OK, but Bear, I watched the game back... I just didn't see Gyokeres making intelligent runs off the ball, turning defenders, spinning them or running in behind. If he's not moving effectively then the ball is going to go to feet. I also don;t think he has the pace to really acre defenders - there were a couple of moments where he had the chance to stretch his legs in the Liverpool game and the defender easily caught him.
To be fair to Gyokeres, I think he's still getting up to speed with the pace of the PL Also remember, this guy hasn't really had a pre season to get used to a new club and the methods. It's another game under his belt, but I think we need to be patient. Something that football fans seem always to be in short supply of.
Jay, its because scoring record numbers of goals doesn't mean you are more efficient at scoring goals, a lot of the goals we scored were goals when the games were already dead, winning 5-0 doesn't give us more points than winning 2-0, but if we win 3 games on the trot 5-0 against mediocre competition, it still has the same point value as winning 3 difficult games 1-0 or 2-1. The latter is the point I want to make. We will only win the big prizes if we can score in and win the key games. What are key games ? Games where we are dropping points, scoring goals that snatches a draw instead of a defeat or a win instead of a draw. Scoring in cup games to get us through to the next round. All too often we don't score in key games, that as why we have done so poorly in the cup competitions with Arteta. Havertz is too hit n miss, he is just as likely to miss the target as he is to hit it when through on goal. We needed a more reliable goal scorer, we needed a CF who is more likely to make the runs that get on the ends of crosses we continually sling in and never have nobody in the box to convert. Thats why we all wanted a more traditional CF, thats why we needed a better finisher than Havertz. And for all the talk about consecutive record goals - they won us nothing !!! Scoring when it matters is far more important than just scoring lots of goals.
When we broke our record we scored 4+ goals in 9 games - same as City did when they won the title that year. We didn't win that year because City were simply better - just. That doesn't mean we have to rip up a record goal scoring system and get a 'traditional striker'. We didn't break our goal scoring record for any other reason than we were a brilliant attacking force over the season. How is it that Havertz was able to go through a spell of 6 months in that season when he moved to striker and be the top scorer in that time in the entire PL? He's only played as striker in two half seasons for us and in that time scored 22 goals and assisted 11 times (PL alone).
Christ alive. A Gyokeres with next to no pre-season or match fitness made one early run that was timed perfectly and Martinelli just ran the ball off the pitch. And our system 2 years ago will not work as effectively now. Over the past two years, more and more teams have sat with deeper and deeper blocks against us. What worked 2-3 years ago was stopping being so effective. Let Zubi and Gyokeres settle in and let Eze, Odegaard and Saka play together. I mean, I can whinge, but **** me. He's got the squad now, but you can't whinge yet. Wait until we're out of every trophy before we talk about replacing Arteta.
Been on holiday for the last week in Morocco and only just got back. A slender 1-0 loss to the reigning Champions on their turf is not a disgrace. But I wasn't impressed with the performance or the setup. And whilst Liverpool weren't great either, I still believe we should have tried to attack and create more chances, rather than adopting an overly cautious approach for most of the game. My issue with Arteta is the way he approaches these games away from home - it's about conservation, defensive resilience, set-pieces and 'controlling' the game from a ball retention perspective. Now, that's fine if you adopt this approach for some of the match and then decide to go more attacking as the game goes on, but he took too long to bring on Eze and Odegaard. And why did Nwaneri go 0 minutes? Was very surprised to see Dowman get mins ahead of him. In any case, they should have been brought on 10 minutes earlier. It appears like there's too much focus on OOP (out of possession) work than IP (in possession) work. Liverpool's defence has looked very vulnerable against Bournemouth and a 10-man Newcastle, yet they looked very comfortable against us. 1 shot on target the entire match is an abomination, and that's a result of the 'defensive' mindset instilled into the team by the manager. It is by design. If he chooses to continue playing like this moving forward, the end result is going to be the same - we will win nothing and watch other teams usurp us. You don't get endless opportunities to win the league, but it's like we're acting as if we're always going to be up there/always going to have a chance. Football doesn't work that way. You either seize the moment or you don't. That performance and result has done nothing to change my 'Arteta-scepticism' I'm afraid. Not good enough and he needs to do better.
My main concern is that we waste 75% of our possession doing absolutely nothing with the ball - possession for possession sake. It was noticeable how we were more forward looking at 1-0 down. Unsuccessfully as it turned out, but i suspect if you totalled the minutes of our possession in a game where we were actually trying to score it would be less than 5 minutes in the 90.
I agree with you. But this has happened so many times in so many matches that it's a recurring consequence of the manager's instructions. I'm putting this mainly on the manager because I believe the true attacking and creative potential of this team is being stifled through what Arteta is trying to do. He is prioritising control and defensive solidity over expressive, fluid football.
It's definitely planned. To a large extent it has worked in big games - we have a good record in against the bigger teams. I hate to see it at home , especially against the smaller teams. But we seem to always do it. The backlash over the approach vs Liverpool will , i hope, shake things up a bit. It really was unacceptable.
Jay, in the 2023/24 season City failed to score in 3 games, we failed in 5 and therein lies the problem and its what I am talking about. At the top end the margins are very small, we lost out by a single point, 5 games we couldn't score in, a fat lot of good scoring 4 or more fives times did for us ! I would prefer a better spread of goals and scoring when it matters. You get no argument from me about Havertz when he got pushed up top, for a good 8 months he was as good as any striker in the world, but the problem with Havertz is his wayward finishing. You have good, great and elite level finishing, Henry and RVP, for example are elite, Auba and Sanchez were great, I wouldn't put Havertz as good, he is mediocre and thats my problem with him. When chances are at a premium, in the tight or big games, you wouldn't bet your house that Havertz would score given a very good chance, you would with Sanchez, Auba, Henry and RVP.
To be fair (and I don't like Arteta at all), Arteta's record against the big teams is the best its been in the Emirates era for us, so kudos for that. I don't think he has been overly negative up until now, in the big games, in fact its something I have been crying out for, for the longest time, lets do to them what they do to us, sit deep and let them have the ball, be compact and defensively strong, have faith on your attack that they will put away the 2 or 3 good chances they make. Problem is we are seeing this focus on endless passing, mostly pointless passing and a lack of real attacking intent and bravery in a few games now. Players don't want to play that high risk progressive pass, its all 99% safety passes.
I am in agreement with you that there are better finishers than Havertz - no argument. He's average at finishing - which the numbers back up. This is why the expectations are on Gyokeres - I don't want to hear about him not getting chances - I want to see him finishing the chances we were already creating at a higher rate. Thats why more goals as a team and the title are the expectations for him.
Thats fair enough, but you also need to be realistic and acknowledge chances are not being created, you cannot just outright ignore that. We saw against Leeds thee goal he conjured out of nothing, that sort of play is bread and butter for Gyokeres, wide run, beat one or 2 defenders, bury the shot in the back of the net. Thats his strength. If we are going to take all day to get the ball forward his other strength is receiving the ball in the box back to goal - turn - shot. Also through balls. I've not seen us provide either option to Gyokeres, I can't even remember the last time we played a through ball to a striker.
The goal vs Leeds was not conjured out of nothing - it was some very good play by Gyokeres to cut in and beat a couple of players for sure, but the pass onto his run was also excellent and an example of how quick thinking and fast execution can open up play. Chances created are not a one way thing when it comes to a striker. Haaland is a good example of a striker who helps the team create chances - not because he is creative (far from it) - but because he makes absolutely brilliant runs... his movement off the ball is second to none. That is why he scores a lot of goals. Strikers need to move well off the ball otherwise they are easy to defend and the team will find it impossible to create a lot of chances for that striker. Gyokeres against Liverpool was not good. He drifted into our own half too often and spent most of his time wide left. That is my biggest criticism of him in that game - he didn't really even try to get in behind, so who is going to be playing through balls to him? I want to see him spinning in behind defenders and making runs and to keep doing it even if the ball doesn't come. Havertz movement off the ball is excellent by the way (when we are in possession) - not just for himself, but dragging defenders all over the place to open spaces for others. He's also one of the best at closing down defenders with a forward press and creating turnovers - a vital part of the modern game that leads to chances as it breaks the standard possession play of trying to break down a defence. Gyokeres needs to show he has the full game that we need - it's not simply about him standing in the penalty box so he can turn and shoot or waiting to have a chance created for him. We're toast - and so is he at this level - if that's all he has.
