Shergs have you ever known me to wriggle out of a "discussion" with you? I just felt it wasnt the time to "Discuss" the merits of either horse. Dream Ahead won fair and square.
No point arguing with Shergar with this stuff. As for Goldikova, it says a lot that even now she's on the wane at 6, she's still hardly disgracing herself in races. Hope she has one last hurrah at Churchill Downs anyway.
I see that this was old Dream Ahead's 5th Group 1 win. A remarkable achievement given that he still hasn’t completed his 2nd season on the racecourse (has actually won 1 more ‘top table’ race than his contemporary Frankel). Great pieces of race planning by his trainer, old boy Simcock, to have achieved this feat. As a wise old sage once told me training a racehorse is easy (you only after all have to give it a few carrots and canter the beast at three-quarters speed up a steep hill most days) it’s selecting the right race that is the real skill. Simcock seems to have got this art in spades along with such other training luminaries as John Gosden, that old rogue Prescott, Mr Nicholls and, of course, the best of the bunch, the forum’s favourite, Mr Henderson. Meanwhile, got to agree with Shergar re Goldikova. I think some are rather lazily prescribing ‘Best Mate Syndrome’ over her race career. Just because horse x wins race x doesn’t make them a great horse! There is a lot more to consider when handing over the tag ‘great’ than simply what race the horse won you need to go into far greater depth than that.
Winning of races, running well even in defeat and never shirking a challenge makes a great horse in my opinion, and I think Goldikova ticks all those boxes. And I think winning 14 G1s is a pretty impressive achievement, they were good races and there was nothing 'mickey mouse' about them (but then Shergar thinks all racing outside the UK is rubbish seemingly). She may not be a Brigadier Gerard, but she's got nothing to prove to anyone.
I say old boy, surely you've just destroyed your own finely crafted argument there? You state Dream Ahead has won more G1s than Frankel and then argue it's not about horse x winning race y???? Dream Ahead is a G1 winning sprinter aged 3, Goldikova is a G1 winning miler aged 6. The 7F on lively going obviously favoured the 3YO sprinter today - a furlong further and Goldikova would have won, she was coming back at Dream Ahead at the line. Amazed they went for the 7F race with Goldikova to be honest. Mind you, having beaten the likes of Hoof It and Bated Breath, Dream Ahead was clearly the class horse of the race today BTW I'm not saying Goldikova is a "great" - I just think she is being unfairly criticised. She has been a tremendously consistent filly over a mile and it will be a long time before we see another filly achieve what she has.
Oddog...Dream Ahead is all class, he is an exceptionally talented horse. I still believe that was knowere near his best in the Dewhurst, and had the same horse that destroyed a top class Middle Park field shown up, then Dream Ahead could have realy given Frankel a race that day. It was to soon after the Middle Park. Don't start making excuses over the trip, Goldikova was a G1 winner over 7f going into todays race, DA wasn't, so those excuses don't wash with me. Goldikova was only coming back because DA was hanging all over the track
7F has never been Goldikova's trip - this was her 3rd run in the Foret and her 2nd defeat - her only runs over 7F ever. She is a miler. Dream Ahead is a 6-7F horse but needs goodish ground to get the 7th furlong - as you say DA was hanging all over the track today because he was all out at the limits of his stamina. He couldn't go with Frankel over 7F on good/soft in the Dewhurst and was never going to win the St James Palace over a mile. If he runs again he will most likely stick at 6F, maybe 7 on anything quicker than good but you will never see him at a mile again.
Oddog....Dream Ahead was hanging all over the track in the Sprint Cup, just like he did today against Goldikova, and that was over 6f. So I assume he must have been at the limit of his stamina that day aswell, despite the fact we now know he stays 7fs. Dream Ahead has his quirks, he is far from straightforward. When he hits the front he hangs, watch the Middle Park, where he was all over the place, despite winning easily. That is what makes him such a special horse, he can mess around in races yet still beat top quality opposition. As for the Dewhurst, do me a favour, DA was beaten that day by the likes of Roderic O'Conor and Glor Na Mara (still a maiden) even if he didn't fully stay, then his class would have seen him beat those 2. It was to soon after the Middle Park for DA, had he been on song, he would have given Frankel a great race, no doubt about it. You can ignore the St Jame's's Palace run, he was making his seasonal debut against horses like Frankel who already had 2 runs under there belt, having said that hd still finished 5th, so if he doesn't truly stay 7 then there is no way he would have been 5th in that race over a mile
I actually agree with Shergar that Goldikova is by far and away not the best horse i have seen. She is not even the best mare. But that does not in any way detract from her brilliant attributes which as far as i'm concerned are her consistency and longevity. She has given us so much enjoyment as her 14 G1 victories testify. What i find irritating is how Shergar insists on demeaning her achievements saying that she has only beaten useless horses and everytime she faces a decent horses she loses. She might get found out against the very best but at the end of the day no other horse has managed three back to back wins in that 'mickey mouse' race they call the Breeder's Cup Mile!!!!
It was totally predictable that victory for Dream Ahead would see KS extolling him as the class act whilst the horse that he beat in a photo is ordinary even though she has raced for four seasons and won fourteen Group 1 races. Goldikova’s career has exhibited a level of consistency that Dream Ahead can only dream about. If the three-year-old is such a class act then those rubbish performances he has turned in were just my imagination. Prix Maurice De Gheest video anyone?
QM.....At the end of Goldikova's 3yo season she had 2 G1 Victory's to her name, Dream Ahead now has 5, and if DA wasn't so valuable as a stallion he could easily top Goldikova's G1 tally
Clearly you are now the recognised breeding expert on this forum, perhaps you could explain to those of us that are not how Dream Ahead (Diktat ex. Land Of Dreams) is “valuable as a stallion”. Diktat himself is in such demand that he now stands in Spain and there is nothing exceptional in the distaff pedigree. Given the number of Group 1 races over six and seven furlongs in the racing calendar and Dream Ahead’s miserable showing in several of those events this season, the idea that he would win ten more in three seasons seems more than a little fanciful. If the July Cup were run at a crawl for the next three years, he could possible collect that in a sprint to the line for three of them.
I sense the need for a reminder on some expert form analysis tuition. You amateurs just don't understand form do you.
