Loris Karius

[Salah's-left-foot]

From a non-footballing perspective my heart absolutely goes out to this guy.
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He posted this on his Instagram account:
"Haven’t really slept until now... the scenes are still running through my head again and again... I'm infinitely sorry to my teammates, for you fans, and for all the staff. I know that I messed it up with the two mistakes and let you all down. As I said I'd just like to turn back the time but that's not possible. It's even worse as we all felt that we could have beaten Real Madrid and we were in the game for a long time. Thank you to our unbelievable fans who came to Kiev and held my back, even after the game. I don't take that for granted and once again it showed me what a big family we are. Thank you and we will come back stronger."
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The following really got to me personally - "the scenes are still running through my head again and again".

We only have to look back around seven and half years ago with Robert Enke to see what the mental state can lead to for specifically goalkeepers.

After Madrid's third goal part of me was wishing for us to get back and it take it to penalties just for Karius to redeem himself. He may never have another opportunity like last night and this will undoubtedly be one of his biggest regrets for the rest of his life.

I know many are disappointed, but honestly however upset you are I can guarantee you no one is feeling worse than this guy.

Genuinely learnt a lot of lessons last night and one is that once the dust settles - they're just human beings.

 

[Zanjinho]

I've not slated the lad. He was clearly upset and disappointed at the time and after the game. He tried his best but made mistakes, that's called being human.

I feel for him. Trying hard and caring should always be applauded. Not being good enough isn't a reason to attack someone (except Moreno )

 

[luvgonzo]

I felt sorry for him, you could see he genuinly cared and was in a bad place last night and as fans sometimes a player who cares is what we want. Can he come back from this? I don't think so, he isn't good enough is what I think.
Would I like him to?
My heart screams yes my head screams no.

I'm a heart kinda guy.

 

[Tdot]

I mean, before yesterday’s game, regardless of how many people felt he wasn’t the man for the job, he likely felt he was capable.

Tough to have to now live with the fact of how detrimental his performance was.

I’ll say this, one can point the finger at him, and feel that he can no longer be a part of future plans, but only a truly miserable soul (living an existence of misery far beyond just football) is going to leave comments on his Instagram wishing cancer upon his children.

 

[Peej]

He will bounce back I hope. Seen all the goals and the first is just......

Big Nev Southall has been full of support, if he can come back like the big man did after his shocker then he will be ok. If ditched by the club I expect him to skip out of the game.

 

[DirtyFrank]

I was angry last night during match but end of day he's a human being ... I've made errors at work ...being paid more for it doesn't make it deliberate.

I want a better keeper like I want better midfielders.... nothing personal in that.

 

[Mr Beej]

He will bounce back I hope. Seen all the goals and the first is just......

Big Nev Southall has been full of support, if he can come back like the big man did after his shocker then he will be ok. If ditched by the club I expect him to skip out of the game.

Goalkeepers are a breed apart as any mistake can lead directly to a goal unlike anywhere else on the pitch. Big Nev will understand that. It can happen to the best of them.

 

[Muppetfinder General]

Too much drama being made of one performance. And death threats? FFS, have a word. Maybe it was the big game that got to him, maybe it was a freak but he's been improving, he's still only 24 and we'd probably have been beaten with any keeper after Mo went off.

But criticism gets thrown at keepers harder for errors. Rob Green made one error in a draw against the USA in Brazil and got replaced. We went on to draw with Algeria, too, but it was Green who was shamed. He's only had one friendly since.

It wasn't Karius's fault anyway, it was mine. I got woken yesterday at 6.50am with a cramp. Hurt like a bastard, so I got up. Around noon I took a nap and when I woke, an arm fell off my glasses. Not broken, just a screw had come loose. On my way back from the optician's I thought it'd be silly to think bad things come in threes. But there it is, bish, bash and bosh.

 

[The IncREDibles]

At the end of the day mistakes happen so i'm not going to villify him for it. But the performance summed up what we already knew, which is that he simply isn't good enough at this level where every performance is seen by the majority of the media and supporters worldwide.

Let him go back to Mainz or a similar team that isn't so high profile to rebuild his career, then we can move on to signing a keeper worthy of a team that wants to battle on all fronts

 

[DirtyFrank]

He's been a man. He's fronted up.

 

[Zanjinho]

Of course he can bounce back. Lots of players have had extremely poor moments in their career and gone on to become better. Beckham, Seaman, Rooney, etc.

It's one game. Granted it was very high profile game but it's still just one game.

I don't see him leaving Liverpool this summer and I don't think Klopp will have a sudden change of mind based on that one game either. Only time will tell if he's the long term option or not but Klopp will already know!

Edit... worse possible time to have such a stinker though; world stage, everyone watching and he's got the whole summer to think about it before being able to pay his next match.

 

[Sucky]

Just unforgivable.

 

[lfcpower]

Arguably if the club and Klopp had got on the case and found a better keeper after identifying this as a problem area sooner, or at least not so blatantly sweeping it under the carpet and hoping for the best, then this wouldn't have happened as Karius wouldn't have even been playing in the final (if the hypothetical 'very good goalie we should have bought by now' had been fit etc) and we'd have had a true world-class keeper out there. For me this is one of Klopp's flaws, persisting with sub-par, failing (by this I mean not improving or growing in positive ways) players way beyond the time has expired in which they had to prove themselves in this blinkered mode or way of thinking where suddenly they'll come good, in the next match, or maybe the one after, or the one after.

I think we all felt the same about certain players in the final, Karius being one of them, that they were clinging onto a position in the first team by merit of there being nobody better. That's not their fault. Karius didn't walk out onto that pitch intending to make those mistakes. Sure it was infuriating when they happened, total what the hell is this guy thinking and even doing on the pitch moments, but the manager put him out there. Alright, the mistakes were horrendous but the evidence that Klopp amassed to justify Karius as No. 1 has always been weak and it's not like Karius has ever mouthed off or pretended to be anything other than what he is, an ordinary, young keeper, although I'm sure in his own mind he's tried to maintain the belief he can be world-class. I see him as a victim of circumstance and the club/Klopp need to stop with this wait it out kind of attitude with certain positions and bite the bullet and invest in true quality, otherwise the excellent parts of what he is achieving right now will be consistently and forever undermined.

 

[Zanjinho]

Arguably if the club and Klopp had got on the case and found a better keeper after identifying this as a problem area sooner, or at least not so blatantly sweeping it under the carpet and hoping for the best, then this wouldn't have happened as Karius wouldn't have even been playing in the final (if the hypothetical 'very good goalie we should have bought by now' had been fit etc) and we'd have had a true world-class keeper out there. For me this is one of Klopp's flaws, persisting with sub-par, failing (by this I mean not improving or growing in positive ways) players way beyond the time has expired in which they had to prove themselves in this blinkered mode or way of thinking where suddenly they'll come good, in the next match, or maybe the one after, or the one after.

I think we all felt the same about certain players in the final, Karius being one of them, that they were clinging onto a position in the first team by merit of there being nobody better. That's not their fault. Karius didn't walk out onto that pitch intending to make those mistakes. Sure it was infuriating when they happened, total what the hell is this guy thinking and even doing on the pitch moments, but the manager put him out there. Alright, the mistakes were horrendous but the evidence that Klopp amassed to justify Karius as No. 1 has always been weak and it's not like Karius has ever mouthed off or pretended to be anything other than what he is, an ordinary, young keeper, although I'm sure in his own mind he's tried to maintain the belief he can be world-class. I see him as a victim of circumstance and the club/Klopp need to stop with this wait it out kind of attitude with certain positions and bite the bullet and invest in true quality, otherwise the excellent parts of what he is achieving right now will be consistently and forever undermined.

Couldn't disagree more on that. You've said it highlighting Karius but what about Milner, Hendo, Oxlade, etc?

I applaud the way he gives players a chance. I don't want a Guardiola or Mourinho type cheque book manager!

 

[RogerisontheHunt]

Of course he can bounce back. Lots of players have had extremely poor moments in their career and gone on to become better. Beckham, Seaman, Rooney, etc.

It's one game. Granted it was very high profile game but it's still just one game.

I don't see him leaving Liverpool this summer and I don't think Klopp will have a sudden change of mind based on that one game either. Only time will tell if he's the long term option or not but Klopp will already know!

Edit... worse possible time to have such a stinker though; world stage, everyone watching and he's got the whole summer to think about it before being able to pay his next match.

The difference between those players and Karius was that were far better players.

Lets be honest Karius isn't a great player, nor will he ever be. He's a decent player, that could be above average and be playing for a team that harbours EL ambitions. I do not believe he will ever be of the standard for a title winning team or even a later stage CL team.
Whilst the mistakes were clearly not intentional from him, they were his mistakes. In both situations no-one else can be blamed for the eventual goals. I would question anyones ability if they were to make such calamitous mistakes and question if they were truly were good enough and in this case I believe the answer is 'he is not good enough'.

I do wonder if the owners, who were in attendance, might look to force the issue. They are business men who come from an American sport background where success is demanded and loyalty and sentimentality are way down on the list. Losing a major final is bad enough for business, losing in such a manner is worse.

 

[The IncREDibles]

Couldn't disagree more on that. You've said it highlighting Karius but what about Milner, Hendo, Oxlade, etc?

I applaud the way he gives players a chance. I don't want a Guardiola or Mourinho type cheque book manager!

But he hadn't stuck with Karius in the same way as Hendo, Milner or Ox. He kept rotating between Mignolet and Karius for 18 months until finally he settled on Karius through necessity from Mignolet's most recent howler and the reluctance to sign a keeper.

Not only did the rotation not help anyone, it's also meant its taken 2 years to fully evaluate both keepers.

 

[Zanjinho]

The difference between those players and Karius was that were far better players.

Lets be honest Karius isn't a great player, nor will he ever be. He's a decent player, that could be above average and be playing for a team that harbours EL ambitions. I do not believe he will ever be of the standard for a title winning team or even a later stage CL team.
Whilst the mistakes were clearly not intentional from him, they were his mistakes. In both situations no-one else can be blamed for the eventual goals. I would question anyones ability if they were to make such calamitous mistakes and question if they were truly were good enough and in this case I believe the answer is 'he is not good enough'.

I do wonder if the owners, who were in attendance, might look to force the issue. They are business men who come from an American sport background where success is demanded and loyalty and sentimentality are way down on the list. Losing a major final is bad enough for business, losing in such a manner is worse.

The incidents those players experienced help make them better players.

I think you're right, Karius isn't at the same level but it's too early to really know imo. He's never going to be world class but then, he wasn't prior to yesterday either.

 

[Zanjinho]

But he hadn't stuck with Karius in the same way as Hendo, Milner or Ox. He kept rotating between Mignolet and Karius for 18 months until finally he settled on Karius through necessity from Mignolet's most recent howler and the reluctance to sign a keeper.

Not only did the rotation not help anyone, it's also meant its taken 2 years to fully evaluate both keepers.

Well, it did help, evidenced by the clear improved in Karius for the second half of the season (ignoring yesterday).

We all knew before the final that Karius wasn't good enough. The battering of him as a result of yesterday's final is over the top imo (didn't think I'd say that considering how bad the two **** ups were either)

 

[HugoEkitikeN01]

Loris Karius has not get the experience of Simon Mignolet I believe Jurgen Klopp should have kept Simon Mignolet as
first choice.

 

[lfcpower]

Couldn't disagree more on that. You've said it highlighting Karius but what about Milner, Hendo, Oxlade, etc?

I applaud the way he gives players a chance. I don't want a Guardiola or Mourinho type cheque book manager!

Chamberlain looked way better than he did at Arsenal as soon as he came into our first team and then just got better

You think Henderson and Milner actually contributed anything positive on Saturday night ??