Mexit

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Other than breaking the cycle of constant hiring and firing, what possible argument is there for keeping Moyes long term? He's shown limited tactical innovation, the players don't appear to have been drilled to do the basic technical aspects of the game, and he's shown no evidence of the reputation he gained for being good in the transfer market.
There is little point in sacking him now and expecting to stay up but next season in the championship will require major changes in approach and attitude or we will emulate Villa (or worse) and stay down there.
 
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The Norton Cat said:
Other than breaking the cycle of constant hiring and firing, what possible argument is there for keeping Moyes long term? He's shown limited tactical innovation, the players don't appear to have been drilled to do the basic technical aspects of the game, and he's shown no evidence of the reputation he gained for being good in the transfer market.
There is little point in sacking him now and expecting to stay up but next season in the championship will require major changes in approach and attitude or we will emulate Villa (or worse) and stay down there.
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You make it very hard to disagree with you Norton on this point.

Except sacking managers at this point has worked for us in the past. Quite a few times.

The only thing that worries me more about being relegated with Moyes as our manager is sticking with him hoping to come straight back up.
 
The Norton Cat said:
Other than breaking the cycle of constant hiring and firing, what possible argument is there for keeping Moyes long term? He's shown limited tactical innovation, the players don't appear to have been drilled to do the basic technical aspects of the game, and he's shown no evidence of the reputation he gained for being good in the transfer market.
There is little point in sacking him now and expecting to stay up but next season in the championship will require major changes in approach and attitude or we will emulate Villa (or worse) and stay down there.
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Can't disagree with any of that, I'm just thoroughly sick of sacking one dud after another, we may as well just stick with one dud and give them a proper go. One positive is Moyes has shown willingness to bring our young players on, could count for a lot in the future.
 
Burly Hurley said:
Vince I agree with you mate. To some extent.

I'm sick of changing managers almost every bloody season with 10-12 games to go.

At the moment I don't think Short will get rid of Moyes. And that would be a first for him. Not sacking the boss with a dozen games to go.

At the same time of all the managers he has got rid of, I think this one is the least likeliest of all of those before him who could bring us back up first time.

That's what depresses me most about our current situation. I think we'll go down this time, Short will stick with Moyes and he isn't the man to bring us back up straightaway.
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I hope your wrong
I believe we must have some sort of faith in him
Yeh I'm not happy with the way things are going but I can't see an answer
 
SAFC Nacho said:
Can't disagree with any of that, I'm just thoroughly sick of sacking one dud after another, we may as well just stick with one dud and give them a proper go. One positive is Moyes has shown willingness to bring our young players on, could count for a lot in the future.
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I would of thought if they are a dud they want sacking asap otherwise you are saying to them take us to oblivion mate we will just ignore your results.
 
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rooch 3 said:
I would of thought if they are a dud they want sacking asap otherwise you are saying to them take us to oblivion mate we will just ignore your results.
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They're all duds that we get (apart from Allardyce) so if we sacked Moyes and replaced him I've got no doubt it'd be with someone who turned out to be ****e even if they did keep us up. We can't hire and fire a manager every ****ing season it's too expensive and overall a ridiculous way to go about things.

This viewpoint is based on the opinion that I think Moyes is doing...just about ok, if I thought he was genuinely awful I'd want rid to be fair.
 
Much of what has been said about Moyes was said about Sam and his lack of football tactics until he kept us up. I remember the great outcry after the 1-1 draw against NUFC last March when his style of protecting a one goal lead was condemned for us not getting the three points. Moreover, we never got out of the bottom three last year until the last three games.

Appointing a successful manager is nowt but a lottery as we all know but conveniently forgetting some of what he has put up with in injuries etc is a bit convenient to justify some of the arguments against him.
 
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Vincemac said:
I hope your wrong
I believe we must have some sort of faith in him
Yeh I'm not happy with the way things are going but I can't see an answer
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I don't believe I'm being negative about Moyes mate and I know you didn't say that.

Faith won't help us. Doesn't usually. Ever. All this KTF just washes over me.

I just don't believe in him.

I don't believe the players do either. But what do I know.

I don't think we should get rid of him though we may well do.

I don't believe another manager would save us (though I'd love to see Eddie Howe have a go at our last 10 games).

What I do think is that if we do go down Moyes is definitely, 100%, NOT the man for us in the Championship.
 
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Vincemac said:
I really don't know
But now we have him I think we have nothing to loose by giving him time
I just hope he can turn us round
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You'd be going against history though Vince.

Changing managers has kept us up each time we've done it the last 10 years or so.

I'm not saying it's right. It just is.
 
SAFC Nacho said:
I can see a way out in that one win and we're only in the relegation zone by goal difference, we haven't been cut adrift whatsoever and even if we had been we have a knack of coming back from the brink.

Moyes isn't doing as well as I'd hoped but I don't see him as a disaster either. If we go down I'd keep him and he'd be the best manager in the Championship with one of the best sides so we'd have a solid chance of coming back up.
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The main problem for me is that Dour Dave has little self belief himself as he had'nt got over his last 2 failures. The team don't seem to have any focus (Southampton at home -we did'nt have a plan to get in their penalty area -shocking ) then at 2-0 down takes O'Shea off to be replaced by small Piernaer when we were playing a tall strong physical team.
This lack of tactical nous is terrible.
But I can still see an unexpected win next game.
 
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red&white wanderer said:
The main problem for me is that Dour Dave has little self belief himself as he had'nt got over his last 2 failures. The team don't seem to have any focus (Southampton at home -we did'nt have a plan to get in their penalty area -shocking ) then at 2-0 down takes O'Shea off to be replaced by small Piernaer when we were playing a tall strong physical team.
This lack of tactical nous is terrible.
But I can still see an unexpected win next game.
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You do that a lot Wanderer.

Say its bad bad bad.

But we'll win the next. KTF.

Just doesn't make sense mate.

It's winter and it rains rain's rains.

But I see an unexpected ray of sunshine tomorrow.
 
Burly Hurley said:
You do that a lot Wanderer.

Say its bad bad bad.

But we'll win the next. KTF.

Just doesn't make sense mate.

It's winter and it rains rain's rains.

But I see an unexpected ray of sunshine tomorrow.
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I know but at times by being positive it makes me feel better and we rarely do the expected. To be honest things have been bad most of my time supporting them so It's my default coping skill - I'm certainly not happy. There's are dour report on Moyes on newsnowsunderland page - Opinion (sorry can't post link) Sumup the situation in my view.
But I hope for an unexpected 3pts for us on TV next week - :emoticon-0148-yes:
 
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red&white wanderer said:
I know but at times by being positive it makes me feel better and we rarely do the expected. To be honest things have been bad most of my time supporting them so It's my default coping skill - I'm certainly not happy. There's are dour report on Moyes on newsnowsunderland page - Opinion (sorry can't post link) Sumup the situation in my view.
But I hope for an unexpected 3pts for us on TV next week - :emoticon-0148-yes:
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Its probably just your style of being downbeat or pessimistic without being negative, which ends up expecting 3 points the next game I find a little odd. But if you're expecting 3 points next game at least explain why.

No offense intended mate.
 
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