by non football people on our board. It’s staggering how a multi million pound football business is run by people with little football nous. Would Dalman & Choo allow lay people to make managerial decisions in their businesses??

Apart from a well earned win at swansea the season has deteriorated since he was given a new contract.

In his defence he inherited a squad of hard working but uninspiring players and has had injury problems with his defenders and there’s an issue with the one genuine game winner we have (Tomlin).

I can only assume that if we humble fans can see the clear flaws, deficiencies and shortcomings of our squad that McCarthy can, and will look to do something about it in the pre season.

The same applies to the tactics on the pitch. Are we ever going to see a City team ever again play from back to front through midfield on the floor with width?

This season was shot when we lost to Forest. Wednesday away was the time to blood the kids and play a different format. McCarthy got the team selection all wrong. He made no subs when we were 3 down. It was like Coventry and Wycombe away all over again.

Then we had yesterday’s second half which was terrible. Blackburn changed their team dramatically but McCarthy did nothing of note.

We’ll get tanked at Reading and Brentford for sure. Birmingham will be fighting for survival as will Rotherham and Wycombe. Could we end our season with our last win as long ago as swansea?

So onto next season. I reiterate we know what type of player is needed in several positions and we all know what style of football is needed in this division BUT does MM?

He’s a top bloke, a real character but he’s stubborn and set in his ways. Will he change? Does he think he has to change? And pertinently who does he have to answer to - who’ll lay into him if he gets a bad start to the season? Who can he discuss any issues with?

In conclusion, it was a hasty and wrong decision to give him a 2 year contract and as it stands we will struggle next season unless there’s major surgery in the squad and a more modern approach by McCarthy.

 

[Oldsparkey]

@ninian opinion So I'm not alone in thinking there might be an issue between Mick and Tomlin. No evidence other than both are strong characters in their own way and probably view the game from different standpoints.

The Tomlin/Warnock relationship was never a bed of roses. Mick is very much in the Warnock mould and I doubt Tomlin has changed his more colourful side and will voice his opinions.

Tomlin's injuries/operation/recovery process was never going to be easy to manage on the physical side, but it could be as much to do with the diverse characteristics of player and manager that's a problem.

 

[Hilts24]

Weve enough issues then read drop Moore.

Hes been unlucky with injuries to Bagan and Bennett.

We could do with Ng on the right and a genuine left back. Id then play Ralls who if on form is our best central midfielder by a distance alongside Sang.

Losing Morrison has been a huge loss as well.

 

[Oldsparkey]

If Ralls is our best midfielder by a distance, that says it all - mind you, you're probably right.

Unless we get a huge change of direction this summer, prepare yourself for a Championship slog where we see how many opposition players we can cripple.

That may sound harsh, but the reality is we have no ball playing creative players for the middle of the park so that's our only approach.

Unless that changes, it'll be more of the same with Ralls, Vaulks and Pack destroying everything and creating nothing.

 

[irishbluebird]

Tomlin's injuries/operation/recovery process was never going to be easy to manage on the physical side, but it could be as much to do with the diverse characteristics of player and manager that's a problem.

I see Tomlin was missing again for the U 23's with a 'sore groin'.!!

 

[Oldsparkey]

I see Tomlin was missing again for the U 23's with a 'sore groin'.!!

Got a feeling Tommo has played his last game for City despite having another year left on his contract.

Maybe completely wrong, but the chemistry between him and Mick doesn't seem right. Perhaps it's best for all to move on.

 

[william5551]

I would get rid of Ralls,Vaulks ,Pack, Tomlin,Murphy,and Hoillet,dump the lot and start again,they must all be on good money,so lets get people in with a lot speed and a football brain,and lets stop playing this boring slow I think they call it football,the season is over so at least give some of our youngsters a chance so at least we would know what we have for next season,and who we would want to bring in.Just saying.

 

[BluefromBridgend]

Hoilett's contract is up so a no brainer.

Not so simple for the others as they all have ongoing contracts. We can try to sell them assuming willing buyers able to pay their wages. If not we can offer to pay up their contracts but that becomes expensive for the club and places limitations on the club's finances for acquiring the replacements needed.

However we will always need some grunt in the middle of the park as a midfield of "artists" would quickly feel the physical edge of the opposition.

Personally I would keep Vaulks as he offers other things in terms of his shooting ability and long throws.

As Sparks has said, Tomlin could well be on the way out and I would get rid of Murphy asap.

Could be the right time for Ralls to move on and would be attractive to other Championship clubs.

Pack seems to have MM's ear so could stay.

It can never be an all or nothing strategy but if we can move on 4 of those 6 that would be good progress and free up good cash.

Time will tell.

I have said elsewhere the young guns should now be given more opportunities over the rest of the season although perhaps to a lesser degree v Reading and Brentford as we don't want their confidence rocked in potential stuffings.

 

[Oldsparkey]

Mick has made the right noises about our youngsters coming through and followed that up by involving the likes of Colwill, Patten. Evans and Davies in the 20 man matchday squads.

It's understandable that whilst the possibility of a playoff place remained, there was little chance they would get on the pitch, especially given his general reluctance to change his chosen starting 11 anyway.

Makes sense to give them a go at the arse end of the season - then we can make some informed decisions in the summer.

 

[DaiJones]

I agree with BfB if we are going to keep a mid-field stopper I'd go for Vaulks too, I've been a fan of Ralls but I think it's time he moves on.

As Sparks said I can't see MM bringing the young guns in until there is no chance of us getting in the top 6.

The last 3 games against Wycombe, Brum & Rotherham I'd give than all at least half a hour on the pitch each game.

 

[ninian opinion]

I would get rid of Ralls,Vaulks ,Pack, Tomlin,Murphy,and Hoillet,dump the lot and start again,they must all be on good money,so lets get people in with a lot speed and a football brain,and lets stop playing this boring slow I think they call it football,the season is over so at least give some of our youngsters a chance so at least we would know what we have for next season,and who we would want to bring in.Just saying.

You’ve read my mind totally 100% as well as Flint

 

[Oldsparkey]

You’ve read my mind totally 100% as well as Flint

On the Flint question, it depends very much which way MM wants to go. He seems to regard him as an essential central figure. Morro adds the same sort of solidity and strength. Neither has pace and Nelson is regarded as the mobile member of the back 3 providing cover across the back line. I doubt Mick is going to go out on a limb with unknown characters in the heart of defence.

Let's face it, Flint is never going to morph into another Van Dijk, but still think he has a lot to offer at Championship level. Ready made pacey and efffective CB's are thin on the ground in our price range. We are never going to fork out for a Prem standard CB, so unless we are going to find another Nelson type in the lower leagues, Flinty will be here and in the heart of it next season.

If we're serious about progress playing football on the floor, then the CB's are the least of our problems. All available resources should be poured into midfield where we are, and will continue to struggle. We need the skills to get the ball down and play through the opposition instead just of over them.

 

[BluefromBridgend]

On the Flint question, it depends very much which way MM wants to go. He seems to regard him as an essential central figure. Morro adds the same sort of solidity and strength. Neither has pace and Nelson is regarded as the mobile member of the back 3 providing cover across the back line. I doubt Mick is going to go out on a limb with unknown characters in the heart of defence.

Let's face it, Flint is never going to morph into another Van Dijk, but still think he has a lot to offer at Championship level. Ready made pacey and efffective CB's are thin on the ground in our price range. We are never going to fork out for a Prem standard CB, so unless we are going to find another Nelson type in the lower leagues, Flinty will be here and in the heart of it next season.

If we're serious about progress playing football on the floor, then the CB's are the least of our problems. All available resources should be poured into midfield where we are, and will continue to struggle. We need the skills to get the ball down and play through the opposition instead just of over them.

Fully agree with most of that but some grunt and physical skills are also needed especially at Championship level which is why we cannot afford to try and offload our whole midfield - at cost as none of their contracts except for Hoilett end this summer.

If some can be sold to reduce the wage bill and create capital for further player investment then fine but just to try and dump 7 senior players and replace with better is not a practical solution. Some continuity is essential.

 

[ninian opinion]

On the Flint question, it depends very much which way MM wants to go. He seems to regard him as an essential central figure. Morro adds the same sort of solidity and strength. Neither has pace and Nelson is regarded as the mobile member of the back 3 providing cover across the back line. I doubt Mick is going to go out on a limb with unknown characters in the heart of defence.

Let's face it, Flint is never going to morph into another Van Dijk, but still think he has a lot to offer at Championship level. Ready made pacey and efffective CB's are thin on the ground in our price range. We are never going to fork out for a Prem standard CB, so unless we are going to find another Nelson type in the lower leagues, Flinty will be here and in the heart of it next season.

If we're serious about progress playing football on the floor, then the CB's are the least of our problems. All available resources should be poured into midfield where we are, and will continue to struggle. We need the skills to get the ball down and play through the opposition instead just of over them.

In a nutshell on Flint:
He only is effective in a back 3 with 2 capable partners.
In a back 2 he is a liability.

We have seen too many goals conceded in recent games due to poor defending. Flint has failed to step up in Morrison’s absence with his shortcomings all to easy to see.

Yes it is commonly agreed a reconstruction of midfield is desperately required but the defence frailties recently seen need to be looked at as well.

 

[Oldsparkey]

In a nutshell on Flint:
He only is effective in a back 3 with 2 capable partners.
In a back 2 he is a liability.

We have seen too many goals conceded in recent games due to poor defending. Flint has failed to step up in Morrison’s absence with his shortcomings all to easy to see.

Yes it is commonly agreed a reconstruction of midfield is desperately required but the defence frailties recently seen need to be looked at as well.

Nin - I suppose it's a question of priorities. If we're going to start rebuilding to play out from the back, then apart from NG, we'd we might as well look for a new team. It isn't going to happen, and as much as we all agree Flint and Morrison are slow over the ground, they'll both be pivotal players next season under McCarthy.

A forward thinking midfield unit will take a lot of pressure off the back line simply becasue all we're doing now is trying to shore it up with defensive midfield players because we have little other option.

We have no flair nor vision, and opposition sides are just not frightened of getting caught out by some quick passing movement. They come on to us with little fear except for the long ball over the top to Moore - keep him quiet and we're stuffed.

 

[ninian opinion]

Nin - I suppose it's a question of priorities. If we're going to start rebuilding to play out from the back, then apart from NG, we'd we might as well look for a new team. It isn't going to happen, and as much as we all agree Flint and Morrison are slow over the ground, they'll both be pivotal players next season under McCarthy.

A forward thinking midfield unit will take a lot of pressure off the back line simply becasue all we're doing now is trying to shore it up with defensive midfield players because we have little other option.

We have no flair nor vision, and opposition sides are just not frightened of getting caught out by some quick passing movement. They come on to us with little fear except for the long ball over the top to Moore - keep him quiet and we're stuffed.

With you totally on the imperative need to sort out midfield but I was just pointing out the defensive frailties which have surfaced since our win at swansea.
There’s no guarantee Morrison/Nelson will be always fit so we do need cover as Flint isn’t good enough to be the main central defender. Is Brown good enough?
For all the good a new midfield will do, it will be wasted if the back door isn’t shut (to use a Dave Jones phrase)!!